# of brez's allowed in wotlk raids?

[Angarin]

Hey I'm raiding with an 80 guild frequently and we havent hit the situation where we've reached the limit of brezes because well...we either dont die or dont need to rez more than 1 person.

I'm also in a 70 raiding guild and our limit in 25m and 10m is 1 person per raid which bites but oh well.

Is the number still 1 for 10m and 3 for 25m? Or is it just 1 for each like 70 content?

Thanks

[Lilcheeks]

End of wotlk it was 3 for 25m... so you'll never hit the limit since no one ever dies.

[Angarin]

End of wotlk it was 3 for 25m... so you'll never hit the limit since no one ever dies.

Is this for both icc/rs? Because I know naxx/ulduar are having lockout issues where you go into 25m and then cannot go into 10m til reset. This believes me to think that brez's in these instances may be setup like 70 content is. If not please feel free to correct me

[Azerate]

Yes, 1 per 10man 3 per 25man raid. Not really sure about differences between new raids and old content, dont see why would it be any different than in cata raids. Also it's not an "issue" that you are not able to enter 10man ulduar/naxx after clearing 25man. It's the new lockout introduced in 4.0.1.

[I King I]

Yes, 1 per 10man 3 per 25man raid. Not really sure about differences between new raids and old content, dont see why would it be any different than in cata raids. Also it's not an "issue" that you are not able to enter 10man ulduar/naxx after clearing 25man. It's the new lockout introduced in 4.0.1.

The new lockout system only affects ICC/RS and up.

[Vinhz]

The new lockout system only affects ICC/RS and up.

wrong. they changed it long ago

[Tradu]

wrong. they changed it long ago

Indeed, the ICC/RS-only thing was 4.0.1, I believe, and in 4.0.3 or 4.0.3a all raids got affected by it.

[Angarin]

Yes, 1 per 10man 3 per 25man raid. Not really sure about differences between new raids and old content, dont see why would it be any different than in cata raids. Also it's not an "issue" that you are not able to enter 10man ulduar/naxx after clearing 25man. It's the new lockout introduced in 4.0.1.

So your saying we can do 25m naxx/ulduar then go do a fresh naxx/ulduar right afterwards just like pre-cata? I've heard otherwise but we're worried this is the issue

What I "specifically" heard from people doing achievement runs was that they would enter naxxramas in 25m doing some achievements. Some people would leave making it impossible to do achieves on 25m so they converted to 10m. After they converted they would either

A) Not be able to enter the instance

B) Be locked the same progression they were as in 25m

Option B is the way new cata lockouts work if you dont do it in heroic mode. But I have unconfirmed notice in wotlk besides icc/rs

[Alvito]

You are talking about raid lock outs/ids and battle rezzes like they are the same or connected they are not. As far as battle rez goes you get 1 in 10 3 in 25 since the cata changes went live with 4.0. For raid ids or lock outs icc heroics or rs heroics work differently then current raids do now if you do one heroic boss in icc then you cannot share that id with ppl that already had one even if they werent as far in the run.

[I King I]

wrong. they changed it long ago

Wrong. no they didnt.


Edit: You guys can say whatever you want but i did naxx 10/25 2 weeks ago the same day.

[Alvito]

10 and 25 man are on the same id even for Wrath runs so if you do a 10 man naxx you cant do a 25 after its over.

[Angarin]

Wrong. no they didnt.


Edit: You guys can say whatever you want but i did naxx 10/25 2 weeks ago the same day.

See this kind of debate I cant figure out. I'm tempted to just get on my 85 pally grab 5-10 guildies, run naxx 25 then go in and see if the same boss is there in naxx 10...Or I guess I could kill a boss in naxx 10 with a few guildies and then clear trash to see if its there in 25m


If your going to debate about this please be more clear/specific so we can identify whos the true person here

[Vinhz]

Wrong. no they didnt.


Edit: You guys can say whatever you want but i did naxx 10/25 2 weeks ago the same day.

wrong. they did
i got saved to a OS 25 and VoA 25 while farming mounts and wasn't able to do the 10 man versions of those raids anymore

[Angarin]

For the love of god someone provide proof

[Tradu]

10 and 25man share a lockout, thats how its been for quite some time now.

[Vinhz]

Almost six months ago we announced that Cataclysm raids were being redesigned to make both raid sizes the same difficulty, drop the same quality of loot, and exist in the same lockout. This evolution in raid philosophy is built on the belief that the size of your raiding group should be a choice based solely on what’s more fun and enjoyable for you, and that you should not have to complete the same raiding content twice in a week to maximize your character’s progression. These systems are the culmination of a great deal of design and player feedback from the last few years. With the release of the 4.0.1 patch, the new Flexible Raid Lock system will debut in Icecrown Citadel and The Ruby Sanctum.



With the Flexible Raid Lock system, instead of being locked to a specific raid size or raid group, each character will have the opportunity to defeat each raid encounter once a week. You could kill Lord Marrowgar and Lady Deathwhisper with a 10-player raid on Wednesday, join a 25-player raid to kill Festergut and Rotface on Thursday, and then lead a completely new 10-player raid to kill The Lich King on Friday. Every raid has a list of encounters associated with the zone. For example, Icecrown Citadel has twelve encounters. After you defeat Lord Marrowgar, you can open up your character’s raid information dialog and see the list of encounters in Icecrown Citadel with Marrowgar marked as defeated. You may no longer fight Lord Marrowgar with any raid size or difficulty until the weekly raid reset for your region occurs.

Another key change is that if you join someone else’s raid in progress, you are no longer locked to that raid after merely zoning in. Your raid status will only change when a boss is defeated, at which point it will be updated to reflect the state of the instance in which you are currently participating. So, let’s say you have killed the first four bosses of Icecrown Citadel, and you then join a raid that has defeated the first four encounters, as well as Festergut and Rotface. The dialog that displays upon entering Icecrown Citadel will show that the raid has defeated 6 of 12 encounters. If you help them defeat Professor Putricide, then you would be marked as having defeated not only Professor Putricide for the week, but also Festergut and Rotface. If instead after joining the raid you then proceeded to wipe ten times to Professor Putricide, you could leave the raid with only the first four bosses marked as completed.

To help communicate to players which bosses are dead in the raid leader’s raid, there is new functionality to link in chat a list of the encounters the raid has defeated. So before you join a raid, you can see what they’ve already defeated. If a raid leader advertises in chat that she needs another healer for an 8/12 Icecrown Citadel run, you can see precisely which bosses are still available to fight. If you were only looking for that one item from Queen Lana’thel that never drops for you and this raid already defeated her, you will know not to join that raid.

Let’s look at another example of the Flexible Raid Lock system. A guild schedules three nights for 25-player Icecrown Citadel raiding on Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday. On Wednesday, the raid defeats Lord Marrowgar, Lady Deathwhisper, Icecrown Gunship Battle, and Saurfang. On Thursday, five people cancel their raid attendance due to real life emergencies. The raid leader knows that if he cancels Thursday raiding, there’s little chance they’ll have enough time on Saturday to defeat the other eight bosses in Icecrown Citadel. So he splits the remaining 20 Thursday raiders into two 10-player raids. Each new raid enters Icecrown Citadel and defeats Rotface, Festergut, Blood Council, and Valithria Dreamwalker. The next Saturday with all 25 players online, they reform as a 25-player raid and enter Icecrown Citadel once more. Only Professor Putricide, Queen Lana’thel, Sindragosa, and The Lich King remain. After a tough fight, the Lich King falls and everybody celebrates. Without the Flexible Raid Lock system the entire raid probably would have missed out on a night of raiding, and likely would not have reached the Lich King.

While players can freely move between raids of different sizes in normal difficulty, there are some additional rules for Heroic difficulty. If a 10- or 25-player raid defeats a boss on Heroic difficulty, then those players may now only raid additional Heroic encounters with that specific raid. If your Heroic 25-player raid defeats the first four bosses of Icecrown Citadel on Heroic, then they may not split up into two 10-player raids and continue to fight in Heroic difficulty. You may also not join someone else’s raid if they have defeated a Heroic encounter.

But let’s say you are a member of a Heroic raid in Icecrown Citadel, and after killing Lord Marrowgar on Heroic you have Internet connection issues that prevent you from raiding for two nights. During those two nights, the rest of the raid kills everything. Without the Flexible Raid Lock system, you would be done with raiding Icecrown Citadel for the week. Ouch. With the Flexible Raid Lock system, you can join someone else’s raid as long as they are doing Normal difficulty. This would at least give you the opportunity to earn your Justice Points for the week. If this raid attempted to switch to Heroic difficulty for Icecrown Gunship Battle with you in the raid, the raid leader would receive an error message stating that she cannot change to Heroic, because someone in the raid (i.e., you) is already locked to a different Heroic instance.

All of the new Cataclysm raids will feature the Flexible Raid Lock and Dynamic Difficulty systems, and when the Cataclysm occurs the other Wrath of the Lich King raids will also have these features. It’s important to note that this system doesn’t affect Heroic dungeons, they will work as they always have. We look forward to feedback for this new system after 4.0.1 is released. As a reminder, Icecrown Citadel and The Ruby Sanctum are the only two raids that support the Flexible Raid Lock until the Cataclysm occurs.

The new lockout system only affects ICC/RS and up.

+1 for me I guess

[Tradu]

Found a couple of websites with the quotes, they aren't on the official forums anymore, because they changed to the new battle.net forums.

WoW Insider

Ten Ton Hammer

[Angarin]

Almost six months ago we announced that Cataclysm raids were being redesigned to make both raid sizes the same difficulty, drop the same quality of loot, and exist in the same lockout. This evolution in raid philosophy is built on the belief that the size of your raiding group should be a choice based solely on what’s more fun and enjoyable for you, and that you should not have to complete the same raiding content twice in a week to maximize your character’s progression. These systems are the culmination of a great deal of design and player feedback from the last few years. With the release of the 4.0.1 patch, the new Flexible Raid Lock system will debut in Icecrown Citadel and The Ruby Sanctum.



With the Flexible Raid Lock system, instead of being locked to a specific raid size or raid group, each character will have the opportunity to defeat each raid encounter once a week. You could kill Lord Marrowgar and Lady Deathwhisper with a 10-player raid on Wednesday, join a 25-player raid to kill Festergut and Rotface on Thursday, and then lead a completely new 10-player raid to kill The Lich King on Friday. Every raid has a list of encounters associated with the zone. For example, Icecrown Citadel has twelve encounters. After you defeat Lord Marrowgar, you can open up your character’s raid information dialog and see the list of encounters in Icecrown Citadel with Marrowgar marked as defeated. You may no longer fight Lord Marrowgar with any raid size or difficulty until the weekly raid reset for your region occurs.

Another key change is that if you join someone else’s raid in progress, you are no longer locked to that raid after merely zoning in. Your raid status will only change when a boss is defeated, at which point it will be updated to reflect the state of the instance in which you are currently participating. So, let’s say you have killed the first four bosses of Icecrown Citadel, and you then join a raid that has defeated the first four encounters, as well as Festergut and Rotface. The dialog that displays upon entering Icecrown Citadel will show that the raid has defeated 6 of 12 encounters. If you help them defeat Professor Putricide, then you would be marked as having defeated not only Professor Putricide for the week, but also Festergut and Rotface. If instead after joining the raid you then proceeded to wipe ten times to Professor Putricide, you could leave the raid with only the first four bosses marked as completed.

To help communicate to players which bosses are dead in the raid leader’s raid, there is new functionality to link in chat a list of the encounters the raid has defeated. So before you join a raid, you can see what they’ve already defeated. If a raid leader advertises in chat that she needs another healer for an 8/12 Icecrown Citadel run, you can see precisely which bosses are still available to fight. If you were only looking for that one item from Queen Lana’thel that never drops for you and this raid already defeated her, you will know not to join that raid.

Let’s look at another example of the Flexible Raid Lock system. A guild schedules three nights for 25-player Icecrown Citadel raiding on Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday. On Wednesday, the raid defeats Lord Marrowgar, Lady Deathwhisper, Icecrown Gunship Battle, and Saurfang. On Thursday, five people cancel their raid attendance due to real life emergencies. The raid leader knows that if he cancels Thursday raiding, there’s little chance they’ll have enough time on Saturday to defeat the other eight bosses in Icecrown Citadel. So he splits the remaining 20 Thursday raiders into two 10-player raids. Each new raid enters Icecrown Citadel and defeats Rotface, Festergut, Blood Council, and Valithria Dreamwalker. The next Saturday with all 25 players online, they reform as a 25-player raid and enter Icecrown Citadel once more. Only Professor Putricide, Queen Lana’thel, Sindragosa, and The Lich King remain. After a tough fight, the Lich King falls and everybody celebrates. Without the Flexible Raid Lock system the entire raid probably would have missed out on a night of raiding, and likely would not have reached the Lich King.

While players can freely move between raids of different sizes in normal difficulty, there are some additional rules for Heroic difficulty. If a 10- or 25-player raid defeats a boss on Heroic difficulty, then those players may now only raid additional Heroic encounters with that specific raid. If your Heroic 25-player raid defeats the first four bosses of Icecrown Citadel on Heroic, then they may not split up into two 10-player raids and continue to fight in Heroic difficulty. You may also not join someone else’s raid if they have defeated a Heroic encounter.

But let’s say you are a member of a Heroic raid in Icecrown Citadel, and after killing Lord Marrowgar on Heroic you have Internet connection issues that prevent you from raiding for two nights. During those two nights, the rest of the raid kills everything. Without the Flexible Raid Lock system, you would be done with raiding Icecrown Citadel for the week. Ouch. With the Flexible Raid Lock system, you can join someone else’s raid as long as they are doing Normal difficulty. This would at least give you the opportunity to earn your Justice Points for the week. If this raid attempted to switch to Heroic difficulty for Icecrown Gunship Battle with you in the raid, the raid leader would receive an error message stating that she cannot change to Heroic, because someone in the raid (i.e., you) is already locked to a different Heroic instance.

All of the new Cataclysm raids will feature the Flexible Raid Lock and Dynamic Difficulty systems, and when the Cataclysm occurs the other Wrath of the Lich King raids will also have these features. It’s important to note that this system doesn’t affect Heroic dungeons, they will work as they always have. We look forward to feedback for this new system after 4.0.1 is released. As a reminder, Icecrown Citadel and The Ruby Sanctum are the only two raids that support the Flexible Raid Lock until the Cataclysm occurs.




+1 for me I guess

Yes +1 for you, thank you