1. #28821
    Quote Originally Posted by Belize View Post
    I was about to ask why the wildlings would go back North of the Wall, but then there's that passing shot of a fern growing in the snow.


    Fuck you.
    hey no WW around anymore , it's free real estate for the king beyond the wall

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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    according to D&D - what if his real goal was always from begining 3 eyed raven nothing else.

    ye ye i know tinfoil hat
    He tried to give us a good ending

  2. #28822
    Quote Originally Posted by Dystemper View Post
    All these gaffs are proof this season was rushed and the show runners just didnt give a shit. That scene looked like a test shoot and they just said fuck it lets roll with it. Also that had to be the shortest Winter in history of Westeros .
    Dumb and dumber obviously stopped giving a shit about this show and just rushed to finish it as soon as they got the starwars disney deal, they see themself as the second coming of jesus when it comes to writing when they had all the book material and Georges help to make the first seasons

  3. #28823
    The Undying freefolk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deuse View Post
    Where did Jon even get a Sai? I've never seen a dagger like this on the entire show.



    You can't stab a fashionable girl with an unfashionable knife, it would clash.
    .

    "This will be a fight against overwhelming odds from which survival cannot be expected. We will do what damage we can."

    -- Capt. Copeland

  4. #28824
    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    because? the north is bigger than all of the other kingdoms combined? how is that hard to understand really? it was established many seasons ago and in the books as well...
    My point is that there's pretty much zero incentive for anyone to be in this alliance, that's all.

  5. #28825
    Love the show. Hated the finale.

    Jon - He was in love with Dany. He decided to kill her after only talking to her for approximately 3 minutes to decide if she was crazy (Tyrion, Sansa, Arya didn't help him to think otherwise). Did she just rampage a city. Yes. Did she feel bad about it? Not really. Did he supposedly love her? Yes,... Well maybe. I think it was worth more than a 3 minute conversation to decide her fate. Him asking her, "What about the other people who think they know what is good?" And her reply of, "They don't get to choose." She is right. Are they going to go around to every lord and lady of the realm to ask their opinions?
    Jon reminds me of the Walking Dead when Rick has his questions:
    1. How many walkers you killed?
    2. How many people you killed?
    3. Why?
    At the very least, Jon could have asked Dany these questions. Dany's answers:
    1. Bout a million.
    2. Bout a million.
    3. Cause they sought refuge with Cercei. I heard bells. Jorah died. Missandei got murdered. Euron killed my baby. I lost control.
    This strange conversation would still have been better than, "How do you know it will be good?"
    The only redeeming thing about Jon is that he gets his dog back, and he gets to hang out with Tormund.

    Dany - Torching the city was totally out of character for her. Just listen to the first minute and a half of this video from season 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvBXx2MZA5Q
    Is she a killer? Yes - to her enemies, she has no mercy. But it is a huge stretch to make us believe she thinks of all women and children as enemies that are inside of King's Landing. They are peasants. She has a dragon. Of course they are going to be scared and want some place to hide. It is just ridiculous. D&D wanted some shocker to keep people talking and have a big wow moment of the finale. Like killing Jack at the end of Titanic - there was definitely room on that raft for him, but to get a shock out of the audience - kill him.

    Grey Worm - He just releases Jon to go north to the wall (which was destroyed) to protect the realm from whitewalkers (which were destroyed). Worm literally just killed soldiers in the street because they were the queen's enemies. Jon killed the queen. That qualifies as an enemy to the queen. Jon would have been dragged behind a Dothraki horse as a meat crayon. Also, he is ok with Tyrion getting to go free as hand of Bran? After committing treason on his Queen - riiiight.

    Drogon - At the very least they could have had Drogon blast Jon with fire. Did Jon have the fire immunity like Dany? Maybe. We will never know. At the least he could have tried. Jon just killed Drogon's mom. So he gets mad and burns the throne. Drogon would have totally ate Jon. I see a lot of excuses saying that Drogon knew his mom was crazy and that Jon did the right thing. Drogon is a dragon, and dragons are like super smart, right? Drogon is a dragon, and dragons can also be super crazy and evil. Drogon was the one spewing explosive fire at the women, children, and old men. If anyone went crazy - it's Drogon. Would he fly off to roam the earth like Kane from Kung Fu? Maybe, but I think he would torch the rest of the humans in King's Landing first.

    Arya - "I know a killer when I see one." What was the first clue? Dany literally just killed 1,000,??? people. Worst line in the whole series ( I didn't mind the bad poosey line). And now she is going to sail west, to where only 2 people in history have been known to have gone and lived. Good luck. Also, why was she invited to the Dragonpit? Bodyguard to Bran? Killer of the Night King? That made no sense.

    Sansa - So now you are queen of the north. And your brother, Bran, the King of the south just is ok with it. No big deal. You state that the north will never bend the knee to the south. Not even if its a Stark? What difference does it make if the Stark is sitting in King's Landing or in Winterfell? Is she saying that even if she were Queen of all the realms, that the north would not follow her if she sat in King's Landing? Sound like she just wants to be queen, and that is an excuse.

    Edmure Tully - Sansa telling him to sit down. He should have said, "Bitch please. What have you done? You hid in the crypts at Winterfell." The writers wrote his character like a scene out of Meet the Fockers. This scene was so out of place it was cringe-worthy.

    Brienne - Now the leader of the white cloaks. The main protector of the king. Even though she swore and allegiance to Sansa, who is Queen of the realm next door. Guess she forgot that Sansa will also need a protector.

    Dorne - They are ok with Bran being the King. And they will follow him. They don't know anything about Bran. The kid has never been south of Winterfell yet they supposedly are ok with him leading the whole realm?

    Bran - Speaking of Bran. He's the three eyed raven. And everyone is ready to follow his lead. Right? Right. Wait.... What is a three eyed raven? Literally no one knows what the heck a three eyed raven is except maybe Tyrion. All they see is a teenage boy in a wheelchair who is ridiculously socially awkward. At least Edmure can get up and give a speech to tell everyone why he should be king.

    Bronn - Talking brothels when the whole city just got burned down. How many prostitutes are even left in the city? He is master of coin. Bran is ok with that? Who elected him? Tyrion I suppose?

    Sam - He is head maester now? He literally only went to the Citadel and scrubbed chamber pots. And stole some books. He did cure Jorah though so I guess that qualifies him as the chief maester of the realm, ready to serve the King.

    Dothraki - Guess they get to go back to their rapin and pillaging across the countryside. The only thing keeping this murderous bunch at bay was Dany. And now they are in Westeros, which is ripe for the picking. They will choose their own leader, and do their own thing. They won't be following Grey Worm to some island.
    Last edited by maulgryve; 2019-05-21 at 02:53 PM.

  6. #28826
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    He went exactly where he wanted to be.
    He never knew what the fuck he wanted

  7. #28827
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    He doesn't do rash things, like throw his spear in rage at a bunch of surrendering soldiers because his girl just died?

    Oh nope, he literally did that the previous episode.

    And why are the Unsullied going to an island to die out instead of following the last order of their queen?
    To break free everyone in the world?

    Nothing involving the resolution of the Dothraki and Unsullied makes any sense at all.
    I get that people think that Grey Worm was avenging Missandei, but there is no evidence that he threw the spear because he was in a fit of rage. He waits until he sees Drogon and Dany disregard the bells and start blowing up the city. When that happens, he surmises (correctly) that the Queen wishes for the massacre of KL to be sine missione, and he follows her into battle like a loyal dog. He is likely feeling all the rage and frustration from Missandei's death, but that's not the reason why he throws the spear.

    A bigger problem is that her Dothraki bloodriders are literally sworn to kill whoever kills her, and then join her in death. It seems that the showrunners remembered that Dothraki were supposed to join Dany in death (since they are not mentioned at all ever again), but the fact that Jon is alive when there's a gazillion bloodriders around is not even an inconsistency, its a glaring plot hole. Not even Grey Worm (if he was so inclined) could keep them from killing Jon.

  8. #28828
    Quote Originally Posted by Puri View Post
    I just realized: Sansa queen, Bran king, Jon exiled, Arya on an adventure.

    Almost like Catelyn Stark wrote the episode.
    "The lone wolf dies, but the pack survives".

  9. #28829
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    Bran can't see the future. Whenever he says something like someone was right where they were supposed to be, it just a matter of accepting the past just like Sansa accepting that all the bad that she endured was what brought her to where she needed to be.

    He didn't know Dany would torch the entire city, but he still expected to win. He figured that he was the only logical one to become king no matter how Dany and Cersei were defeated.

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    They didn't have infinite rewind and pause available to viewers during the first showing.

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    Except that isn't what would have happened at all. Dany was never benevolent. She just never went up against any arguably "innocent" people who didn't bend the knee until reaching Westeros.
    If Bran can't see the future he definitely sees glimpses of it and has proven it repeatedly.

    One big give away is against the Night King. He gave Arya the dagger in the exact spot where she would kill the Night King. When Bran and the Night King were having a stare down we see Bran look the Night King in the eye, breaks eye contact to look the Night King in the spot he gets stabbed in. The Night King was confused himself as he tilts his head in curiosity. 10 seconds later Arya stabs the Night King in the spot Bran was just staring in the same location where Bran gave Arya the dagger.
    He knew Dany would go mad as he already seen that vision. The warlocks in the House of the Undying seen the same thing Bran did. It is highly probable he purposely drove her to madness because Jon being king was completely useless to bring up if he was not going to acknowledge it or even mention it. When Grey Worm was demanding true justice for Jons crime that was a perfect chance to tell everyone that Jon did nothing wrong. He was the true king and Dany was an absolute tyrant who wanted the entire world to be her subjects.

    Tyrion also gave an interesting facial expression when Bran clearly says he only came to Kings Landing to be king. He seemed shocked or confused.

    He clearly has some cognition of the future whether or not he can travel there is one thing but he does have a good idea of that is coming. The prequel should definitely touch up on the mystical parts of the show much better than the main series did so we should get a lot more information on the Three-Eyed Raven, the Night King, Children of the Forest, The Great Other and Lord of Light.

  10. #28830
    Quote Originally Posted by Dystemper View Post
    LOL you made a alt account just to try and insult me? Seriously? Tell me how any one who didnt know Bran would describe him ? Because he sure as hell not normal. Can you honestly say thatBran does not appear to have some mental problems to anyone outside of his immediate family that does not know his story?


    You seriously think the People of Westeros outside of the North Know as much about Bran as they would Joffrey, "Son" of King Robert Baratheon and Cersei Lannister? Not to mention that for most of the series, Everyone thought Bran was dead and gone . I seriously Doubt the people south of Winterfell gave 2 shits about the North to the point of keeping tab on whos who. And to the average person in Westeros, Bran would appear to have some kind of mental issues. He no longer has any emotions, very aloof and is really no longer capable of cennecting with people on a emotional level. I am sure the average person in Kings Landing would look at him and think " Oh he must be some sort of super wizard who can see the futire, the past and control animals" yeah that seems legit. That explains why everyone that knew Hodor didnt think he was some crazy guy with limited mental capacity and instead a hero who held off the White walkers by holding a door. I mean how did they not instantly know what he did?
    Bran is not portrayed as autistic or suffering from any mental illness at any point, to which you suggested he was. He's reserved and speaks only when needed, unlike others. That's not a sign or symptom of disease. By that frail assumption, all quiet people that speak very little and with reserved emotions are autistic. If you can't see what's wrong with that, then I'm afraid I can't help you see clearly. His journey was not an easy one, and your discounting him because he's crippled.

    Your disdain for handicap and challenged people is quite evidenced in your writing, and frankly, it's disgusting. You assume far too much to have a fruitful discussion, and your sarcasm leads me to believe you're only interested in arguing meaninglessly. Neither of which I'm impressed by, nor interested in. Farewell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Halicia View Post
    Previous seasons maybe, but not the final one. Bran has nothing but face value, since there's nothing inside the cover. When King's Landing burned, everyone else was cheering or shocked. Bran just sat and watched.
    Yeah, it's almost as if he knew exactly what was going to happen and wasn't at all surprised by what he was seeing.
    Last edited by Black Goat; 2019-05-21 at 05:04 PM.

  11. #28831
    Quote Originally Posted by Black Goat View Post
    Bran is not portrayed as autistic or suffering from any mental illness at any point, to which you suggested he was. He's reserved and speaks only when needed, unlike others. That's not a sign or symptom of disease. By that frail assumption, all quiet people that speak very little and with reserved emotions are autistic. If you can't see what's wrong with that, then I'm afraid I can't help you see clearly. His journey was not an easy one, and your discounting him because he's crippled.

    Your disdain for handicap and challenged people is quite evidenced in your writing, and frankly, it's disgusting. You assume far too much to have a fruitful discussion, and your sarcasm leads me to believe you're only interested in arguing meaninglessly. Neither of which I'm impressed by, nor interested in. Farewell.

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    Yeah, it's almost as if he knew exactly what was going to happen and wasn't at all surprised by what he was seeing.
    You completely ignored what I said in order to rant at me in a self righteous manner . Your trolling is pretty weak. Why use the sockpuppet brand new account ? I in no way shape or form said or implied I had disdain for handicap it challenged people. That was a conclusion you jumped to because you decided to jump on a soap box .
    Last edited by Dystemper; 2019-05-21 at 05:24 PM.
    Non nobis Domine, non nobis, sed nomini tuo da gloriam

  12. #28832
    Quote Originally Posted by Dystemper View Post
    You completely ignored what I said in order to rant at me in a self righteous manner . Your trolling is pretty weak. Why use the sockpuppet brand new account ? I in no way shape or form said or implied I had disdain for handicap it challenged people. That was a conclusion you jumped to because you decided to jump on a soap box .
    You implied that a king named "Broken" would be looked down upon by a fictional nation of people. You implied that people would hold a negative view of him since he "seems" mentally ill. You made several references that people of Westeros would think poorly of a crippled king. There's no basis for that assumption other than you personally don't think very highly of crippled or people suffering from a disease. Since the people you're pretending to understand don't exist, these are thoughts of your own.

    I'm not trolling. My statements are direct results of the things you're saying. I'm telling you you're wrong. Those are very different things. You keep on about this "new account" business as if it's relevant. Perhaps you should look into what trolling actually is. Facts:

    -Bran is not autistic. You said he was.
    -The denizens of Westeros do not choose their King. You implied they do.
    -The opinion of the commonfolk of Westeros does not affect the Throne in a meaningful way. You implied they do.

    Those are three things which you tried to pass off as true, and they are not. So when you do stop this arrogant attitude that you can't be corrected and start realizing you're just incorrect, and that you probably have a personal distaste for people you see as diseased or crippled? Because I'm at a loss to how you'd conclude that from watching the show or reading the books.

    This is a new account I made on this forum. You can drop the arrogant act that I made this account to address you specifically. You're wrong again.
    Last edited by Black Goat; 2019-05-21 at 05:48 PM.

  13. #28833
    Quote Originally Posted by Black Goat View Post
    Yeah, it's almost as if he knew exactly what was going to happen and wasn't at all surprised by what he was seeing.
    Which would make him the most evil person on Westeros.

  14. #28834
    Quote Originally Posted by Black Goat View Post
    You implied that a king named "Broken" would be looked down upon by a fictional nation of people. That's a projection of yourself. You implied that people would hold a negative view of him since he "seems" mentally ill. You made several references that people of Westeros would think poorly of a crippled king. There's no basis for that assumption other than you personally don't think very highly of crippled or people suffering from a disease. All while pretending Westeros is some kind of democracy, as well.

    I'm not trolling. My statements are direct results of the things you're saying. I'm telling you you're wrong. Those are very different things. You keep on about this "new account" business as if it's relevant. Perhaps you should look into what trolling actually is.

    This is a new account I made on this forum. You can drop the arrogant act that I made this account to address you specifically. You're wrong again.
    It's just weird that those have been your only posts. There is plenty of reason to think that people who exist in an analogue to a time in which physical ailments were often thought to reflect personal failures would not embrace a king in a wheelchair. Someone earlier cited FDR as an example of a population doing so, but FDR worked extremely hard to hide his disability precisely because a 1930s population would have a hard time accepting a president who couldn't/could barely walk. You're the one making arrogant assumptions.

  15. #28835
    Quote Originally Posted by Halicia View Post
    Which would make him the most evil person on Westeros.
    Or totally devoid of attachment and emotions.

    He could be evil, he could be good but he isn't a normal human anymore either as he knows everything.
    I like to think he is absolute in neutrality whether the average person likes it or not Bran sees the entire picture and is the only one who knows what will happen.

  16. #28836
    Got, the show that was famous as a masterpiece, And in 6 episodes turned into garbage. I mean the last episode, the script,writing, everything.....I never knew i could feel this much disappointed/sadness from a tv show.

    Even the freaking actors are disappointed.

    I mean how could it even come to this, did they not have meetings,discussions?debate over anything? how did it come from the writing table to the stamp of approval?
    I guess som low level worker did try to argue with the directors and was shutdown. Did they even know there were 7 seasons before s8? nothing makes sense.

    Did the success/fame of game of thones go to their heads? Whatever they did nothing could be bad with "the got!!"...

    Yes David Benioff, D.B. Weiss, you sure proved that you could create one of the best shows the world had ever seen, "as long you had the books to guide you"...and with no books? yeah you sure showed your full potential. they will alway be remembered as the ones that destroyed game of thrones.

  17. #28837
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snuffe View Post
    Got, the show that was famous as a masterpiece, And in 6 episodes turned into garbage. I mean the last episode, the script,writing, everything.....I never knew i could feel this much disappointed/sadness from a tv show.

    Even the freaking actors are disappointed.

    I mean how could it even come to this, did they not have meetings,discussions?debate over anything? how did it come from the writing table to the stamp of approval?
    I guess som low level worker did try to argue with the directors and was shutdown. Did they even know there were 7 seasons before s8? nothing makes sense.

    Did the success/fame of game of thones go to their heads? Whatever they did nothing could be bad with "the got!!"...

    Yes David Benioff, D.B. Weiss, you sure proved that you could create one of the best shows the world had ever seen, "as long you had the books to guide you"...and with no books? yeah you sure showed your full potential. they will alway be remembered as the ones that destroyed game of thrones.
    Yeah well at least they weren't rewarded with a new Star Wars movie.

    Oh . . . wait . . . ugh.
    3.6 roentgen . . . not great, not terrible. - Comrade Dyatlov

  18. #28838
    Quote Originally Posted by Byuiso View Post
    Or totally devoid of attachment and emotions.

    He could be evil, he could be good but he isn't a normal human anymore either as he knows everything.
    I like to think he is absolute in neutrality whether the average person likes it or not Bran sees the entire picture and is the only one who knows what will happen.
    If he's some "all knowing god", then there is no explanation for him knowing certain things were going to happen, and then allowing them anyways.

    I'm reminded of Breaking Bad, when Walt stands there and watches as Jesse's girlfriend chokes to death, but does nothing.

    Sometimes being an "uncaring neutral observer", is simply the purest kind of evil there is...

    Even disregarding the good/evil aspect, having Bran as a "ruler" is the worst choice possible. He sat and let a whole city burn not out of any sense of moral righteousness, or personal greed, but because he simply didn't care about whether those little ants lived or died.

    I mean, he brings that very same apathy to his first acts as ruler... simply walking out of the meeting and letting everyone else do everything because he simply doesn't care about his subjects' (or any human's) wellbeing.

  19. #28839
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    First, character development necessarily means that character changes, and does things they once would never have. And it's not always in a "good" direction.
    You can say that as much as you like, but it wont change the fact that her burning of King's Landing goes against her character.

    For that change to be credible, it needs to be seen happening over a long period of time. Nobody ever goes from heroic symbol to worse than nazis over the course of a single episode. And when they do? its stupid bad writing.

    Second, the issue is not whether her targets "deserved" anything. Her methods were always abhorrent, and entirely at her personal whim. And this is the problem with someone like that; you can back them as long as their targets line up with people you don't like, but the moment they no longer line up, it's horror show time. But they didn't really change, in that process. They never had the moral center you thought they did. And neither did Daenerys "I will burn your cities to the ground" Stormborn.
    That's where you're wrong.

    Lemme draw a similar character that is very popular and has had a long long story. The Punisher.

    A brutal, ruthless, barbaric, and utterly merciless vigilante who does horrible things to horrible people. Yet we cheer for him because he ONLY does horrible things to horrible people. One of the staples of his character, one of the cornerstones that defines who he is, and what he believes in, and what he stands for, is that he never EVER hurts innocent people, innocent bystanders, and SPECIALLY NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER lays a hand on children.

    If the creators of The Punisher wanted to have him slip down the slippery slope, and slowly become the monster he set out to destroy, they'd have to slowly show him change, slowly start to modify his methods. But if in one comic he goes out of his way to save an orphanage full of children, then on the very next, he quite literally burns down four orphanages for no other reason than he was bored? That would be some bullshit writing.

    He tortures people, in one particular storyline he flayed human traffickers alive, excruciatingly torturing them to death. But he DOES NOT TOUCH CHILDREN. If you wanna sell the story of the punisher killing children, you can't just have him "suddenly snap" and then call it "the natural evolution of the character".

    That's not how it works with the punisher, that's not how it works with Daenerys. Her cornerstone pillar was her love of the underdog, the children, the downthrodden. She would NEVER burn innocent people with no reason.

    If they had her burning down the red keep, with all the civilians inside, just to get a cersei? that'd be brutal, horrible, and ruthless, yet totally in-character. She's killing innocent people, but because she wants something and she wont let anything or anyone get in the way. Her torching a city, after the battle was won, the enemies laid down their weapons, and the city surrendered? Not dany. No matter how much you say otherwise.

    Por que odiar si amar es mas dulce? (*^_^*)

  20. #28840
    The Undying freefolk's Avatar
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    "When she murdered the slavers of Astapor, I'm sure no one but the slavers complained," says Tyrion. "After all, they were evil men. When she crucified hundreds of Meereenese nobles, who could argue? They were evil men. The Dothraki khals she burned alive? They would have done worse to her. Everywhere she goes, evil men die and we cheer her for it, and she grows more powerful and more sure she is good and right. She believes her destiny is to build a better world for everyone. If you believed that, if you truly believed it, wouldn't you kill whoever stood between you and paradise?"


    Thing is, was Dany convinced she was good and right? And building a better world for everyone? Did Dany believe that it justified her murder of the poor folk in King's Landing? The poor people were completely innocent.

    I don't think so.

    She was just using strong man tactics to put fear in the hearts of her enemies, much like Genghis Khan did or Dany's Dothraki husband would've. I don't think Dany saw herself as a good person. I think she saw herself as a strong person, a person the savage Dothraki admired.

    Do you buy Tyrion's argument? Does he convince you Dany needs to die?
    .

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    -- Capt. Copeland

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