[TV/Books] Game of Thrones ***SPOILER Discussion***

[eschatological]

You're still yet ignoring the fact that even if he says it can take a month, when push comes to shove he can make it happen right away. As for being a guard, that's all fine and good but you still can't take these actions in a heavily fortified area filled with OTHER GUARDS in plain view, so that makes absolutely no difference as you still can't be seen doing what you're doing regardless of what outfit you have on.

Do you want to keep going with this?

Sort of like how Arya can't kill the thin man or the actress in a crowd of other people? Sort of like how the waif can't find Arya out in the street in public and stab her repeatedly when there's a brief lull in potential witnesses?

I can keep going always. I like to argue, especially when I'm right.

[Mavick]

Sort of like how Arya can't kill the thin man or the actress in a crowd of other people? Sort of like how the waif can't find Arya out in the street in public and stab her repeatedly when there's a brief lull in potential witnesses?

I can keep going always. I like to argue, especially when I'm right.

You're not right lol. You're just putting on the face of the vocal minority who do nothing but nitpick any little thing that doesn't line up with their own expectations. Everything I've said on the subject is easily grasped and recognized by the majority of people out there, despite the edglelord population on these boards, so in the end the fact that you want to continue debating your lost cause here doesn't bother me in the slightest, it only serves to make you look as foolish as you're being.

Also, as to your first paragraph, killing someone in a town where people might not give a fuck is not the same thing as killing guards in a military camp. So let's not try to draw false comparisons to try to score some points here.

[eschatological]

It's not nitpicking to show a consistent degenerative quality in the writing over the past 3 seasons. That's concern over a very major portion of, oh, dramatic storytelling.


I guess Braavos, one of the busiest cities in the world, is not comparable to the undermanned, huge castle of Harrenhal (known to be one of the largest castles in Westeros)? I suppose that means you don't care about what the books say, either, when they describe Jaqen going to the guard's hut, chatting with them for a bit, and then killing them? No? Didn't think so - I didn't mention it earlier, because relying on the book can be a crutch, but in season 2, when they were closely following the books, it could be helpful.

A nitpick would be the thing where people complain about Robert sending everyone away to have Ned pen his succession letter.

I am not, by any means, an edgelord. I'm a soon-to-be-38 year old lawyer. I don't dislike things to dislike them - I, in fact, liked this episode for its cinematography, its music, etc. Saying the writing is bad doesn't mean the whole episode is bad.

[MakeMeLaugh]

You're not right lol. You're just putting on the face of the vocal minority who do nothing but nitpick any little thing that doesn't line up with their own expectations. Everything I've said on the subject is easily grasped and recognized by the majority of people out there, despite the edglelord population on these boards, so in the end the fact that you want to continue debating your lost cause here doesn't bother me in the slightest, it only serves to make you look as foolish as you're being.

Also, as to your first paragraph, killing someone in a town where people might not give a fuck is not the same thing as killing guards in a military camp. So let's not try to draw false comparisons to try to score some points here.

Except you are arguing with everyone here, trying to defend your flawed view of bad writing, and calling inconsistency "nitpicking". So for you everyone is wrong and you are the only one right here. The majority of the population is stupid and is fine with anything, they don't question, they don't think, they don't care and they also do not discuss these things because they obviously cannot perceive these problems.

For you, Arya running around the city with her belly open, jumping into a river, and then killing the waif is all fine because she was trained to be the very best, like no one ever was.

[Mavick]

It's not nitpicking to show a consistent degenerative quality in the writing over the past 3 seasons. That's concern over a very major portion of, oh, dramatic storytelling.


I guess Braavos, one of the busiest cities in the world, is not comparable to the undermanned, huge castle of Harrenhal (known to be one of the largest castles in Westeros)? I suppose that means you don't care about what the books say, either, when they describe Jaqen going to the guard's hut, chatting with them for a bit, and then killing them? No? Didn't think so - I didn't mention it earlier, because relying on the book can be a crutch, but in season 2, when they were closely following the books, it could be helpful.

A nitpick would be the thing where people complain about Robert sending everyone away to have Ned pen his succession letter.

I am not, by any means, an edgelord. I'm a soon-to-be-38 year old lawyer. I don't dislike things to dislike them - I, in fact, liked this episode for its cinematography, its music, etc. Saying the writing is bad doesn't mean the whole episode is bad.

Yet you haven't shown a "consistent degenerative quality in writing over the past 3 seasons". Everything you've said about it I've countered because, as I've demonstrated repeatedly everything you're saying is based upon your own failed perceptions and selective memory about what has happened. There are a multitude of clear narratives in this show, and even when it's not so clear it's not hard to apply some thought to make sense of it AS LONG as you don't let yourself get convinced by whatever online trolls are screaming "this writing sucks".

Also, age and profession have absolutely fuckall with being an edgelord. I've been guilty of it myself and I'm older and more intelligent than you.

[Tabrotar]

Except you are arguing with everyone here, trying to defend your flawed view of bad writing, and calling inconsistency "nitpicking". So for you everyone is wrong and you are the only one right here. The majority of the population is stupid and is fine with anything, they don't question, they don't think, they don't care and they also do not discuss these things because they obviously cannot perceive these problems.

For you, Arya running around the city with her belly open, jumping into a river, and then killing the waif is all fine because she was trained to be the very best, like no one ever was.

Thanks now i have the pokemon opening in my ears again XD .

But yeah he´s desperatly trying to defend his "right" opinion, but only makes himself look bad.

[Mavick]

Except you are arguing with everyone here, trying to defend your flawed view of bad writing, and calling inconsistency "nitpicking". So for you everyone is wrong and you are the only one right here. The majority of the population is stupid and is fine with anything, they don't question, they don't think, they don't care and they also do not discuss these things because they obviously cannot perceive these problems.

For you, Arya running around the city with her belly open, jumping into a river, and then killing the waif is all fine because she was trained to be the very best, like no one ever was.

"everyone here" consists of about 4-5 people in the last 24 hours on a video game based forums. Even if that turns out to be 50, it's hardly overwhelming odds.

[ohiostate124]

End of the day, the Dothraki always posed a problem being in Westeros so it may have been stupid but they needed to get rid of them.

[Mavick]

End of the day, the Dothraki always posed a problem being in Westeros so it may have been stupid but they needed to get rid of them.

Yeah I mean initially it made sense, because open field fighting like they got against the Lannister army on the "loot train", that they excel at. But as soon as the story progressed to everyone who's not an asshole vs the NK, I just don't see how you make that work in that battle.

[Thrif]

You're not right lol. You're just putting on the face of the vocal minority who do nothing but nitpick any little thing that doesn't line up with their own expectations. Everything I've said on the subject is easily grasped and recognized by the majority of people out there, despite the edglelord population on these boards, so in the end the fact that you want to continue debating your lost cause here doesn't bother me in the slightest, it only serves to make you look as foolish as you're being.

I wonder who the "majority of people out there" are that you're referring to. Your friends and family who are equally easily deluded as you? From what I have seen practically every media outlet recognizes the shitty writing of this episode. Just go anywhere and read the reviews.

Your edgelord non-argument doesn't hold up, and you're the only one looking more and more foolish - or rather, incompetent of recognizing poor writing - for every post you make.

[eschatological]

Yet you haven't shown a "consistent degenerative quality in writing over the past 3 seasons". Everything you've said about it I've countered because, as I've demonstrated repeatedly everything you're saying is based upon your own failed perceptions and selective memory about what has happened. There are a multitude of clear narratives in this show, and even when it's not so clear it's not hard to apply some thought to make sense of it AS LONG as you don't let yourself get convinced by whatever online trolls are screaming "this writing sucks".

Also, age and profession have absolutely fuckall with being an edgelord. I've been guilty of it myself and I'm older and more intelligent than you.

I mean, if you'd been in this thread for the past 4 years dissecting this series for these past 3 seasons, you'd know my problems with the writing. Here are a few examples:

* The Dorne plotline, including both Myrcella and Trystane's death, and the assassination of Doran's character.
* The Stannis-burns-Shireen plotline, or the plotline where Ramsay can burn down Stannis's camp without being seen or heard with Sir Twentygoodmen.
* The end of Arya's training, as we've discussed.
* The plan by LF to marry Sansa to Ramsay.
* The total annhilation of the Tyrells because the writers can't figure out how to write a multi-layered, nuanced conflict between surface allies, and the complete lack of fallout from Cersei blowing up the GREAT SEPT OF BALON
* The Sons of the Harpy rebellion in Mereen.
* Euron being neutered from his book self.
* The. Entire. Missandei. Grey Worm. Romance. Plot
* The foray north of the Wall by Jon and his band of merry men, who somehow survive because people can teleport, and the subsequent loss of a dragon because of it.
* The ability for Jaime and Bronn, in armor (Jaime in full armor), to survive falling into a deep lake after charging at a dragon.
* The Battle of the Bastards, including Rickon's death and Jon's (and every major character's) ability to surive it.
* Melisandre's whole plotline for the past 2 seasons.

The bad writing has affected almost all the characters. It's extensive.

[Mavick]

I mean, if you'd been in this thread for the past 4 years dissecting this series for these past 3 seasons, you'd know my problems with the writing. Here are a few examples:

* The Dorne plotline, including both Myrcella and Trystane's death, and the assassination of Doran's character.
* The Stannis-burns-Shireen plotline, or the plotline where Ramsay can burn down Stannis's camp without being seen or heard with Sir Twentygoodmen.
* The end of Arya's training, as we've discussed.
* The plan by LF to marry Sansa to Ramsay.
* The total annhilation of the Tyrells because the writers can't figure out how to write a multi-layered, nuanced conflict between surface allies, and the complete lack of fallout from Cersei blowing up the GREAT SEPT OF BALON
* The Sons of the Harpy rebellion in Mereen.
* Euron being neutered from his book self.
* The. Entire. Missandei. Grey Worm. Romance. Plot
* The foray north of the Wall by Jon and his band of merry men, who somehow survive because people can teleport, and the subsequent loss of a dragon because of it.
* The ability for Jaime and Bronn, in armor (Jaime in full armor), to survive falling into a deep lake after charging at a dragon.
* The Battle of the Bastards, including Rickon's death and Jon's (and every major character's) ability to surive it.
* Melisandre's whole plotline for the past 2 seasons.

The bad writing has affected almost all the characters. It's extensive.

I don't need to bear witness to the discussion for the past 3 seasons when just over the past episode or two your flawed reasoning is so readily apparent.

- - - Updated - - -

I wonder who the "majority of people out there" are that you're referring to. Your friends and family who are equally easily deluded as you? From what I have seen practically every media outlet recognizes the shitty writing of this episode. Just go anywhere and read the reviews.

Your edgelord non-argument doesn't hold up, and you're the only one looking more and more foolish - or rather, incompetent of recognizing poor writing - for every post you make.

GoT has a viewership of around 17.8 million people as of the last episode. I'm pretty confident that if even a slight majority of those people had the issues you all proclaim to have those numbers wouldn't even exist or the internet would have crumbled by now with all of this senseless whining.

Edit: I also seriously doubt that 17.8 million includes all the various pirated/streamed means of watching, as well.

[KingSapmi]

You must be the cinematographer.

I'm with Appelgren up there. I had no issue with the darkness that episode, my TV picked up everything pretty much clearly.

As for the episode, great episode. I do feel they could have had the Night King's death a little bit more epic and "special", and not just like any other White Walker killed so far. I have no problem with Arya killing the Night King, I did have my fear that it would be Jon Snow with some Azor Ahai prophecy stuff. G.R.R. Martin clearly stated that the current age of Westeros isn't the Age of Heroes, that ended with the last Long Night.
And I do think that was the whole point of the White Walker's and the Night King, the struggle of common men having to survive something that required a "Golden hero of the ages" kinda deal.

Not unlike how The Lord of the Rings show a world divided and not at it's height of power, having to deal with a big threat such as Sauron. While on the other hand when Melkor/Morgoth was on the loose during the first age, there were magic, a whole bunch of races fighting together, epic wars that destroyed continents and broke mountains. God's and heroes walking the earth. In the same sense that the way Tolkien presented Aragorn as the last heir to a great kingdom, a hero hidden under a commoners name, but destined to do something great. When first reading the books it could almost seem like Aragorn could be some great epic hero, battling the final villain in a legendary one-versus-one battle, yet he fullfills his destiny by claiming his birthright and accepting who he is. A lot of parallels with Jon Snow, knowing all his life that he is nothing but a bastard child of Stark and some unknown person, then having to come to terms with being half Targaryan as well, and the rightful heir to a throne he never expected or knew about. I wouldn't be surprised if he comes to terms with this realization and accepts his heritage. They are two very similar characters.

Knowing how G.R.R. Martin has based a lot of his "Hero work" upon the writings of J.R.R. Tolkien, it does fit the bill quite well. Westeros is in ruins, the low amounts of magic that actually exists in the world is shakey at best, dragons had been dead for ages until Daenerys. I just draw similarities of how Arya, who was not much in the first season climbed the ranks and built herself into something and managed to do something incredible. Just like Frodo, sitting at home enjoying his time with friends, get's thrown into a world he wasn't prepared for, and in the end, stopping the greatest threat in thousands of years from destroying everything.

[Sooba]

/Snip
Also, age and profession have absolutely fuckall with being an edgelord. I've been guilty of it myself and I'm older and more intelligent than you.

Jesus fucking Christ what a snide, oblivious, and pathetic thing to say.

[eschatological]

I don't need to bear witness to the discussion for the past 3 seasons when just over the past episode or two your flawed reasoning is so readily apparent.

Great rebuttal on these clear examples of awful writing from someone whose only recently picked up the series.

[Mavick]

Jesus fucking Christ what a snide, oblivious, and pathetic thing to say.

Snide, yes. Oblivious, no, he's made that plainly obvious. Pathetic, guess that depends on where you're sitting. Having to repeatedly refute the same thing over and over using just rudimentary narrative awareness, tends to wear thin after a bit. Bear in mind this remark is me stating plainly the attitude he's very clearly been trying to portray over me since the start of the discusssion.

[Sooba]

/snip. You're just putting on the face of the vocal minority who do nothing but nitpick any little thing that doesn't line up with their own expectations. Everything I've said on the subject is easily grasped and recognized by the majority of people out there... /snip

Ah yes, the mysterious "majority" of people. Nevermind that you're the only one in this thread with that opinion. You're failing to even do argumentum ad populum correctly, a fallacy.

[Mavick]

Great rebuttal on these clear examples of awful writing from someone whose only recently picked up the series.

As much as I might have the free time to do this, I'm not going to go back through your older points right now. Not when this is just your fallback to not being able to "hand me my ass" so to speak on what we've already discussed.

[Sooba]

Snide, yes. Oblivious, no, he's made that plainly obvious. Pathetic, guess that depends on where you're sitting. Having to repeatedly refute the same thing over and over using just rudimentary narrative awareness, tends to wear thin after a bit. Bear in mind this remark is me stating plainly the attitude he's very clearly been trying to portray over me since the start of the discusssion.

Don't even fucking pretend. You were a straight-up asshole just then. All three of those descriptors fit what you said perfectly.

[eschatological]

Snide, yes. Oblivious, no, he's made that plainly obvious. Pathetic, guess that depends on where you're sitting. Having to repeatedly refute the same thing over and over using just rudimentary narrative awareness, tends to wear thin after a bit. Bear in mind this remark is me stating plainly the attitude he's very clearly been trying to portray over me since the start of the discusssion.

The Washington Post said this episode was bad. Are you smarter than the Washington Post as well? Is there attitude shitty?