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  1. #1
    The Patient marathal's Avatar
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    Figured out whats wrong with Cata

    I am not saying that what I am writing here is what is wrong with the expansion. It is just my opinion of why it feels wrong to me.

    It's not so much that they went back and raised the bar on difficulty or any of the numerous QQ reasons you see daily on the boards. I was thinking about it the other day. Why does it feel, not so much wrong in any way, but an off feeling.

    Then it kind of hit me. Our brains are on overload, there is just to much to do. They have added so much content spread out to every group of people that wanted something new that the majority of people can't decide what they want to work on, because there is so much to choose from.

    You have groups plowing through raiding content so fast that they are screaming they want more, faster, faster, come on Blizz its been a week, we have that on farm, give us new raids.

    The PvP crowd has multiple Battlegrounds, Arena's, Rated Battle Grounds, etc. and want more. And with the Justice to Honor convert, most everyone is walking around in full Season 9 or better PvP gear.

    There are Zone dailies to unlock new areas, faction dailies for rep to get gear, Cooking and Fishing dailies everywhere, grind grind grind.

    Quests all reworked and for many people reset for Loremaster so they need to go back to do them again.

    Archeology, yeah lets not go there.

    Firelands rep runs, and every caster and their 3rd cousin now has Taragosa's Rest quest.

    While there may not be a lot of new level 85 heroic dungeons, they made them exceptionally long so that most groups need an hour or more to do a run.


    It all kind of hit me when I logged in for my normal 3-4 hours of playing during the week, I had to get my Hyjal Dalies done, (30 minutes), Tol Barad was up shortly after, followed by Baradin Hold, (about an hour total), Signed up for Rated Battle grounds, (2 hours), leaving me 30 minutes to que up for a Heroic regular which I dropped from Que because it was a 35 minute wait, others were doing a troll and they had thier 5's. That did not include any time to knock out some quests towards zone achievments, farming for mats to earn some cash, or any raids. Its the same thing everyday, just different things going on that I feel I have to do. It has evolved into not so much a game I play to have fun and relax but a Part Time job that I work at 7 days a week.

    When I think back the downturn may have been when they lowered riding to level 20. If you wanted to run a dungeon it meant 2 people had to run, or ride there, if you were lucky they had the Flight Plan to there. Something as simple as doing Scarlet Monestary actually took some time to organize. The overall pace of the game was slower. It took me 5 months to level my first toon to 80. Now If I work at one I could probably do it in 2 weeks, 3 to get to 85.

    If the game slowed down, would that really be a bad thing?


    Anyway, just my thinking.

  2. #2
    Scarab Lord Sesto's Avatar
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    WOTLK was really horrible, Cata is bringing WoW back to it's awesomeness.

  3. #3
    In my opinion, the reason people are bored with Cata is because every xpac has been something new, yet in Cata we went back to Azeroth which is 6 years old. Yea they revamped a lot of the old zones, but at the end of the day it's still Azeroth.

  4. #4
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    Fair point although if there was less content you'd have someone else make a thread about how they do everything so quick and then are left to do nothing for hours but grind HCs. I think cata is okay plenty of things to do and you can choose when you want to do it.

  5. #5
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    Why do people keep saying that WoTLK was bad? I personally loved every bit of it.

  6. #6
    Herald of the Titans Will's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by threadz View Post
    In my opinion, the reason people are bored with Cata is because every xpac has been something new, yet in Cata we went back to Azeroth which is 6 years old. Yea they revamped a lot of the old zones, but at the end of the day it's still Azeroth.
    IMO, no Xpac has been anything new. At all. Just a fancy new face on the same old body.

    Yes, the continents changed a lot, but it still feels like old Azeroth to me.

    ---------- Post added 2011-07-29 at 03:57 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    If the game slowed down, would that really be a bad thing?
    I enjoyed a great many things in the day, but spending half my time just organising stuff was not among them.

  7. #7
    The Patient
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    I tend to agree with you in terms of the time commitment - and keep in mind everything you listed was for ONE toon. For some of the people in my guild who have an army of alts, it's absolutely crazy how much time they spend just on "maintenance." Given my limited playtime, I've really dropped to only doing maintenance on my main, and what once were 2 decently geared alts are now collecting dust on my char screen, only logging to them when I need to abuse their professions.

    Still, all in all, I'd prefer to have too much to do than not enough. We as the player base set the bar for "what you must do to stay competitive" and it's up to you as the individual player to decide what exactly you want to be "competitive" in given your playtime. For me as a warlock, after I unlocked the vendor to get my moonwell trinket, I've been slacking on Hyjal dailies cuz frankly past the Moonwell I just don't care about them compared to other things I could be doing with my time.

    Can't do it all, man. Much as I'd like to.

    Heroic progression raider. Incapable of using Saran Wrap.

  8. #8
    The Difficulty Factor certainly had something to do with people becoming stressed out over Cataclysm and quitting, to be quite honest. You had to have near-perfect tries on raid encounters depending on difficulty (10 man comes to mind; No, I'm not trying to start the 10's vs 25's argument again). Even hardcore guilds such as Ensidia and Paragon admitted to this. People simply became burned out on the game when they realized how stressful raiding would be and how much work they'd need to put in to it.

    Then there's the PvP factor. PvP is so unbalanced ATM that people probably get pissed off when a Feral Druid or some other overpowered spec comes in and 2 - 4 shots them (*cough* Arcane Mages *cough*), and Blizzard doesn't seem to want to listen to reason about those kinds of things and nerf the shit out of those specs (Again, not trying to start an argument over overpowered specs).

    Basically, its not a lot of content to do, or a lack thereof, but the feeling people got in Wrath and BC is pretty much gone, and we've gone back to classic where shit was just plain imbalanced, and pretty damn hard for the casual players.

    That's my 10 Copper.

  9. #9
    i dont think overload is a bad thing. i remember back in classic WoW, walking into a new quest hub (like the cross roads or into STV or westfall) and having like 10 or 15 new quests all at once. i loved it!

    the reason i don't play as much as i used to is that nothing feels new to me anymore. it was fun exploring and not knowing what was behind every corner. as well, i had a few friends i met in game who would explore with me, but that feel of community has gone away too


    And to elaborate more on the sense of community: i remember in classic WoW trying to quest in southshore. most of the time you just spent PvPing. which i personally loved! i remember getting a group of friends, or recruiting people in stormwind to come help, or just trying to hide and finish a quest. most of the time, you knew the big names of people on your server, on both factions. But i didn't mind being completely prevented from continuing my quests, i didn't see it as an annoyance. which is why i liked rift, because at times you cannot quest, and you are forced to fight off an invasion
    Last edited by MaccaBird; 2011-07-29 at 03:18 PM.

  10. #10
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by savutitus View Post
    Why do people keep saying that WoTLK was bad? I personally loved every bit of it.
    I agree! I enjoyed Wotlk myself. Of course we all have different play styles which could effect how much each person enjoyed the content.

  11. #11
    Scarab Lord Azuri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    I am not saying that what I am writing here is what is wrong with the expansion. It is just my opinion of why it feels wrong to me.

    It's not so much that they went back and raised the bar on difficulty or any of the numerous QQ reasons you see daily on the boards. I was thinking about it the other day. Why does it feel, not so much wrong in any way, but an off feeling.

    Then it kind of hit me. Our brains are on overload, there is just to much to do. They have added so much content spread out to every group of people that wanted something new that the majority of people can't decide what they want.
    I stopped at this point. Not sure if serious.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    Then it kind of hit me. Our brains are on overload, there is just to much to do. They have added so much content spread out to every group of people that wanted something new that the majority of people can't decide what they want to work on, because there is so much to choose from.
    All of the QQ Threads on here about not enough content beg to differ. Honestly, I do agree there's a lot (plenty) to do, but I play just about every aspect of the game except arena. I'll not be bored any time soon.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    You have groups plowing through raiding content so fast that they are screaming they want more, faster, faster, come on Blizz its been a week, we have that on farm, give us new raids.
    Groups being the top raiding guilds in the world; who have spent countless hours and power naps to get to that point. The top guild on our server is at 4-5/7 normal right now, and my own guild is up there as well. It'll be some time before we tackle HC Ragnaros, and we hadn't even gone back to try HC Synestra yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    The PvP crowd has multiple Battlegrounds, Arena's, Rated Battle Grounds, etc. and want more. And with the Justice to Honor convert, most everyone is walking around in full Season 9 or better PvP gear.
    Who is most everyone? I think I'd like to make a character on your server since it seems you have every top raider AND top pvper in all of WoW all collected there. Seriously, yes gear can be achieved, but not so quickly as you would think.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    There are Zone dailies to unlock new areas, faction dailies for rep to get gear, Cooking and Fishing dailies everywhere, grind grind grind.
    Solo play for those who don't want to pvp/raid. It's content, and tied well into the current story. I'm just not seeing overload yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    Quests all reworked and for many people reset for Loremaster so they need to go back to do them again.
    It didn't reset loremaster. If you didn't have it before 4.0.1, you had to start over, yes, but for those who've done the content like myself it's good to have something extra, albeit unnecessary to do when our dailies are done or we're not raiding.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    Archeology, yeah lets not go there.
    I'll give you that, but for those farming the epics/vials it's fun. Nobody has to do it, but if you want to there are some nice rewards.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    Firelands rep runs, and every caster and their 3rd cousin now has Taragosa's Rest quest.
    Yeah, did this on my mage and got to the point where I have to collect shards. My mage (being an alt, mind you) is like 32nd in line to get this. Nobody has finished one just yet, so what if they're on the quest. Every 2h DPS was on the quest for Shadowmourne, and I'll bet the greater majority of them dropped the quest when they dinged 85, or are still working on it when they can pug a group.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    While there may not be a lot of new level 85 heroic dungeons, they made them exceptionally long so that most groups need an hour or more to do a run.
    what groups are these? Even most of the pugs I've joined recently have barely missed the bear timer on ZA, so we're clearing it pretty quickly. Definitely less than an hour average.


    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    It all kind of hit me when I logged in for my normal 3-4 hours of playing during the week, I had to get my Hyjal Dalies done, (30 minutes), Tol Barad was up shortly after, followed by Baradin Hold, (about an hour total), Signed up for Rated Battle grounds, (2 hours), leaving me 30 minutes to que up for a Heroic regular which I dropped from Que because it was a 35 minute wait, others were doing a troll and they had thier 5's. That did not include any time to knock out some quests towards zone achievments, farming for mats to earn some cash, or any raids. Its the same thing everyday, just different things going on that I feel I have to do. It has evolved into not so much a game I play to have fun and relax but a Part Time job that I work at 7 days a week.
    honestly, it sounds like time to take a break. Being entirely fair, you're trying to cram too much in at one time. I hold down a full time job in addition to being a writer and taking care of my wife and three boys. I find enough time to play the way I want to without sweating whether I'll get all 7 of my weekly randoms done, and I'm still gearing out in FL with my friends.

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    When I think back the downturn may have been when they lowered riding to level 20. If you wanted to run a dungeon it meant 2 people had to run, or ride there, if you were lucky they had the Flight Plan to there. Something as simple as doing Scarlet Monestary actually took some time to organize. The overall pace of the game was slower. It took me 5 months to level my first toon to 80. Now If I work at one I could probably do it in 2 weeks, 3 to get to 85.
    First there's too much to do, then it's too easy to do it. So, going by this, you want to have 6 things to do over the course of a week, but they should all take at least an hour, except for dungeons...

    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    If the game slowed down, would that really be a bad thing?
    I suppose it wouldn't, but in context of your post, you don't really even want that to happen.

  13. #13
    Field Marshal
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    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    Its the same thing everyday, just different things going on that I feel I have to do. It has evolved into not so much a game I play to have fun and relax but a Part Time job that I work at 7 days a week.When I think back the downturn may have been when they lowered riding to level 20. If you wanted to run a dungeon it meant 2 people had to run, or ride there, if you were lucky they had the Flight Plan to there. Something as simple as doing Scarlet Monestary actually took some time to organize. The overall pace of the game was slower.
    You talk about how you "have" to do all those things and that they are time consuming, yet we had dailies in TBC (and wotlk) that we "had" to do as well and they were no less time consuming. You talk about dungeon queues taking too much time, yet you embrace the old dungeon system when finding the people for a dungeon (standing in IF and spamming chat) and actually going there (running) probably took longer than today's queues. So either you have less free time now and therefore value your time more and don't want to spend it on doing the same thing in WOW that you have been doing for some years or you simply played it much more casually back in the day and didn't feel the need to do all of this stuff then. TLDR: Nothing has changed except your playstyle/view.

  14. #14
    OP, you are wrong.

    You may think that you are overwhelmed by the game, but you don't have to do all those things. And even then, people who HAVE done it all (such as the toon in my sig) still got sick of Cata, not because there is too much to do, but because outside of raiding, the "world" of warcraft is a bunch of queue times and waiting in the city.
    Why am I back here, I don't even play these games anymore

    The problem with the internet is parallel to its greatest achievement: it has given the little man an outlet where he can be heard. Most of the time however, the little man is a little man because he is not worth hearing.

  15. #15
    Because doing dailies is not fun. You're just a hamster on a wheel.

    Because killing Nefarian again isn't heroic.

    Because Deathwing is a terrible villain. I am gonna burn you herp, not really interesting. Don't care if there's some angry dragon flying around.

    WotLK was a guinea pig of an expansion but at least we got ulduar which made it awesome and h lk too. The rest was pretty horrid but at least people hung out together. Flying mounts wrecked community encounters and world pvp (what was left of it).

    This is only scratching the surface, there is so much wrong with cata...

  16. #16
    The Patient marathal's Avatar
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    I guess what I sort of mean is there is so much to do that is available to everyone very quickly. If that makes sense. When I was leveling, it took time and I learned my character. If I wanted to PvP it took some time to get decent gear. Same with raiding. Maybe its because I started playing 10 months into Wrath and I was not on a server full of people playing since Vanilla.

  17. #17
    The Patient
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    I thought what was wrong with cataclysm was the the world literally broke. Fix that and I think you'll fix the expansion.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by marathal View Post
    I guess what I sort of mean is there is so much to do that is available to everyone very quickly. If that makes sense. When I was leveling, it took time and I learned my character. If I wanted to PvP it took some time to get decent gear. Same with raiding. Maybe its because I started playing 10 months into Wrath and I was not on a server full of people playing since Vanilla.
    You started playing late into Wrath and you think you can figure out what's wrong with Cata >.<

    Also, starting late into Wrath meant that if you wanted to raid OR PvP meant gear could be attained VERY quickly.
    Why am I back here, I don't even play these games anymore

    The problem with the internet is parallel to its greatest achievement: it has given the little man an outlet where he can be heard. Most of the time however, the little man is a little man because he is not worth hearing.

  19. #19
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by chadiu View Post
    WOTLK was really horrible, Cata is bringing WoW back to it's awesomeness.
    I mean like what could go wrong? Cata is just epic???! raf 1-80, free epics all over the place, pvp gear is easy obtained, all can get the old titles. Seriously.. it's going the wrong direction, from being hard to easy. They downed firelands 25man hc ? in 2-3 weeks wtf?

  20. #20
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    The main problem with wow is the diverse market it caters for. You have Mr Joe Blogs who plays an hour a day and feels he is getting nowhere because he doesn't have time to raid, so can't gear and never really learns what raiding it all about. Then you have Mr John Smith who plays 10+ hours a day, steamrolls content in a few weeks and is sat around waiting for Mr Joe Bloggs and his friends to hurry up so new content can be released.

    Blizzard cannot please everyone, they have to cater for the majority which unfortunately are casuals. I'm working on heroic ragnaros atm and it is an incredibly tough fight that I can see lasting me at least a month. That should keep me occupied!

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