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  1. #541
    Fluffy Kitten Zoma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lokann View Post
    Hamuul states that Tortolla has been 'a part of Azeroth since the time of the Titans'. So he's been around back when the Titans first came (or at least when they left).
    Is there anything that says the Titans were responsible for Tortolla, or did he come into existence naturally at around the time of the Titans? Also, did the demigods come at about the same time, or did some/many exist before others?

  2. #542
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoma View Post
    Is there anything that says the Titans were responsible for Tortolla, or did he come into existence naturally at around the time of the Titans? Also, did the demigods come at about the same time, or did some/many exist before others?
    Some are older than others. As for the other question, no idea. There is no real evidence to support the Ancients being created by the Titans, but it is not impossible.

  3. #543
    Quote Originally Posted by Zoma View Post
    I've been browsing Wowpedia, and I can't find anything that indicates that the ancients came after the Titans visited Azeroth. I'm not sure what the paradox is.

    As for not hearing about a bull ancient before, there are plenty of demigods. There is no reason we would know all of them. In WotA, when the ancients join the battle, no exact number is given, but there is said to be "scores of other unique figures" (score = 20). This implies there are at least 40 (minimum, there are probably more), and some of these ones can be the progenitor ancients.
    The paradox is that it is stated that when titans got to Azeroth only elementals and Old Gods were present, that was latter retconned but if Tauren are in Azeroth be4 the titans and they descend form an ancient then so all the killboar, harpies, wolfs, turtles and an immense amount of other beings that are similar to ancients.

    It is never said that Ancients existed before Titans, but it was stated that the vast majority of life in azeroth either came from the Titans or the curse of flesh.

    So proof by obscurity (lack of proof against it) is not valid sorry.
    Saying that there is not paradox because there's no proof against it is like saying god exists because there's nothing that proves it doesn't.

    The same I can say about there are ancients we never heard about.

    This can later be retconed but what I'm saying is so far, in lore, points that this is a paradox.
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  4. #544
    Fluffy Kitten Zoma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by esmifra View Post
    The paradox is that it is stated that when titans got to Azeroth only elementals and Old Gods were present, that was latter retconned but if Tauren are in Azeroth be4 the titans and they descend form an ancient then so all the killboar, harpies, wolfs, turtles and an immense amount of other beings that are similar to ancients.
    Where is it stated that it was only elementals and Old Gods?

    It is never said that Ancients existed before Titans, but it was stated that the vast majority of life in azeroth either came from the Titans or the curse of flesh.
    Vast majority as in pretty much every non-animal sentient being beside trolls and their descendants? And again, where is this statement?

    So proof by obscurity (lack of proof against it) is not valid sorry.
    Saying that there is not paradox because there's no proof against it is like saying god exists because there's nothing that proves it doesn't.
    I'm not saying there is no proof against it. I'm saying there is no proof for it (Unless you can show me the statement that Azeroth was just elementals and Old Gods, I would consider that proof).

    The same I can say about there are ancients we never heard about.

    This can later be retconed but what I'm saying is so far, in lore, points that this is a paradox.
    Honestly, most of this seems more like filling in the blanks as opposed to contradictions.

  5. #545
    Dreadlord shimargh's Avatar
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    so much religious ppl, OMG.

    more ot...
    taurens were nomads, they never settled anywere, they just went by hunting and chasing the "goodol'whitegiantstag" for living, leaving as soon as the hunt ended and going somewhere else. Maybe they just never get caught in elemental/old crossfire.
    besides that, taurens somewhere, sometime get "one each against other", get wild, or whatever, after hearing "starnge whispers", this is rumored to be part of an old god "plot".
    Last edited by shimargh; 2011-08-18 at 02:35 PM.
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    A year from now someone on these forums is gonna say that the (wod) launch went smoothly..... I am gonna remind that asshole of this launch, this shit is not going smoothly at all.

  6. #546
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    Quote Originally Posted by esmifra View Post
    Also we've never heard of an "Bull" like ancient before...
    There's lots of Ancients, it's just possibly nobody has yet seen him

    Numerous unnamed Ancients appeared in a few scenes of The Sundering alongside known ancients and other forest races.[10]
    A being resembling a wolverine
    A tiny red fox with a sly yet gnomish visage
    A winged panther with hands almost human (possibly tol'vir-related or a tol'vir ancestor)
    Sword-wielding pixies of a sort
    A reptilian warrior with a shell reminiscent of a turtle's (possibly Tortolla)
    Male figures with hooded faces and whose flesh (what little there was visible) was oak bark. (possibly ancients)
    A humanoid stick bug race (possibly aqir-related or an aqir ancestor)
    A squat warrior

  7. #547
    It was retconed I can't find but when I started playing I read the story in their site and it was said that Titans were a force that shaped the planets they encountered working on them and then leaving when finished.

    That was what un'goro was all about a test lab for titans, you could see with the amount of life available there that was not original of azeroth but was introduced by the titans.

    Also from what I recall it said that when they got to azeroth they found elementals and old gods, fought them, imprisoned them and then started to shape the world as they wanted.

    But might be wrong and from what I found now its all similar but different, even in warcraft site and the last time it was changed was in 2011, i tried to find a site from 2006 or something but couldn't so I'm not going to insist.

    I'll accept you are right in line of what the lore is now. But i could bet that previously stated clearly that in azeroth only existed elementals and old gods.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oradraffe View Post
    MoP is not happening i can promise that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tric619 View Post
    Been playing since week 1 and still believe Mop is the next expac? >.>
    Quote Originally Posted by Feyrzhuk View Post
    MoP will never be a WoW expansion. Feel free to flame and ridicule me should I be proven wrong.

  8. #548
    Quote Originally Posted by esmifra View Post
    It was retconed I can't find but when I started playing I read the story in their site and it was said that Titans were a force that shaped the planets they encountered working on them and then leaving when finished.

    That was what un'goro was all about a test lab for titans, you could see with the amount of life available there that was not original of azeroth but was introduced by the titans.

    Also from what I recall it said that when they got to azeroth they found elementals and old gods, fought them, imprisoned them and then started to shape the world as they wanted.

    But might be wrong and from what I found now its all similar but different, even in warcraft site and the last time it was changed was in 2011, i tried to find a site from 2006 or something but couldn't so I'm not going to insist.

    I'll accept you are right in line of what the lore is now. But i could bet that previously stated clearly that in azeroth only existed elementals and old gods.
    If I recall the old lore correct, it was stated the old gods ruled Azeroth with their elementals in chaos, and the titans fought them and eventually subdued them and ordered the world, but it wasn't mentioned which race existed at the time.

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