[Moonkin] Guide :: 5.4 Edition

[Deleted]

Hamlet from EJ wrote:

Haste rating:
425 haste rating gives 1% spell haste. Haste adds extra DoT ticks at certain points. Assuming the haste benefits of Moonkin Form and Nature's Grace, breakpoints occur at 5273, 10289, and 15318 (see WrathCalcs for more). With the 4-piece T14 bonus, they are instead at 3706, 8089, and 12517. You should typically maintain the first breakpoint, but not worry about stacking haste up to reach the higher ones.

but he also wrote:

The stat priority at the moment can be summarized as:
Int >> hit (to cap) > haste (to breakpoint) > crit = excess hit (reforged to crit)* ~= half Int (gems) > haste > mastery

Crit, overall. Single target, both are roughly equal, but crit is better for multidotting.

So I should go for Crit and ignore Hastebreakpoint#2 . Is there any math that shows this or is it just what you/other people experienced in T14 ?

[Lilija]

In the topic of haste vs crit the thing is that the difference isn't that huge. On a patchwerk fight going for haste breakpoints #2 on paper is slightly more valuable. However, in movement fights, crit works much better due to more SS procs. And since T14 had rather significant amounts of movement or other rotation breaking elements, the general agreement is that crit simply will make our lives easier.

[castoramix]

with the 4 p bonus and after reach the 8089 haste breack point, the 12th tick gained give an additionnal 9% chance ss proc because the 12th tick can crit too
So maybe the crit loss by reach the haste cap doens't really down the overall ss proc rate

[Lilija]

with the 4 p bonus and after reach the 8089 haste breack point, the 12th tick gained give an additionnal 9% chance ss proc because the 12th tick can crit too
So maybe the crit loss by reach the haste cap doens't really down the overall ss proc rate

More crit is more convinience - that's really the whole point. You want more chance to have that SS proc when have you to move while out of eclipse and spamming MF/SnF will overwrite buffed DoT.

[Stommped]

Back to VP, you'll definitely want 3k going in. There is a 522 neck from neutral and bracers, ring, trinket from friendly.

[Deleted]

If we are taking HotW in 5.2, would we start gemming for Int (brilliant, purified, potent) or are the current gems (smooth, misty) still better?

[huth]

No, crit still beats int on gems.

[lolstorm]

Minor error in your post. You left out 14.0 Tips, Tricks, and Variations and made 14.0 Addons instead without changing the index.

1.0 Welcome
2.0 How to get help
3.0 Choosing a race
4.0 Stats n’ caps
5.0 Stat weights
6.0 Gems
8.0 Talents
9.0 Glyphs
10.0 Enchants
11.0 Professions
12.0 Consumables
13.0 Eclipse Phases and Rotation
14.0 Tips, Tricks, and Variations
15.0 Useful addons


14.0 Useful addons

[Fountaiin]

Any mathlords out there have the actual numbers for our two and four piece?

Wrathcalcs has these numbers for my gear, 513 ilvl troll. Will be 518ish for 5.2.

2P: 5196
4P: 7795

I've heard 4p should be around 2.5% - 3% dps boost on patchwerk, but I've never been too keen on WC estimations for tier bonuses, especially when we consider how 2p interacts with the crit trinket.

[Deleted]

I have two questions regarding Starsurge.

Should I cast Starsurge on cooldown during Solar Eclipse (once and then hold the second cast off until I am at 5 Energy) or should I only cast it if Shooting Stars procs, given it costs more energy than Wrath?

If I am one cast away from Eclipse and Shooting Stars procs, I assume I should hold off casting it until I reach Eclipse?
And when I reach Eclipse the cast priority would be: Eclipsed DoT > Starfall > Shooting Stars?

And I have one question regarding refreshing DoTs.

Assume the following scenario:
- Nature's Grace is still up
- Moonfire is about to expire but I will soon (in 2-4 seconds or so) reach Lunar Eclipse OR Sunfire is about to expire but I will soon (in 2-4 seconds or so) reach Solar Eclipse

Should I wait until reaching Eclipse to cast the DoT (meaning there's no DoT up for a few seconds) or should I cast it as soon as it expires to ensure highest possible uptime?

If Nature's Grace isn't up any more, I'd wait until Eclipse.
If Moonfire drops off but I am not reaching Lunar Eclipse soon or if Sunfire drops off but I am not reaching Solar Eclipse soon, then I would refresh them asap.

But in the situation described above, where the appropriate Eclipse will be reached soon, I am not sure which is the better action to take.

[Deleted]

Hi. I have a trinket question.

I'm currently getting ready to start raiding on my Moonkin (current ilvl 463, basically full "5-man Heroic" gear). The question is; I currently have the Zen Alchemist Stone (upgraded version) equipped, and I'll soon enough have the Shieldwall caster trinket. Is it worth going for the Serpent deck (Relic of Yu'lon)? I did some comparing and the Alchemist stone proc seems much stronger than Yu'lon, but the passive Int on Yu'lon would be better than the Stone, right?

[Deleted]

According to my Wrath Calcs calculations, Relic of Yu'lon is the third strongest trinket in the game at this point.

[Alzu]

Should I cast Starsurge on cooldown during Solar Eclipse (once and then hold the second cast off until I am at 5 Energy) or should I only cast it if Shooting Stars procs, given it costs more energy than Wrath?

It depends a bit on your gear and the situation. If you don't get many Shooting Stars procs, then use one and then hold the next one for 5 energy but if you're going with high amounts of crit (9k+) or are multidotting, you're going to see many situations where you'll get multiple procs for a single eclipse, then cast it when it procs.

If I am one cast away from Eclipse and Shooting Stars procs, I assume I should hold off casting it until I reach Eclipse?
And when I reach Eclipse the cast priority would be: Eclipsed DoT > Starfall > Shooting Stars?

Hold the cast off, unless you're getting many procs as described above.

As for the priority, use dots, then SS, then Starfall. You don't need to get Starfall always cast straight off cooldown as the amount of Starfalls is dependant only on your eclipse pace. Its damage is only variable is targets and lunar eclipse buff and if you get the full duration in lunar after a few globals, then it still maximized its damage.

Assume the following scenario:
- Nature's Grace is still up
- Moonfire is about to expire but I will soon (in 2-4 seconds or so) reach Lunar Eclipse OR Sunfire is about to expire but I will soon (in 2-4 seconds or so) reach Solar Eclipse

Should I wait until reaching Eclipse to cast the DoT (meaning there's no DoT up for a few seconds) or should I cast it as soon as it expires to ensure highest possible uptime?

If you refresh a dot just before you're entering an eclipse, be it with Nature's Grace or not, you will have to clip the soon-to-be-eclipsed dot because you won't most likely stay in the respective eclipse for more than 10 seconds and crits etc. add time to the dot. Just wait for the next eclipse to refresh.

Why are your scenarios with only one dot, btw? Most of the time you'll refresh both of the dots at the same time.

[Deleted]

It depends a bit on your gear and the situation. If you don't get many Shooting Stars procs, then use one and then hold the next one for 5 energy but if you're going with high amounts of crit (9k+) or are multidotting, you're going to see many situations where you'll get multiple procs for a single eclipse, then cast it when it procs.

*nods* But what about Starsurges which aren't instant? Is it worth casting those at all during Solar Eclipse?

Why are your scenarios with only one dot, btw? Most of the time you'll refresh both of the dots at the same time.

Because the other DoT definitely should get refreshed asap if it's about to expire and it will be a long time until the respective Eclipse is reached.

So for example, if I am close to Lunar Eclipse and Sunfire is about to drop off, I will always refresh it straight away. That part was obvious to me but I was wondering what to do with Moonfire in this situation.

[huth]

Starsurge does more damage than Starfire with the cast time of Wrath. The first one in Solar is always worth casting.

Also, if you're close to an eclipse, don't refresh your DoTs. Even the non-eclipsed one still benefits from NG.

[Deleted]

Starsurge does more damage than Starfire with the cast time of Wrath. The first one in Solar is always worth casting.

Noted, thanks.

Also, if you're close to an eclipse, don't refresh your DoTs. Even the non-eclipsed one still benefits from NG.

You are right but I was talking about a situation where Nature's Grace is still up. In this case it's definitely worth it to refresh the DoT which won't benefit from an Eclipse which is coming soon.

---------- Post added 2013-02-25 at 05:16 PM ----------

I hope it's ok to post it here instead of starting a new thread.

I am wondering what the optimal rotation for Heroic Will of the Emperor and Wind Lord Mel'jarak is.

Will of the Emperor HC

When is the best time to use Incarnation+Nature's Vigil followed by Celestial Alignment?
Given the first set of Emperor's Rages is going to get CC-ed, I assume there is no point in doing the usual opening rotation at the start and I should save the big cooldowns until a later point? When Emperor's Courages spawn perhaps?

What complicates matters even more is that we can't use Starfall if Rages are CC-ed because it will break it.

Wind Lord Mel'jarak HC

Incarnation+Nature's Vigil, followed by Celestial Alignment is saved until the boss gains Recklessness but I am wondering how to best start the fight.

Option 1:
- one cast away from Lunar
- Starfall > Pre-Pot > Wrath
- Moonfire on all mobs
- Starfall (when the first one ends)
- Shooting Stars whenever it's up (assuming Moonfire is up on all mobs)
- Sunfire (assuming Moonfire is up on all mobs and Shooting Stars is not up)
- once I get to Solar Eclipse, Hurricane to finish the first pack off and when they are close to dying, start going back towards Lunar Eclipse and do the usual opening rotation once boss gains Recklessness (does DBM spam a warning when he gains it or do I need to configure it manually somehow?)

Option 2:
- one cast away from Solar
- Starfall > Pre-Pot > Starfire
- Hurricane (or Sunfire up on all the mobs first?) and when the first pack is close to dying, start going back towards Lunar Eclipse and do the usual opening rotation once boss gains Recklessness

(Or is it not worth to cast Hurricanes after Nature's Grace drops off and I should start cycling between Eclipses while keeping Eclipsed DoT up on all mobs after NG drops off?)

[Alzu]

For Will of the Emperor, I have no clue as you CC stuff. I haven't had any experience with that strategy.

For Mel'jarak, start one cast off Solar, pre-pot and starfire followed by a few dots if you have Light of the Cosmos. Start spamming hurricane after a few dots and keep doing it until the first set of adds is getting low and start making your way into one cast off lunar and be ready to pop cooldowns.

[Deleted]

For Will of the Emperor, I have no clue as you CC stuff. I haven't had any experience with that strategy.

Actually, I was wrong. We decided to kill the Emperor's Rages straight away.

I guess doing the standard opening rotation at the start is still worth it because it means it's going to go off cooldown earlier and you'll be able to use it more times during the fight?

As ranged my given target priority is: Rages > Courage > Strengths > Boss

As far as the other mobs go, I just make sure I leave the Eclipsed DoT on all of them if no Rages are up and Uneclipsed DoT as well if I have enough time.

But I'm unsure about the most efficient way of dealing with the Rages. I was putting the Eclipsed DoT on all of them and then using nukes but since we use various CCs and slows to keep them in one place and as they don't live very long, perhaps Astral Storm/Hurricane would be a better idea?

For Mel'jarak, start one cast off Solar, pre-pot and starfire followed by a few dots if you have Light of the Cosmos. Start spamming hurricane after a few dots and keep doing it until the first set of adds is getting low and start making your way into one cast off lunar and be ready to pop cooldowns.

Thank you, that makes sense. I don't have Light of the Cosmos (Essence of Terror and Relic of Yu'lon) but I guess it might still be worth it to Sunfire all mobs first before popping Hurricane? Or should I just Hurricane then?

[Deleted]

Hi,

as I just started playing my druid as mainspecc moonkin, I'm still struggling with some of the aspects of gearing / gemming / etc. It would be great, if you guys could help me out.

One issue that I'm aware of: My trinkets aren't optimal. As they both have static haste on them, I got a lot of extra haste. I just don't have the extra vp atm to invest into an static int trinket and Sha denies dropping his in LFR . So probably I'll just have to try to get one asap in the next tier.

Some questions that puzzle me atm, after having tried out Simcraft.
1. Clearly, T14 has not many Patchwerk-style fights. Any suggestions for which other model to use in Simcraft to get more realistic results? Right now I'm using Light Movement.
2. For reforging purposes: Simcraft gave me the following stat weights (I used "Light Movement" in the fight type options).

Int Spi SP Hit Crit Haste Mastery
3.70 2.59 0.00 2.59 1.62 1.38 1.48
1.00 0.70 0.00 0.70 0.44 0.37 0.40

Do I use those figures generally? After / before haste cap? Does Simcraft even calculate with hastecap?

Thx for any answers and help.

Andym@Teldrassil-EU

[Deleted]

Your gemming is all wrong. You should be using:
- 320 Crit gems in Yellow slots
- 80 Int and 160 Crit gems in Red slots
- 160 Crit and 160 Spirit gems in Blue slots

You are missing a Major Glyph. Both Glyph of Rebirth (if there are no Warlocks able to res to full health in your raid) and Glyph of Stampeding Roar provide very good raid utility.

You could socket one 320 Haste gem and reach the Haste cap this way but I think that at your gear level, you'd be sacrificing too much Crit.