[Megathread] StarCraft 2

[Deleted]

Why DTs need a buff is beyond me. I really like the nerf to Mines, because I love to play Marine/Tank and my TvZ was way better in WoL with Tanks. But I doubt that alot of changes are going through.
But I hope for some Protoss Nerfs. If I look at the latest WCS Kr qualifiers and WCS EU ...its PvPvPvPvPvPvP ...

[Charge me Doctor]

Why DTs need a buff is beyond me. I really like the nerf to Mines, because I love to play Marine/Tank and my TvZ was way better in WoL with Tanks. But I doubt that alot of changes are going through.
But I hope for some Protoss Nerfs. If I look at the latest WCS Kr qualifiers and WCS EU ...its PvPvPvPvPvPvP ...

They become obsolete as soon as enemy builds any kind of detection.

I would like to see some transfer in "power" from Colossi/High Templars to Dark Templars and Oracles.

[MerinPally]

For the whole PvPvPvPvP thing... umm yeah just wait until you actually get into the tournament. Complain all you want but the race spread is not that uneven. On top of that, just go look at the previous season... Whilst Protoss dominated Europe, all the "later" rounds are mainly Terrans and quite literally a tiny handful of Zerg. It's not that protoss is OP because the great Zerg players are still winning, and Terran has been really exceptional all expansion. You make it sound like it's skewed in Protoss favour but go look at tournament results and it really isn't.

- - - Updated - - -

They become obsolete as soon as enemy builds any kind of detection.

I would like to see some transfer in "power" from Colossi/High Templars to Dark Templars and Oracles.

I wouldn't say obsolete at all. When I'm on 3 bases looking to take a 4th or I know the game is going to continue, I always build a Dark Shrine if I don't already have one just because saving that little extra gas when morphing Archons is great, assuming I'm not interested in more storms. Also, one or two mixed into a big army if they don't have a Raven or you take out an Overseer can be surprisingly good, you just need to keep them at the back like you would your HT/Colossi.

[Charge me Doctor]

I wouldn't say obsolete at all. When I'm on 3 bases looking to take a 4th or I know the game is going to continue, I always build a Dark Shrine if I don't already have one just because saving that little extra gas when morphing Archons is great, assuming I'm not interested in more storms. Also, one or two mixed into a big army if they don't have a Raven or you take out an Overseer can be surprisingly good, you just need to keep them at the back like you would your HT/Colossi.

Well, you can also use them as an upgraded "zealot counterattack" in late game. But adding DTs in army usually end them being killed because they are fragile, slow and cockblocked by blink stalkers =\ And it's very rare to see overseer-less zerg in late.

Also it depends on army size and your ability to micro, but from what i've seen from my own replays - weaving DTs isn't working for me

[Deletedaccount1]

I mean I guess its not that big of a deal and its easy to counter oracles, its just sometimes they hit so early that I just never think to put missile turrets up in time and also they are used so inconsistently.

[May90]

They become obsolete as soon as enemy builds any kind of detection.

I would like to see some transfer in "power" from Colossi/High Templars to Dark Templars and Oracles.

Wouldn't say DTs become obsolete. In high-level tournaments you often see a few DTs wipe out one or two expansions in the late game, when the opponent just doesn't have any free units not engaged in maneuvering against your army.
Their cloaking ability becomes rather obsolete, that's right. But their insane damage lets them wipe out large number of buildings very fast. And, if they are engaged, they can always merge into Archons and pull of some attacks.

DTs are, like Banshees or Oracles, fragile but powerful. They are not meant to be used in a full-scale engagements, but, rather, for harass and surprise attacks. And they are really good at it.

I mean I guess its not that big of a deal and its easy to counter oracles, its just sometimes they hit so early that I just never think to put missile turrets up in time and also they are used so inconsistently.

Doesn't seem to be a problem to me. If the opponents goes early Oracles, he has to sacrifice his economy for it. All you need to do is to pull away your workers when he comes with Oracles, then, when their charge is over, you have many options: early pressure, expand, etc. Oracles are good for harass but really bad in actual fights, so your opponent will have a lot of trouble in the late game.
In this regard, early Oracles are like cannon rush: they can be dangerous if you don't know what to do against them, but they lose badly otherwise.
That said, Oracles are still a very good unit, very underrated, as said above. Just their use in early game seems... problematic.

[Charge me Doctor]

Wouldn't say DTs become obsolete. In high-level tournaments you often see a few DTs wipe out one or two expansions in the late game, when the opponent just doesn't have any free units not engaged in maneuvering against your army.
Their cloaking ability becomes rather obsolete, that's right. But their insane damage lets them wipe out large number of buildings very fast. And, if they are engaged, they can always merge into Archons and pull of some attacks.

Yeah, that's just stupid usage of word "obsolete" from me. I meant that if enemy scouts your DT shrine, he builds detector and you are fucked in a lot of means (you could go stargate or robo or high templars and mix couple with gateway units, if you time it with 1/1 you are ready to engage and often that's enough to cripple enemy or win). I just want to see DT having one single skill to use, so they will be able to support your army in other means but damage (like maelstorm of dark archons)

[Stir]

Yeah, that's just stupid usage of word "obsolete" from me. I meant that if enemy scouts your DT shrine, he builds detector and you are fucked in a lot of means (you could go stargate or robo or high templars and mix couple with gateway units, if you time it with 1/1 you are ready to engage and often that's enough to cripple enemy or win). I just want to see DT having one single skill to use, so they will be able to support your army in other means but damage (like maelstorm of dark archons)

It's cheaper to morph archons from DTs than it is from HTs, simply because DTs themselves are cheaper. So if you're going for an Archon build, it'd make sense to build DTs anyway, and use them where and when you can. If you see no current use for them, but need army flesh, just morph them.

[May90]

Yeah, that's just stupid usage of word "obsolete" from me. I meant that if enemy scouts your DT shrine, he builds detector and you are fucked in a lot of means (you could go stargate or robo or high templars and mix couple with gateway units, if you time it with 1/1 you are ready to engage and often that's enough to cripple enemy or win). I just want to see DT having one single skill to use, so they will be able to support your army in other means but damage (like maelstorm of dark archons)

Well, seeing forge at 2:00 in PvP means your opponent is fucked a lot, but it doesn't mean forge is bad overall. People tend to use DT at 9:00 or 10:00 or so which is a very cheesy play and is easily countered by getting any kind of detection (unless Dark Shrine is built exclusively for Archons, though I don't think getting Archons so early is viable either, given the amount of resources you need to spend to get the necessary tech). But getting DTs in some stages of game is very strong, especially in middle-to-late game where each player has at least 3 expansions and it becomes hard to defend all bases at the same time.

Same with Oracles and Banshees. Fast Banshee or fast Oracle are easily countered if you can spot them in time. It doesn't mean Banshees and Oracles are useless, it just means that cheesy play with these units is not viable against more or less solid players.

That said, DTs are certainly not the "winning" unit. It's hard to think of a situation when getting or not getting DTs means win or loss. But they certainly help in many cases. Especially against Terran which doesn't have mobile detection except for Raven (which is very expensive) and can't cover large amount of map with detection.

[3DTyrant]

Not too sure if this is in the right place for the topic, but I couldn't see anywhere else to post it, so feel free to move it where it should be, but anyway:

I'm considering buying StarCraft 2 and Heart of the Swarm (yes, yes, I'm extremely late to the party for this game, sue me :P) and I have seen the Dulux Digital Edition on the Blizz website (think it's like £40 or so). Would it be cheaper to buy it this way, and if I do, will I get a free upgrade for the collector's edition of HotS?

[Deleted]

Can't help you if you really want the digital deluxe edition, but usually I'd try online retailers other than blizzard first, they usually have lower prices, sometimes WAY lower if you are lucky.

[bals]

You have to buy each game separate regardless of the version.

[AeneasBK]

In case you were not aware, with the free trial version, if you group into a part with someone who has the full version or HotS it will temporarily bump up your version to teh same one, so if you have battletag mates who already own HotS etc. you can try it out before you buy...

Just in case you didn't know.

[Deleted]

Wow, MC played so good in the second series against Thorzain, blinking to avoid widow mine damage, even managing to dodge a widow mine shot while right on top of the mine, so sick.

[Deletedaccount1]

u should man its a good game

[kel]

I believe Sc2 is 50% off right now and Hots is 25% off, so if you do want to get it now would be a good time

[MerinPally]

The new Carbot about the Nydus worm, I genuinely believe that's one of the best episodes yet. By a good margin.

[Deletedaccount1]

The new Carbot about the Nydus worm, I genuinely believe that's one of the best episodes yet. By a good margin.

when the worker 1 hit the nydus rofl

[Charge me Doctor]

Guys, can someone share your personal protoss builds to play with? I just realised that i never play from the book, i always do some random stuff and keep being in 1-15 seconds late to something (starting upgrade, transitioning, getting base and so on)

[May90]

Guys, can someone share your personal protoss builds to play with? I just realised that i never play from the book, i always do some random stuff and keep being in 1-15 seconds late to something (starting upgrade, transitioning, getting base and so on)

I never follow any builds either. All I know for Toss is 9 Pylon, chronoboost, chronoboost again and 12 Gateway with Pylon and Cybernetics Core followed. I guess builds won't help you that much, unless you are in Grandmaster league or something.