Shadowlands: Chains of Domination and Burning Crusade: Classic

Originally Posted by Kithelle

But I thought they wanted classic for the old system, if that's true then I guess they never really cared about classic much

Well they did... that's why Classic was such a success after all. However suggesting that we should get fresh TBC servers so everyone starts at 0 is just dumb. It doesn't make sense to make everyone start at 0 as this wasn't how it was back then (it's an expansion after all) and everyone excited for TBC will be forced to replay days or weeks worth of content (that they are also naturally a bit tired of) first so that they can actually get into the TBC content.

Letting everyone naturally progress into TBC how it was back then is also neither bad or unfair to anyone. I also don't get some people's concerns about the economy... Most players here are up for a surprise just how easy it is to make gold in TBC. It's much faster and easier to get the 1000g for flying at lvl70 than it was getting the 100g for riding in classic.

Originally Posted by Argorwal

You mean the same formula for 16 straight years of release new quests/zones/dungeons/raids in a patch?

Basically more of what WoW is?

What did you expect, a patch of non-WoW related stuff?

Legion, BFA and SL have the same structure, the same systems with different names and minor tweaks. There is nothing similar systems wise about Wrath and Cata, Then cata to MoP for examples. It's a formula thats been revealing itself. We had Artifact power, then we had Azerite now we have Anima. M+ has been a freebie for them too, literally the same dungeons with a day of coding to make an affix. Flight is delayed for a patch or two to act as "new" content. It's a cookie cutter now and people will leap in front of any criticism for their beloved company.

Originally Posted by Varitok

Legion, BFA and SL have the same structure, the same systems with different names and minor tweaks. There is nothing similar systems wise about Wrath and Cata, Then cata to MoP for examples. It's a formula thats been revealing itself. We had Artifact power, then we had Azerite now we have Anima. M+ has been a freebie for them too, literally the same dungeons with a day of coding to make an affix. Flight is delayed for a patch or two to act as "new" content. It's a cookie cutter now and people will leap in front of any criticism for their beloved company.

To be honest Wrath and Cata just didn’t add much in most patches other than the new raid.

What was added in the Wrath patches?

Ulduar patch was...3 dailies to start building the argent tournament?

ToC was a new raid and dungeon (all in the same location except 1 boss), all reskin models, and daily hub.

ICC patch is 3 new dungeons for catchup.

No new zones, minimal new content (1 hub in 3 patches), etc.

Cata is similar with a quick reskin dungeon (ZA and ZG) but at least Molten Front was a new area. Basically the only new area/hub as well. 3 new catchup dungeons in 4.3 (same as wrath) except they just made them in already existing locations to save art assets.

At least Legions reskin of Kara completely changed the second half with entirely new area and fights (4 of 8 bosses) ending on a Legion ship.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by blankfaced

Apologies, I didn't play through legion so I was unaware they rereleased a raid as a dungeon and set a precedent for future dungeon releases.

Half of RTK was completely new. This wasn’t a Cata style reskin a raid into a dungeon.

Originally Posted by Gadzooks

Fourth: Blackrock Depths. First mega dungeon, all the way back in vanilla.

Blackrock Depths, Blackrock Spire, Dire Maul, and Stratholme were all OG mega dungeons.

Originally Posted by Varitok

Legion, BFA and SL have the same structure, the same systems with different names and minor tweaks. There is nothing similar systems wise about Wrath and Cata, Then cata to MoP for examples. It's a formula thats been revealing itself. We had Artifact power, then we had Azerite now we have Anima. M+ has been a freebie for them too, literally the same dungeons with a day of coding to make an affix. Flight is delayed for a patch or two to act as "new" content. It's a cookie cutter now and people will leap in front of any criticism for their beloved company.

Wait so you are saying that Wrath and Cata are different?

As someone who's just recently played both expansions on private servers I can safely say that you're just wrong. Cataclysm is almost identical to Wrath in almost every way possible besides the talent tree (which even wasn't that different as they kept many of the same talents). The endgame content, gearing process, crafting and class design is pretty much identical. Cataclysm feels more like an expansion to wrath than an expansion to all of WoW... that's how similar they feel. The biggest difference between them of course is the theme, the zones etc, but even here in the zone design you can see the similarities and especially the linear leveling system.

Overall I agree with the other guy. It is undeniable that WoW has been more or less the same since at least TBC. This is also the reason why they even bother changing classes (that work well) or add arbitrary systems, so that the game feels different (the overall formula stays the same).

Heck, the reason why Cataclysm was received so poorly (it wasn't really criticised for being a bad expansion, but for the lack of content) is in fact because it literally was a SMALLER wrath with QoL changes and an (arguably) shittier theme/story. I even remember this very well back then, because most of my IRL friends stopped playing in Cata precisely because of that. "Same shit, different colour"

Originally Posted by Tente

Is that Arthas ? ..Sylvanas as a raid boss ? ok, sylvanas is still my queen but I feel the hype going up fast

It’s Anduin and despite the genocide Sylvanis will be redeemed because it’s a terrible idea

I am really hyped for Classic TBC as an Alliance Shaman main. Classic was always a bit awkward having to choose between my class and my faction.

"leaks" to sell blizzcon tickets

Originally Posted by RobertMugabe

Wait so you are saying that Wrath and Cata are different?

As someone who's just recently played both expansions on private servers I can safely say that you're just wrong. Cataclysm is almost identical to Wrath in almost every way possible besides the talent tree (which even wasn't that different as they kept many of the same talents). The endgame content, gearing process, crafting and class design is pretty much identical. Cataclysm feels more like an expansion to wrath than an expansion to all of WoW... that's how similar they feel. The biggest difference between them of course is the theme, the zones etc, but even here in the zone design you can see the similarities and especially the linear leveling system.

Overall I agree with the other guy. It is undeniable that WoW has been more or less the same since at least TBC. This is also the reason why they even bother changing classes (that work well) or add arbitrary systems, so that the game feels different (the overall formula stays the same).

Heck, the reason why Cataclysm was received so poorly (it wasn't really criticised for being a bad expansion, but for the lack of content) is in fact because it literally was a SMALLER wrath with QoL changes and an (arguably) shittier theme/story. I even remember this very well back then, because most of my IRL friends stopped playing in Cata precisely because of that. "Same shit, different colour"

Cataclysm was not a great expansion, it killed whole servers. Questing was bad and Vashjir was terrible. Not to mention DS went on forever.

Category is... Lich King eleganza extravaganza!

Not really seeing what is wrong with this patch and I don't even like WoW.

Originally Posted by Wangming

Not really seeing what is wrong with this patch and I don't even like WoW.

Just playing along here, but doesn't you not liking WoW perhaps explain the difference as to why people who do indeed Like it aren't thrilled?

Wouldn't they by assumption, more than likely care more about it, and in so have a bolder stance on whether something was wrong with the patch?

Originally Posted by MasterHamster

First in almost 15 years to complain about replacing muh t2 and t3 with greens and look like a clown
Aaah, the good ol' days

IMHO. I still think transmog was one of the qualities of life feature they should have added to Classic/ClassicTBC. But that is just me.

Originally Posted by Kithelle

But I thought they wanted classic for the old system, if that's true then I guess they never really cared about classic much

what the heck are you saying?starting from zero in tbc would be the oposite of the classic experience....people want to experience the progression from classic to tbc,doing this way should have been expected,this is the most accurate way

Originally Posted by MysticBard

Unlock flying in the Covenants’ four domains; and much more
REALLY BLIZZ ?
We wait to get fly, only to have on the 4 old, not-relevant-anymore zones ?

I have a suggestion, on the new zone, let the players only have the RP-walk only, cause running on maw was too fast already, you can slow down this too ! $^#@#@^&&

meh... seems you never played wow in classic =z

ummm tempting offer for going back to tbc but hard pass. I'll wait out for Wotlk classic one *if any chance*

pretty boring actually... We already knew TBC was coming (we just wonder how they will do it with characters) and that patch looks pretty meh. (comes from a all-time wow fan).

Originally Posted by Kiwijello

It's clear they have a formula they are following now in order to churn out carbon copy expansions. This feels less than exciting. More of the same. Was hoping for something, ANYTHING new. This is just more filler with artwork.

I mean it's WoW? What else do you expect? It's working formula and it chucks way more content at us than old style expansions where the only new this would be new talent or a class. We get new dungeons, new raids and new gear. Every expansion and it works. Since Legion they came up with nice thing - max level alternative character progression tho I think it was greatest in Legion.
At least we get some new power to play every expansion now, which is ofc. debatable because "borrowed powers" are highly criticized for some legit reasons and we get some nice content too, be it Class Halls, Mage tower, Visions, Withered Minigames, Torghast, Islands, WFs. Not all of that was well received but it's still better than MoP farm and certainly better than doing same 5 daily quests in argent tournament. Which by the way does not mean that old expansions were bad, for that time it was good, but for current playerbase it would be as "busy" as warlords were if you did not raid.

"I mean it's WoW? What else do you expect?"

No expectations. Hope. And they said "You can't kill hope", but they did. I am not excited by the current game state. I was HOPING they would introduce something new or move in a new direction, but it's sailing straight ahead whether some of us like it or not. I used to be surprised by the announcements and now, well, you can almost guess them before they happen. I mean, I already posted a couple months ago about Andy becoming the Lich King. Even the writing is meh. I really was just hoping for something I can't even define. Something "fresh" maybe. But I think they are out of ideas, to be honest. What they put out now feels like an assembly line.

Originally Posted by Archmage Xaxxas

Just playing along here, but doesn't you not liking WoW perhaps explain the difference as to why people who do indeed Like it aren't thrilled?

Wouldn't they by assumption, more than likely care more about it, and in so have a bolder stance on whether something was wrong with the patch?

Maybe, but not necessarily so. I mean let's quantify what we know we will get. Granted this might be staggered over five months as usual, but this includes a new outdoor zones (rarely a thing in FFXIV and if added in patches always instanced) a ten boss raid (FFXIV raids come with four bosses), an eight boss dungeon (the longest dungeon ever in FFXIV had six bosses and that was a special case), and a continuation of the campaign (obligatory for every major patch in FFXIV).
It is nothing to write home about, but this by no means looks small. Sure it does no include a new gameplay time or a feature we never had, but since it would probably just be a gimmick that is abandoned come 10.0 it is for the best. Only thing they could maybe add is a new battleground.