Netherlight Crucible - disappointed

[kamuimac]

I don't think Blizzard realize how unpopular RNG is... MMORPGs don't need too much RNG

it may be unpopular but its working

people whine but dont unsub - and thats the main goal proving system is working ok.

[Deleted]

I somewhat agree with the OP here...

I can cope with the RNG in place, but NC takes it to a new level.

They basically slapped 2 additional layers of RNG onto a rather scarce piece of loot.

[Deleted]

This system is absolute garbage for tanks. What shadow/light and weapon traits are wanted change drastically between m+ and raiding. I really dislike the crucible.

[kamuimac]

i wonder how long it will actually take to level up concordance to like 20 so the final tiers are unlocked.

in couple of months not long - you need 12 more weeks to get to AK 55 and then it will be easy .

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I am not asking for the obscene amounts of RNG to go away since Blizzard shills like yourself clearly love gambling.

I don't think you were around when Justice/Valor was in place. Your first sentence hilariously makes ZERO sense at all. If you can't grasp basic English I doubt you can grasp what I'm trying to say.

Old system:

Do 15 heroics for enough Justice Points to buy piece of gear. Maybe during heroics I get upgrades from boss drops too, thats RNG. I go to vendor. I buy the exact piece I want for the exact slot I want with the exact stats I want.

^How is this hard for you to grasp.

Then item has 0/2 upgrade levels on it. I can spend more points to upgrade it by 5 and then 10 iLevels. 2/2

Are we following this yet guy?


Barry gets a TF roll on his item. Barry can't spend points to upgrade his 935 piece of gear.
Johnny gets a normal piece at 915. Johnny can now spend points to boost it twice to 925. It's not as great as what Barry got but it mitigates the god awful pain of RNG.

Still with me champ?

How can anyone be against bringing reforging back when the Netherlight crucible is FUCKING REFORGING FOR RELICS. Use YOUR brain.


Are you seriously trying to talk about the Relinquished vendor? Veiled Argunite? Seriously? It is 100% a slot machine. Right item? Right stats? WF? TF?

besides a couple of thousand of high end raiding junkies playerbase dont care about anything besides itlv - every choice blizzard made this expansion is proving that further.

you are fighting already lost battle - blizzard see its working so you can expect even more rng in 8.0

slot machine type mechanics are clearly fun - you see them everywhere now in any possible multiplayer game.

and its working.

[jontunnel130]

The original intent behind Reforging was to offer a way for players to customize their gear, but in practice it offered little in the way of true choice. Players attempting to optimize every piece of gear were well advised to look up how they were supposed to reforge an item in an online guide or tool that had already determined the optimal choice. It added yet another step to the list of things that must be done to a new item before it was ready to be equipped, reducing the joy of getting an upgrade into a chore. If an upgrade drops, we want you to be able to equip it with a minimum of fuss. It is for those reasons that we're removing Reforging from the game.

Also in response to it only being used for hit/expertise cap:

That was one part, but the bigger part was that it doesn't actually improve the game experience. There are still soft caps for some stats, but ultimately Reforging just didn't provide any engaging gameplay to get an item and then reforge it to whatever your best stat is based on a sim or recommendation from a website. That's not creating engaging gameplay. If the desire for Reforging is based on "I'd like to make my items better by picking the stats I want more." the simpler answer there, and the one that does create engaging gameplay and interaction with the game world and other players, is "Get better items".

I dont know about everyone else but i miss gemming/enchanting aaaand reforging a new piece of gear. hell, sometimes i had the gems in my bag and the enchant mats for someone to enchant really quick. Now... 2 things get enchanted and maybe 2/14 gear slots get gemmed....
Scrap AP/artifact weapon/relic,
scrap warforged/titanforged/dildoforged,
scrap automatic legendaries,
scrap the current pvp template,
scrap all of the other blatant /played mechanics.
Wow needs more than touched up at this point. The people that actually cared about the game they were making left long ago. at least copy what they did in previous expansions and just paste it on a different setting. anything would be better than the shitfest that is legion.

[Aggrophobic]

No, now it is easier to get a decent relic. T2 talents plus a choice from 3 traits amounts to a higher chance of having a decent relic.

No, it's actually harder to get one.

[SirCowdog]

I dont know about everyone else but i miss gemming/enchanting aaaand reforging a new piece of gear. hell, sometimes i had the gems in my bag and the enchant mats for someone to enchant really quick. Now... 2 things get enchanted and maybe 2/14 gear slots get gemmed....
Scrap AP/artifact weapon/relic,
scrap warforged/titanforged/dildoforged,
scrap automatic legendaries,
scrap the current pvp template,
scrap all of the other blatant /played mechanics.
Wow needs more than touched up at this point. The people that actually cared about the game they were making left long ago. at least copy what they did in previous expansions and just paste it on a different setting. anything would be better than the shitfest that is legion.

I don't mind AP and legendaries as a means of end-game progression. But it needs to be progression based on actually progress, not just super RNG heavy systems.

AP is actually pretty good in that regard, but it should be character wide if not account wide. Targeted artifacts need to happen so two equal players aren't performing completely different because of a single slot.

Some RNG is fun. It's cool when you get that super drop you've been waiting for. But there absolutely MUST be backup systems for players to feel like they're not completely at the mercy of RNG like they are now.

[Toxicbrain]

Was enjoying 7.3 a lot, up to now. NC makes it feel like I need to farm just a bit too much to try and find that ''perfect'' relic I am hoping for.
(because in the end that is what I personally do want, get the best Trait on all 3 relics but now I also want it on the second and third Tier)

I can understand some like this feature, but it's not my sort of thing. It triggered me a lot to see all 3 relics on both my main and alt to have Horrible Tiers.

[Tekkommo]

It's not complicated at all.

It's boring as hell, simple and forces me to grind artifact lvl again, with more RNG, but RNG is not going away.

[Lartok]

I am not asking for the obscene amounts of RNG to go away since Blizzard shills like yourself clearly love gambling.

I don't think you were around when Justice/Valor was in place. Your first sentence hilariously makes ZERO sense at all. If you can't grasp basic English I doubt you can grasp what I'm trying to say.

Old system:

Do 15 heroics for enough Justice Points to buy piece of gear. Maybe during heroics I get upgrades from boss drops too, thats RNG. I go to vendor. I buy the exact piece I want for the exact slot I want with the exact stats I want.

^How is this hard for you to grasp.

Then item has 0/2 upgrade levels on it. I can spend more points to upgrade it by 5 and then 10 iLevels. 2/2

Are we following this yet guy?


Barry gets a TF roll on his item. Barry can't spend points to upgrade his 935 piece of gear.
Johnny gets a normal piece at 915. Johnny can now spend points to boost it twice to 925. It's not as great as what Barry got but it mitigates the god awful pain of RNG.

Yep exactly what I thought, you don't want the old systems. JP/VP gear didn't have the exact stats you wanted they had one piece of gear, multiple for jewelry, with 2 stats that maybe you wanted and maybe you didn't.

Also not how ilvl upgrades worked, Barry would've also added 10 to his item and he'd have a 945 still 20 ahead of Johnny.

I'm not against bringing reforging back, you just don't understand it's purpose at all.

The Nethershard/Argunite vendors are far and away a better system than the JP/VP vendors, they're both catch-up gear mechanisms the current version is just a lot better. The thing is if those vendors are your top end pieces of gear, as in you aren't replacing them with Mythic+ or Raid gear after a few weeks then you and your character progression are irrelevant and that's why it doesn't matter and is in fact a good thing it's a 'slot machine'.

If you don't actually want old systems back but rather similar/revamped ones maybe specify what the fuck you're talking about instead of spouting pointless nonsense and insults achieving nothing.

People like you are honestly so frustrating because you just constantly contradict yourself or make no sense because you don't understand what the fuck you're talking about. Looking at your post history you complain about each patch not having innovative content while also calling for revamped systems to be re-implemented. You complain about an upcoming content drought but also to much RNG making character progression take to long, all while not even completing 1/2? 3/4? of the content. Also, of course you're some one who bitches about class balance at the drop of a hat. Honestly just do the community a favour and stop playing the game, you don't contribute anything of worth.

[Armourboy]

Yep exactly what I thought, you don't want the old systems. JP/VP gear didn't have the exact stats you wanted they had one piece of gear, multiple for jewelry, with 2 stats that maybe you wanted and maybe you didn't.

Also not how ilvl upgrades worked, Barry would've also added 10 to his item and he'd have a 945 still 20 ahead of Johnny.

I'm not against bringing reforging back, you just don't understand it's purpose at all.

The Nethershard/Argunite vendors are far and away a better system than the JP/VP vendors, they're both catch-up gear mechanisms the current version is just a lot better. The thing is if those vendors are your top end pieces of gear, as in you aren't replacing them with Mythic+ or Raid gear after a few weeks then you and your character progression are irrelevant and that's why it doesn't matter and is in fact a good thing it's a 'slot machine'.

If you don't actually want old systems back but rather similar/revamped ones maybe specify what the fuck you're talking about instead of spouting pointless nonsense and insults achieving nothing.

People like you are honestly so frustrating because you just constantly contradict yourself or make no sense because you don't understand what the fuck you're talking about. Looking at your post history you complain about each patch not having innovative content while also calling for revamped systems to be re-implemented. You complain about an upcoming content drought but also to much RNG making character progression take to long, all while not even completing 1/2? 3/4? of the content. Also, of course you're some one who bitches about class balance at the drop of a hat. Honestly just do the community a favour and stop playing the game, you don't contribute anything of worth.

He did, your comprehension skills just stink.

[dakalro]

Thank f**k someone worked and there's a spreadsheet for warlocks to compare relics because the crucible is one cluster of RNG.

I had a good relic ... best trait. Got crappiest L2 on it so another 0 dps trait relic is now better since it has a good L2. But if I swap, the first relic has 2nd best trait on L3 which makes it overall better when I get to 69. What the ... and if there was not way to compare them? This is multiple levels worse than reforging ever was.

All this does is make it so there's a high chance all relics end up average, with a really smaller chance for awesome. So instead of going after specific relics, you pray.

[Lei]

What I'm worried about is... imagine that meeting where they cooked this thing up and it sounded a great, exciting idea for the playerbase who were already sick and tired of the rng. Scary.

[Deleted]

you know, i'd be fine with their obsession of rng if it just stuck to gearing and not other areas of gameplay, such as classes and fights. arms warriors and the artifact challenges are a perfect example of them going overboard, respectively.

you know, blizzard's problem is that in their endless quest to 'keep the game fresh' and 'stay on the market' they continue to change what isn't broken. it's sad that the only ideas they seem to have right now is "COPY MECHANICS FROM DIABLO" or "JUST ADD MORE RNG"

[Soxoffender]

So whats your point?

If you had a good relic to begin with, what does it matter if a second trait on that relic is "bad" or not? Please do enlighten me Tradu, seeing as how you have "already done the math."

Imagine Tier items gave you random two and four piece bonuses instead of the fixed ones; also, some of those bonuses were shit and you wouldn't know what the bonus was until you equipped it. That's sort of what this is like and some people are super-annoyed by it. "Oh great, I got 4 piece!" *reads details* "Improves dance speed by 25%? Fuck you, Blizz!" I'm casual and it's not going to affect my weekly M+ runs or LFR so I'm not too bothered but I can definitely see why it gets some people pretty animated.

[Lartok]

He did, your comprehension skills just stink.

No he didn't.

Reforging - Allowing you to fix some of the horrible gear you get.

Justice/Valor Points - Allowing you to work towards a piece of gear. Remember saying to your tank friend "Hey man I need 3 more heroics and I can buy an upgrade that I know is an upgrade for the slot I want. Can you help me run them?"

Upgrading gear - Remember being allowed to spend points to upgrade a piece of gear twice? 0/2 Upgrades. This would alleviate some of the warforge/titanforge bullshit. So one guy gets a titanforge. Thats fine, let him keep it. Now I didn't get one, so let me spend a form of currency to boost my item up SOMEWHAT. I'm not saying let me boost it all the way up to the other guys level. Just 5 or 10 iLevels like we USED TO BE ABLE TO DO.

Where in that post did he advocate for not the exact same systems because especially with the ilvl upgrades we used to be able to upgrade gear whether it was Thunderforged, Warforged or not which doesn't alleviate the RNG at all, just literally everybody gets 10ilvls.

[Nurasu]

No he didn't.


Where in that post did he advocate for not the exact same systems because especially with the ilvl upgrades we used to be able to upgrade gear whether it was Thunderforged, Warforged or not which doesn't alleviate the RNG at all, just literally everybody gets 10ilvls.

What was heavily implied is that the Titanforged pieces wouldn't be able to upgrade further and that if you didn't get a Titanforged piece, you now have a non-RNG way of still improving that item.

[Gyrotex]

Yep, yet another layer of AP GRIND-BASED CONTENT GATING.

Fixed it for you mate.

[Noblebanned]

So much this. It's not that I hate everything in WoW, I just hate how RNG everything has become leading up to the part that I enjoy the most. Yesterday I got a 950 item from an 895 base ilevel WQ for handing in 40 Astral Glory. That should not happen. The reward is completely disproportionate to the content I did, and it's all due to RNG.

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How about taking a second and thinking about the system before making idiotic comments like that. Yes, it makes shit relics less shit than before the patch in absolute numbers. They're much worse relative to the best ones than before. What would actually improve bad relics would be having the NLC traits replace the base trait. Then it'd "only" be the (in some cases absurdly powerful) T2 traits that cause problems.

No no no. I just don't bitch and moan every chance I get because the company that provides me with the single best expansion in the games history just provided me another excellent bonus. You want to tune it how you want, but your opinion is fucking worthless minus a post count on another bitch and moan thread

[Lartok]

What was heavily implied is that the Titanforged pieces wouldn't be able to upgrade further and that if you didn't get a Titanforged piece, you now have a non-RNG way of still improving that item.

At best it was slightly implied until he put "like we used to be able to do" at the end because we've had this WF/TF system for 3 expansions now and every time you've been able to upgrade every piece of gear Warforged or not.