A World PvP Toggle Next Expansion!?

[Wildberry]

What is it about killing some lowbie that is so fun. Why is making someones gaming experience unenjoyable so enjoyable unless you are are a crappy human being?

Yeah, I'll plead guilty to that one. It's really not about lowbies though. Like I said, I don't like the change there, but that's not the cause for the "sky is falling" attitude here.

And as for the reason I know you are a crap PVP player is that I have you so triggered by calling out your ability that you likely tilt easily and tank your rating.

I'm not triggered, I just don't understand why that's the go-to knee-jerk reaction for certain types of people whenever a topic comes anywhere remotely close to ganking lowbies. I mean, if players were going around pretending to be good after camping some heirloomless 20-something in Duskwood, sure, but nobody does that.

LOL calling someone a Nerd.....there is a reason why Bill Gates said be nice to use cause you will end up working for us in the end..... Because being a technically smart person is a bad thing.

I have 8.5 thousand posts on a video game forum, a significant chunk of which are in the Lore section. Are you honestly under the impression that I'm using the term unironically? Although, given that you're citing motivational quotes from Bill Gates, I might have to reconsider that.

And as for your first point this will still happen by CHOOSING TO FLAG YOURSELF.....Except these people will be ready for your antics and you do not like that they are taking your ability to be a jerk away. Wait I figured it out you are the guy I on the rogue I trolled this morning on my 105 rogue at the invasion. Got mad cause I cheap shotted you while you were ganking someone else and you died from bleeds, tried to chase me down but I out smarted you like 6 times.......

I don't play a rogue, actually. I dislike the class quite a bit.

Organic PvP isn't going to happen when the entire world is one giant opt-in BG. Those encounters aren't organic. There's no thinking there, no "randomness," no tenuous peace to be broken. Thus far, we have no reason to assume that the system won't result in abuse (ie, players opting out until they're done with all of their daily content, and then opting in specifically for World PvP). Yes, tagging along with a group of players hunting other groups of players can be fun at times, but there are plenty of other legitimate forms of WPvP aside from that; however, this new system is likely to render them nearly nonexistent.

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There will not be a PVP server just a PVP flag. LOVE IT.

Yes, every server gets, roughly, the PvE system. Wonderful, good to see you support choice being taken away. Weren't you the one claiming that more choices were a good thing?

[Charge me Doctor]

Wow, this @Wildberry guy is sure salty about people finally being able to make a conscious decision to opt in or opt out off PvP. So, instead of rerolling they can just toggle it off, and whole need in having PvE and PvP servers are dying off, there will be PvE oriented players and PvP oriented players, matched together appropriately to their desires.

Lets be fair, WPvP is a joke and the one who have an ability to strike first will always win, because he will have an advantage. It's not fun to encounter all the time. It's fun sometimes, and toggle helps with that a lot.

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Organic PvP isn't going to happen when the entire world is one giant opt-in BG. Those encounters aren't organic. There's no thinking there, no "randomness," no tenuous peace to be broken. Thus far, we have no reason to assume that the system won't result in abuse (ie, players opting out until they're done with all of their daily content, and then opting in specifically for World PvP). Yes, tagging along with a group of players hunting other groups of players can be fun at times, but there are plenty of other legitimate forms of WPvP aside from that; however, this new system is likely to render them nearly nonexistent.

It won't, since you imply that people will turn PvP off by default, but most people will leave it on, turning it off only when they don't want to PvP (aka, i've got killed by a bunch of players and just want to do quests; or "i don't feel secure to PvP because i'm heavily undergeared"). And even when there are people who turn it off permanently - there are plenty of players who will gladly permanently turn it on. Making the game for WPvPs a little more interesting, because instead of getting a dude that just stands there passively, doing nothing, hoping that you'll realize that he is not interested in this, popping his defensive cooldowns, you'll get someone who will want to fight and will fight back.

[Sencha]

OP is a rogue.

[Ragedaug]

Oh look, another case of On-the-spectrum MMO-Champion posters failing to recognize hyperbole.

Oh I recognize hyperbole, I just detest it. Skillfully placed sarcasm and irony can have a place in discussion as they are recognized as such and are used as tools to highlight your point. Hyperbole only exaggerates your point which weakens or destroys your position. A position that can stand on it's own doesn't need to be exaggerated. In other words, people only resort to hyperbole when they know their argument has no grounds on it's own merit.

Now lets get to that "on-the-spectrum" portion of what you said. What did you mean by that?

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Yes, every server gets, roughly, the PvE system. Wonderful, good to see you support choice being taken away. Weren't you the one claiming that more choices were a good thing?

What choice do you think we are losing?

[Sforza]

Please explain, you are just throwing mud and now actual supporting discussion. This is only an issue if you are one to troll around killing people who were not expecting it. The way I see it is if I am in a hurry and want to grind through some world quests I will turn the flag off, if I want to go have some fun while doing world quests I will turn it on and pop meta on people who are also ready for a fight. Also while leveling if I am in a group of 4 or 5 players I will turn on the PVP flag while leveling for the bonus XP and the hope for some world PVP funs. But If I am running solo I will live the same life. It gives every player options to when they want to PVP and if they do not.

Please provide some legitimate discussion to why it is a bad thing, because all I see is the WHAMBULANCE filled with whiny gankers that they can not go kill lowbies or people fighting elites ad nauseam

This will also fix the faction imbalance on PVP servers as they should hopefully keep population balance in areas.

You can't see anything apparently. Nothing will get better, things will actually get worse, for the simple reason that giving an option to disable pvp gives blizzard a way out from the whole need to balance. They simply won't have any pressure from the community anymore. It's the equivalent of having a boss who tells you that you can skip work as much as you want, you simply won't show up.
It's either a work ethic problem, or they simply don't want to put resources in wow anymore so they are cutting aspects of the game.

[Chaelexi]

You can't see anything apparently. Nothing will get better, things will actually get worse, for the simple reason that giving an option to disable pvp gives blizzard a way out from the whole need to balance. They simply won't have any pressure from the community anymore. It's the equivalent of having a boss who tells you that you can skip work as much as you want, you simply won't show up.
It's either a work ethic problem, or they simply don't want to put resources in wow anymore so they are cutting aspects of the game.

THey will never balance world PVP, your point is moot.

[ComputerNerd]

Servers have been more for people than a choice for just PvP or not.
Because it was not for you, does not mean it was the same for everyone else.

You are scared of this proving just how popular world PvP actually was, and not as much as you like to think it was.

[Sforza]

THey will never balance world PVP, your point is moot.

It isn't.
Not a single person is asking for hardcore balance around 1v1, we are just asking for it to be bearable. And that is the least they can do, not throw in the towel completely like this.

[Deleted]

Don't forget that PVE servers are going to have that PVP/PVE toggle, too. This implies that MORE people will be able to do WPVP. Add rewarding rewards and maybe we will be getting a much better WPVP experience than we have now.

Personally, I think this is one of the best and most impactful changes announced so far. I'm excited to see how it will work out in the end.

[haxartus]

People talk about choice to participate in PvP. What about my choice to play on a PvP server ?

I did choose to play on a PvP server, other people did as well, but PvP servers are getting removed and everything is becoming a PvE server. So where is my choice ?

[Deleted]

Why do people need the option to make the choice again? Are these people too stupid to have made a decision they're happy with the first time? I swear, players like this are the reason I have to waste time in the "Are you sure you really want to delete this item?" window. Additionally, such a system poses a number of risks and has the potential to create more problems than it actually solves. For example, should the incentives for opting into PvP be underwhelming (And historically PvP rewards have been. Given that Blizzard stated they don't want to "punish" players for not opting in, there's no reason to assume the rewards will be adequate), what stops players from opting out of PvP while doing daily content and quests, and opting in only when they're actively looking to PvP? Such an outcome would basically kill the organic aspect of WPvP and remove dynamic elements from it, essentially turning the world into a quasi-Battleground.

Again, what is makes it your business if others want to revert their choice? Especially after all these years and the growing imbalance. WoW isn't your personal playground. It's for everybody. And you can scream "you have made a choice, deal with it" or "there is a choice already: it is called PvE servers" all you want. The change is coming and it is to early to judge, but i am willing to bet that it actually could bring in more people to each PvP-shard, even if some drop in and out from time to time. Garrosh said at the start of WOD "times change". Do you think that is just a statement for a computer game?
Organic PvP won't go away. It will just change. As it stands right now, you can't change from PvP to PvE and back at any time. You have to go to a city hub and make that change. But that also means on PvP-shards you'll probably see more groups of people roaming the PvP-shards to start a fight. Why does it matter that it will be only people that WANT to fight? And why do some people need to pick fights that no chance in winning? Showing them where they belong, makes the higher player feeling somehow superior?
Picking on lows to lure their main is pretty much a pure lie, since i have stated already: why pick on small ones from which can't know that they have a max level toon to come and jump right back while there are certainly places you can find those mains in raw numbers.

As someone who probably has a better run in arena than you do, being ganked is PvP. You can dismiss it as cowardly, but it is PvP. Here's the OED definition of the word "versus":

"1. Against (especially in sporting and legal use)"

There's nothing in the definition to suggest that the parties involved be comparable, or remotely on even footing. Only that they're against one another. I'm sorry, but mental gymnastics, and the projection of your own ideas onto words is a horrible look for someone describing others as having "simple brains."

Oh sorry... the thing you posted says "especially in sporting and legal use". And i actually think that in sports (and sportsmenship) even footing or fairness is mostly common. I am pretty sure what you are calling "versus", especially in terms of Player versus player is not what other people would call it. Since "player" implies playing, but getting oneshotted can hardly be called "playing". Which in other words takes out the second player out of the equation. But i see some people want to avoid good fair fights that take longer than one second to win at all cost.

With your arena stats you are probably right, since i have taken a longer time off from WoW. But this change certainly is a good reason to start again. Get the rust off my skills and train to beat people that claim to be "PvP-players" again. Just like in the old days, in classic where people thought they have been good by stomping lows and got their asses handed to them by people like me. I just wonder if i can still PvP with UI turned off.... As you can probably tell, i am excited about this change and want to give it a chance to make a flawed system that grew in imbalance over the years maybe/probably work better again.

[Adalwolf]

but their pretty much turning every server into a PvE server.

No dude, you understood all wrong: PvP or PvE will be a personal choice. If you choose PvE, you will be put on shards with other people that also chose PvE (similar when you use AddOns to server hop). If you choose PvP, you will be put on shards with other people that also chose PvP. From your perspective, it's pretty much all the same. You won't run into people with PvP disabled, everyone you see on the maps will be killable.

The good thing about this system is that a person that dislikes PvP can be on the same server and guild as his friend who absolutely loves PvP, without having PvP forced upon him. Same issue with people that chose the "Normal server" without knowing what "Normal" meant and are stuck with 12 characters on a boring server where nobody can kill the opposite faction. Now I can kill people without having to dismiss all the friends I made on my current server.

[Daedius]

There will be incentives to keep it on, and also to engage in actual PvP.

If those incentives are worthwhile I expect this to actually give life to world PvP.

[Deleted]

There will be incentives to keep it on, and also to engage in actual PvP.

If those incentives are worthwhile I expect this to actually give life to world PvP.

Sadly, that's not what most of the whiners actually want.

[Daedius]

Sadly, that's not what most of the whiners actually want.

Those whiners can go to hell, frankly... said whiners are them pathetic gankers of low levels.

[Oblider]

Those whiners can go to hell, frankly... said whiners are them pathetic gankers of low levels.

Definitely this.
The truth is that people just want to be jerks all around. Nothing less nothing more

[Chaelexi]

People talk about choice to participate in PvP. What about my choice to play on a PvP server ?

I did choose to play on a PvP server, other people did as well, but PvP servers are getting removed and everything is becoming a PvE server. So where is my choice ?

Turn on your PVP flag and you are on a PVP server. Turn it off and you are not on one. It is no different than transferring from one to the other except with the flag system all of the people who are flagged are ready, wanting and expecting PVP. What is wrong with that, it means there will be challenges in world PVP and not herpderp I am 70 ilvls of gear(or 80 character levels for ganking scum) higher than you so I win always. You scared of a challenge?

[Deleted]

People talk about choice to participate in PvP. What about my choice to play on a PvP server ?

I did choose to play on a PvP server, other people did as well, but PvP servers are getting removed and everything is becoming a PvE server. So where is my choice ?

I am under the strong impression you are confusing that the Switch is functioning like the optional PvP button on PvE realms. That is not the case.

When this change is made, there are no PvP servers. BUT there are also no PVE servers. Servers will all be homeservers, and you will either be put in a dangerous PvP open world where everybody of the opposing faction can and will attack you at any given time, or (if you toggle to off) put in a happy, glowing, cottoncandy carebaer openworld where faction players wave and dance with the opposing faction.
What it will NOT be is that you toggle your PvP switch to on, you'll be seeing people that have PvP switch to off and you can't attack them. PvP-Servers still exist but they are not bound to a specific server name.

I hope i could help since you actually seem to be given information that were totally wrong. Blizzard is NOT making all Servers to PvE servers. It is more like there will be PvP worlds and PvE worlds that people can join no matter what server they are from.

[sessava]

I've always cared more about world PvP than I have about anything else in WoW. In fact, it's probably just about one of the only things I really like about the game. My fondest memories are from vanilla, while playing my Druid and Mage and engaging in world PvP and managing to survive fights where the odds were not in my favor. That's the fun. That's how you get memories that last forever - it's entirely because it's UNFAIR and people are not necessarily prepared for it. The memory I remember most is on my Druid getting attacked in Winterspring by two Alliance and me managing to kill both of them after like a 30 minute long fight because I could just keep popping out and healing through the damage they were doing. I was so proud of myself for that, and that's something I'll always remember.

But hey, guess what, if there was a toggle for PvP, I probably wouldn't have had it on since I was out leveling - not PvPing. If there was a toggle for PvP, those people probably wouldn't have had it on either. The best experience I have ever had in WoW, just wouldn't have happened. That's not OK with me. I want world PvP back to the way it was, not made even worse.

I was on the edge of my seat during the opening ceremony listening to everything, getting back in to WoW for the first time in years. And then I listened to whatever panel announced the PvP toggle and I realized that they're just completely gutting the experience that I love.

How does it even remotely make sense that with two factions "at war" and at each other's throats, after burning down their lands, killing their peoples, etc, that these factions would just wave at each other and walk by when encountering each other in the wilderness? It's an immersion thing too. If I see an Alliance character, I should be allowed to kill that Alliance character no matter what, and vice versa. There should not be some stupid gameplay mechanic that blocks me from doing that. I specifically rolled and leveled on a PvP server to avoid that, and Blizzard is completely denying me that right.

They should have just offered free PvP->PvE transfers for people who can't handle it. You knew what you were signing up for when you rolled on a PvP server, and I don't know why these people deserve any sympathy whatsoever. Or why their opinion or views matter more than mine and those who feel the way I do.

I only hope that these stupid, moronic changes do not make their way into WoW Classic, or else I'll be sticking with private servers.

[Deleted]

How does it even remotely make sense that with two factions "at war" and at each other's throats, after burning down their lands, killing their peoples, etc, that these factions would just wave at each other and walk by when encountering each other in the wilderness? It's an immersion thing too. If I see an Alliance character, I should be allowed to kill that Alliance character no matter what, and vice versa. There should not be some stupid gameplay mechanic that blocks me from doing that. I specifically rolled and leveled on a PvP server to avoid that, and Blizzard is completely denying me that right.

I hope that you realize some day (maybe when you see it and test it) that what you just said is NOT how the toggle works. If you put your toggle to on, you won't be seeing ANYONE that has their swtich to off. All people of the other faction you meet in the world will have their switch toggled on. This feature is NOT the PvP optional switch from the PvE servers. So all you wish will be possible => if you see an alliance character you'll be able to kill that character no matter what.... well at least you can attack them, if you can kill them depends on your skill level. ;-)

I hope that helped since you obviously have been giving only half of the information or completely wrong ones.