Havoc DH tier set just got nerfed back to 15% haste on PTR...

[Phunkle]

Careful, calling people out on their bullshit with proof is a bannable offense on this forum. But lying out of your ass obviously isn't

Yeah, that's the reason to get banned. Not the choice of words or insults, nu-uh. Silly MMO-C mods.

[Deleted]

I think its 2p T21 for M+ now and highest ilvl/best stats für CB build in antorus. Sucks, but come on, we knew that DH is not going to be good this addon. (And no, decent is not good)

[Deleted]

Hello,

Am I the only one that is worried about fury regen with this tier set? T19 had some, T20 had some (with the blade dance refund) but there is nothing on that matter on t21.

Even with ring legendary, fury regen is a major factor.

Thoughts?

[Deleted]

Thoughts?

2T19.

Srsly.

[Lostprophet]

They will nerf T20 so that T21 will be better

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. And T21 even after the nerfs still forces a Demonic build.

From the DH Discord (Mardum) : (https://www.warcraftlogs.com/charact...reaver/soviett)

Might be that 2210331 build with shoulders just passed 3310333 build in terms of st damage. Just keep eye beam haste up during chaos blades and rest of the time fall asleep during fight.

[Haaz]

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From the DH Discord (Mardum) : (https://www.warcraftlogs.com/charact...reaver/soviett)

this is take out of context as the sims showing that was simmed with t20 optimized gear and no mastery.. and the dps difference was so small it barely matters..

[MookieRah]

Personally I think the reason why they nerfed the tier set is because they don't want Havoc to be balanced around gear, and more than likely they will apply some form of tuning to make up for some of the difference. It doesn't make sense for a tier set to contribute as much as the previous iteration did, and thusly the class needs adjustment more than the set bonuses. I am really hoping to see some boosts to the class that will push Havoc forward, and if they do that it would be better than the class recieving an OP tier set bandaid.

Of course if they don't do anything I'll just be sad, but at least I have Vengeance, which despite what some people are implying in this thread is in a good place right now.

[Chaelexi]

Dont worry guys, they buffed rouges

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Like all other class for dps , example druid (balance), rouge, warrior, mage, warlock, hunter

Rogues were at the bottom of logs and sims on the PTR

[cparle87]

That sounds like an awesome design philosophy for class balance and itemization.
/s

Also explains why they're removing tier bonuses. If I was Blizz I'd be sick of all your whining too.

[Shirofune]

Also explains why they're removing tier bonuses. If I was Blizz I'd be sick of all your whining too.

Whining comes when your job is a shit.

If their job is a shit, expect to hear bad feedback in return.

The player base is not to blame here, their incompetent balance team is.

[cparle87]

Whining comes when your job is a shit.

If their job is a shit, expect to hear bad feedback in return.

The player base is not to blame here, their incompetent balance team is.

Considering they have all the logs and parses and we don't, I'll take their word over anyone on these forums. The people in these threads are just ordinary people trying to tell NASA how to build the next generation space shuttle. It'd be laughable if they weren't so serious about it.

[Shirofune]

Considering they have all the logs and parses and we don't, I'll take their word over anyone on these forums. The people in these threads are just ordinary people trying to tell NASA how to build the next generation space shuttle. It'd be laughable if they weren't so serious about it.

They can keep telling they've their internal data, but is not like we're blind to what's happening. While I agree your average player is normally a dude that has no idea how to play the class, a big portion of the players knows what they're doing, and they're usually among the top voices of classes' discords.

In fact, most of Mythic raiders know their shit.

We're also the ones playing the classes, we've a perfect tool to see real performance called warcraftlogs.

It's obvious their internal tools are wrong. And this have been proven a lot of times.

And what's even more retarded and has no explanation whatsoever is buffing an underperforming tier set and then reverting the changes.

[Dizzeeyooo]

Also explains why they're removing tier bonuses

yep, raiding set bonuses have been a huge huge huge problem in the game since Vanilla, thank god blizzard finally has the courage to remove set bonuses after 6 expansions of problems caused by them

in other news, thank god titanforging is staying in the next expansion, weapons titanforging to ilvl cap will be a really fun thing for them to manage and balance

[Sellest]

Whining comes when your job is a shit.

If their job is a shit, expect to hear bad feedback in return.

The player base is not to blame here, their incompetent balance team is.

I don't know but I think wow is quite balanced. Ilvls matters, character is getting stronger with upgrades...
https://www.wowbis.net/wow-dps-ranking/

If you think you are under-performing, try to play better. That is what matters the most.

[Shirofune]

I don't know but I think wow is quite balanced. Ilvls matters, character is getting stronger with upgrades...
https://www.wowbis.net/wow-dps-ranking/

If you think you are under-performing, try to play better. That is what matters the most.

I've no idea where you're getting those charts from, but first:

1- You cannot mix everything on the same pack. Misstress isn't Goroth.
2- There's no way Arms warriors are mid pack.

This is a good way to start: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/13

You can play around going through bosses/percentiles. In case you didn't know, the highest the percentile, the better the player played (isn't exactly that, but perc 100 has the #1 DPS for that spec in that boss).

We're not under-performing NOW, in ToS, when everything is going through farm and in Single Target bosses, due to us being a burst class and bosses dying faster.

Misstress? We're still a bad joke no matter which talents we pick.
Kil'jaeden? On my first kill, a Warrior that parsed 67 did a little more DPS than me, while I parsed 96.

No, we're not fine. We never were. And things are looking shitty for Antorus as well after the tier revert.

And while I agree a lot of DPS issues are a "git gud" issue, you can't tell that to a player with a 97 average parsing.

[Veiled Shadow]

Difference is, with 40%, 930 T21 was a DPS increase (small) over T20. Now, T21 is a DPS loss over T20 at the same iLvL.

I think you might be underestimating how much of an increase the old T21 was over T20; you got like 11.5% or so from the set - T20 is 8% and thus quite a bit weaker. So some reduction would have been OK in my eyes (though of course it doesn't feel that great, being the last tier of the expansion specs generally get more powerful bonuses), however reverting it all the way back to 15% is certainly far too heavy-handed like you said.

[Shirofune]

I think you might be underestimating how much of an increase the old T21 was over T20; you got like 11.5% or so from the set - T20 is 8% and thus quite a bit weaker. So some reduction would have been OK in my eyes, however reverting it all the way back to 15% is certainly far too heavy-handed like you said.

I think I clearly said the DPS gain was small :P

[Sellest]

Link which you posted still proves that classes are close to each other and therefore balanced. Lowest score is rogue with 81.8, Warlock tops with 93.6.
I bet you are one of those who will be unhappy even with http://www.darklegacycomics.com/558
Few expansions back balance was really sh**. Be happy how it evolved and now there is a lot of classes and specs that are "close" in performance. It is not perfect and it will never be but it is certainly much better than it was.

[kaelleria]

-_-

Inb4 they give us another across the board buff a week in because we're going to be crap again.

[Shirofune]

Link which you posted still proves that classes are close to each other and therefore balanced. Lowest score is rogue with 81.8, Warlock tops with 93.6.
I bet you are one of those who will be unhappy even with http://www.darklegacycomics.com/558
Few expansions back balance was really sh**. Be happy how it evolved and now there is a lot of classes and specs that are "close" in performance. It is not perfect and it will never be but it is certainly much better than it was.

Lmao.

Is this fine?

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...ount&boss=2032

Mythic Goroth, 99th perc.

Top spec: 1.884M DPS
Worst spec: 1.582M DPS

That's 260k DPS difference. For the numbers we're talking, is huge.

Now lets go to an AoE fight.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...ount&boss=2037

Misstress, 99th perc.

Top spec: 2.9M DPS
Worst spec: 1.9M DPS

1M DPS difference. Fine right?

Come on.

Do you know what's even worse? Specs that perform great in AoE (Balance Druids) are also mid-top in Single Target scenarios.

Does this remind you of something? Yeah, Shadow Priests in T21. Topping the simmed DPS charts for Single Target DPS when their niche is cleave. Prepare for EN 2.0