"legion is harder"

[Daedius]

It is about ability to finish content no about how hard are current mythic bosses compared to vannila. Yes mythic bosses have harder mechanics compared to vannila. But Legion is still easyer to finish compared to vannila becouse you can cheat content in easy mods. Remove difficulty mods like LFR, normal and heroic and you can say Legion is harder.

Easier difficulties exists to make raiding accessible to everyone, instead of what it was for the "hardcore" back in its day of Vanilla. That is in no way a bad thing, it means more people get to enjoy it. Sorry if your little exclusivity club got shattered, like how barely anyone did Naxx40. And let's be honest... the only genuinely hard thing about Vanilla raiding was managing 40 players in a raid.

Seriously though, your argument has little to no substance. Yes, you can do the easiest difficulty... but don't claim to proceed and call the game easy when there's Mythic and Mythic+... just makes you look terribly foolish.

[Segus1992]

How has nobody mentioned Onyxia being 4-manned? Solo in a 10-man raid (10%) or 4 man in a 40-man raid (10%), and Onyxia was a single difficultly while Gul'dan was the lowest of three?

[Quincey]

Christ idiots like the the OP are the people who give people like me who is actually looking forward to playing classic again a bad name.

For clarity, No vanilla bosses are harder than Legion bosses. At all. This is due to number of mechanics, Blizzard assuming we are using boss mods and the sheer raid size scaling. If someone were to solo in classic they would need to compensate for FORTY players, Not the 10 that the DH in that video does. Its a big goddamn difference.

The difficulty in vanilla lies in the time investment required and the outdoor content.

[Thrallinor]

Now lets see how hard is to finish content in Legion. Open group finder. Press this 1 button and yaaay free epics and finished content in like 2 hours.

If you think LFR and LFD is the endcontent... Well, no need to talk to you anymore. HF grinding pixels I had 12 Years ago :3

[TaurenNinja]

Though it does tell something when vanilla defenders compare lowest difficulty possible (on retail) with highest difficulty possible (on vanilla) and also claim that time gated grindy stuff must be viewed as "difficult". I guess there aren't many good arguments you can find when you want to try to make vanilla look good even though it's not, and so you have to resort to really bad comparisons and definitions just in order to still be able to make some sort of point.

Also, if we go so far as to say that much more extreme difficulty doesn't add anything to the game because "it's not additional content", then we also have to admit that additional time gated grindiness *doesn't* add anything to difficulty, because it's simply *not* more difficult, you just get it later but you absolutely WILL get it so there's no question of "oh maybe it's too difficult for him to get it", no he *WILL GET IT WITH 100% SUCCESS*, just slightly later. So this is *not* added difficulty, it's added time. Period.
If I had to jump once each day for 3 days then get the reward, compared to having to jump once each day for 5 days and then get the reward, there wasn't anything that was more difficult about it (I'm able to do that jump just fine), I just got it 2 days later with 100% success guaranteed, that's all. This is not added difficulty because there is in both cases 100% success chance.

I respect that there should be some amount of grinding just to stretch the game content a bit and to stay somewhat true to MMORPG roots, but there's a balance to be achieved here. There's literally no point in having players to play 3 months longer when they are perfectly capable to achieve the same thing after 1 month as well. If you think it's a good idea to add as much time gating as possible you aren't adding difficulty, you are just annoying players with bad design decisions, that's all. The players already demonstrated that they are capable of doing it (= the difficulty aspect of doing it), so you don't have to draw it out for too long.

[Illusions]

Tbh even LFR has been harder than Vanilla. Anyone remember Durumu? Vanilla ducks would flop over on that fight.

[Florena]

IT ISNT ABOUT MECHANICS. Difficulty of the content is detereminded how hard is to finish that content. Getting gear, 40man raid, pots, res gear all this is part of difficulty. Not jsut some mechanics. It just different type of difficulty but it doesnt mean it is not part of it. Now lets see how hard is to finish content in Legion. Open group finder. Press this 1 button and yaaay free epics and finished content in like 2 hours. WoW finish legion content is so hard.

It isnt about mechanics it is about finish content. Compared this not some mechanocs what are only small part what makes content difficult.

If you consider LFR and heroic mode dungeons 'beating Legion' than sure.

The challenge in Legion is in mythic plus dungeons and mythic raids. Neither of which you can just queue up for without preparation.

- - - Updated - - -

You again compare to hardest difficulty for some reason. You have to ask ,,is it hard to finish dunegeon content in legion compared to vannila,,? No it isnt becouse you can just faceroll them all in easy mods. Multiple difficulty settings does not add on difficulty of the game. If i can cheat and faceroll wow content in easy mods than game is in fact easy. You cant cheat in vannila. There are no easy mods, no catch up, nothing. You go trought 1 difficulty all they way to finish. Thats why vannila will awalys be harder.

Oh sure NORMAL MODE dungeons are easier than vanilla. But to get the good reward, you ahve to do the hard content. Why would we NOT take the hardest content that has the best rewards into account? It's disingenuous to leave out the higher difficulties when talking about how hard a game is. Yes there are faceroll easy difficulties in wow. If you stop there and don't do the challenging content with the BETTER REWARDS that's on you not the game.

If you play a game and only do 'easy' mode that doesn't mean the game as a whole is easy. It means you didn't challenge yourself by pushing into higher difficulties.

[Molvonos]

I'm so sad I missed the beginning of this thread. What the actual fuck, rofl.

[Heathy]

How has nobody mentioned Onyxia being 4-manned? Solo in a 10-man raid (10%) or 4 man in a 40-man raid (10%), and Onyxia was a single difficultly while Gul'dan was the lowest of three?

lets not forget this gem



and another https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibHzPO3Ty5Q

it was totally possible to cheese the game in every iteration of it somewhere.

iirc lady vashj world first was a glitch kill, DI priest with shadow word death one shot the boss as it reset.

[Deleted]

The scariest thing about this thread is although it's an obvious troll, OP actually believes what he's saying. :S

[mich4el]

Source please.

Are you trolling? fine i will bite
If you finish witcher 3 on easy guess what you FINISHED THE GAME
you cant finish Dark souls on easy however there is only one game mode in dark souls

This is a fact and there is no need for source for something so obvious

[Arainie]

I agree that Legion overall isn't difficult (although Mythic raiding and higher M+ is arguably more mechanically difficult content than Vanilla ever had to offer), but it's getting a bit ridiculous when you compare a scaled 10-man simple mode raid (normal) with a Vanilla 40 man raid that only existed in one difficulty.

You sort of reek of bias and it's getting close to desperation!

[dopefishz]

(...)your average mythic raider today will be a complete failure when it come to vanilla raiding
all these new QOL and abundant CDs/addons allowing you to make all the mistakes in the world have made you decadently weak and less skilled than the average player used to be back in vanilla/privates servers
You are in for a big shock if you actually think Modern raiding is harder and i am going to have good laugh when vanilla is out

Hahaha yeah, not really.
Raiding was 'hard' because you needed to get 40 people, attunements, tons pots, resistance gear, etc. The fights themselves were piss easy, mechanics mostly consisting of debuffing players. Every dungeon boss nowadays requires more attention.

I found the 'pls give classic servers blizz'-threads annoying, but this is just beyong annoying.

[Kolbjorn]

Don't even come telling me Legion is harder until you show me a video where a level 60 solo a raid boss in vanilla

I'm sort of annoyed how Mandokir never dropped a raptor mount given how many times I soloed him...

The problem with your argument is you're confusing scaling with difficulty. ilvl scales way harder now, so content becomes "old" faster. It isn't particularly a measure of difficulty.

[Daggot Ur]

Im a vanilla purist but how can I not take this opportunity?

Chinese hunter soloing BWL raid boss Ebonroc during real Vanilla.


Lol is actually using a glitch - I wonder if he was banned or no.

EDIT:
I have seen the full video of him actually killing it, this is just a quick clip of how he did it.

Lol he is actually using a glitch - I wonder if he was banned or no.

[Azarak]

You realize vanilla bosses had like 4 mechanics and only 1 or 2 you personally had to worry about, right? They were just tuned to where you need the gear as opposed to now where gear isn't as important as skill.

[Deleted]

The problem with your argument is you're confusing scaling with difficulty. ilvl scales way harder now, so content becomes "old" faster. It isn't particularly a measure of difficulty.

/thread

10char

[Gaidax]

I wrote facts not my opinion legion is easier than classic
Please watch the video i have posted in OP to see how a single class can solo legion.

Yeah no, you have 2 separate vids proving you bullshit. Even if you consider Kazzak a "bug" or "exploit", which it was not. You have another solo vid of BWL.

Vanillaz 2 'ard.

[Deleted]

I think OP is going to be pretty disappointed when he realizes he can't do KT because despite having the skill necessary to do it (we all do), he just doesn't have the 25 hrs a week to sink into the game simply to get there with a full raid.

[mich4el]

I think OP is going to be pretty disappointed when he realizes he can't do KT because despite having the skill necessary to do it (we all do), he just doesn't have the 25 hrs a week to sink into the game simply to get there with a full raid.

You cant do it you are just trying to find excuses your not skilled enough to down KT but you are finding excuses " I don't have time"
this is what going to happen when vanilla come out all those who claimed legion was harder will change into "i can do it but i don't have time"
we all know its just excuses from

I like that people are using that sig. It makes it easier to know who to just flat out ignore.

Awesome! it also double as good way to avoid weebs such as yourself

How has nobody mentioned Onyxia being 4-manned? Solo in a 10-man raid (10%) or 4 man in a 40-man raid (10%), and Onyxia was a single difficultly while Gul'dan was the lowest of three?

While its a clear lie and you have no proof even if you were right you are basically saying that vanilla is 4 times harder than legion so this is pointless anyway

World of Warcraft when released was considered a casual MMO. That is all I need to say. You want a challenge then why the hell are you promoting the casual game of the time?

Did i compare wow with another game ? No! I compared wow with its shadow