"go play retail then" is getting old

[Hitei]

I don't think AoE looting will have any measurable impact on the economy.
But I think having to loot each body independantly adds a small but measurable notch toward the verisimilitude and immersion aspect (the down-to-earth feeling of Vanilla compared to the overly gamey feeling that took WoW over), with the character patting the pocket of each corpse one by one to rob them of their valuables.

It's certainly not a big deal, but it does make a (small) difference. I wouldn't say it would ruin the game, but I would very much NOT see it implemented.

Sure. That's reasonable.

Also, your whole "vanilla economy doesn't exist" argument is just... completely nonsensical, pointless and only tend to indicate a deep level of bad faith "I will grasp at any straw just to not admit I could be wrong". Doesn't really reflect good on you nor help being convinced.

It makes perfect sense.

Vanilla's economy no longer exists. Classic's economy is going to look nothing at all like Vanilla WoW's. It's also not going to look similar to private servers, because it will have a much larger, more varied and completely different population and thought process from any private server. Classic's economy does not exist yet, it's dumb to complain about it being changed.

There is nothing for it to change. Classic will have the systems it ends up having, and its economy will be based on how that new population makes use of those systems.

[Deleted]

Hence why I gave up arguing with them.

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I don't know what people want, but they all have one common want among all of them: They want classic WoW. So it seems from a logistical standpoint the easiest way to please everyone is to just give them Classic WoW....

That is for sure!

Now let me ask you a question I already asked multiple time and never had answer:

Do you stay away from classic if there is zloot and multimail in the game? Seriously

[AceofH]

Auto Looting, LFG, pally power all this stuff that fixes faults in the vanilla game. Then it shud be in the main game like it in the retail, so its not a mandatory addon to download, how it that such a hard thing to understand.

pray tell. what fault is in the game that LFG fixes.

[ShimmerSwirl]

Here we go! I dont agree with you so that means I never played vanilla....

Actually I did, as a shaman. Healer for raids, enha for everything else. For my guild mates I was a shaman. I could heal in raids, and destroy everything in BG. Shaman was my identity, not the spec I used. the ways I found to pay the respec cost is irrelevant here. Not part of RP or any BS of that kind.....

You bought gold I assume.

[AceofH]

the only way i would agree with dual spec being in the game is if it had a price tag of around 500g.

[TheRainman]

Again, I'm not defending anything. If anything I'm just playing devil's advocate. I never said the changes were important either. You are making things up in order to have an argument against me. Why? lol. That is what I don't understand. Why is it so difficult to have an honest discussion here?

After years of wanting vanilla servers, I would have imagined you people to be more open to making it the best version of itself it possibly could be. After all, if people don't play it it won't last right? So I guess my real question here is what is more important to you: making classic servers the best or having the exact version you want and to hell with everybody else? Also I understand the word retailer, you misread what I said.

Stop trying to dissect my posts in an attempt to debunk it part by part. I don't care of it stays exactly the same as 1.12 or it becomes this weird vanilla+ hybrid between old and new. Never have. I have just been trying to have a decent conversation, but most the people that reply to me seem to have some foam around their mouth and only see a buzzword instead of what I am actually saying.

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Why did you use airquotes around wanted? And if you yourself say who is to say what is added and what isn't, but then immediately say go play retail then as if you are to say what is or is not added. I laugh at that irony.

Huh? I put quotes around it because it was referencing the phrasing previously used by someone above me. What irony are you talking about here specifically? I think it was pretty obvious where I stood on the topic. Nothing should be added. It's vanilla.

Vanilla is vanilla. Anything added to vanilla is not vanilla.
What one person thinks should be added may not be what someone else thinks should be added and vice versa. This ultimately creates a murky area when trying to decide what to add and what to omit.

These two points are the driving force behind my personal opinion that vanilla should be exactly as it was and not victim to any of the subjective whims of the playerbase.

I could understand your confusion if I was advocating not adding certain things, but saying adding what I wanted was totally fine and if you don't like it to "go play retail" but that's not what was said.

The theme of the OP was being annoyed with people who respond with "Go play retail" when anything is suggested to be added.

[Specialka]

Which is fine, the problem is the massive "participation" (i.e. trolling) of all those who DON'T want classic servers, but produce about two third of the shit on the forums, drowning the actual discussions that could happen.

I mean, you're litterally the one who said "classic servers are a bad idea" and you're posting here and stirring shit up. Can't really prove the point more than that.

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I don't think AoE looting will have any measurable impact on the economy.
But I think having to loot each body independantly adds a small but measurable notch toward the verisimilitude and immersion aspect (the down-to-earth feeling of Vanilla compared to the overly gamey feeling that took WoW over), with the character patting the pocket of each corpse one by one to rob them of their valuables.

It's certainly not a big deal, but it does make a (small) difference. I wouldn't say it would ruin the game, but I would very much NOT see it implemented.

Also, your whole "vanilla economy doesn't exist" argument is just... completely nonsensical, pointless and only tend to indicate a deep level of bad faith "I will grasp at any straw just to not admit I could be wrong". Doesn't really reflect good on you nor help being convinced.

Well, you would be able to deactivated it as you can do that in retail wow, so I see no issue here!

Same for LFR, you won't even have to use it, you would be able to spam channel to find a group, so what is the big deal?

[Gamez]

Exactly. The people who actually fought, scratched and clawed for this want the original classic WoW experience. Not 'kinda like classic, but with modern bits too!'

the people who "fought, scratched and clawed for this" are just fooling themselves.
the nostalgic feeling will never come back even if it was Copy-Paste Vanilla wow with nothing added.

The reason why Vanilla was even considered "special" is because the game was NEW, there was almost nothing like it, most people were clueless on what to do.
There were even High Ranking players (Grand Marshal / High Warlord) back paddling their way to Rank 14.
Nowadays people are much smarter and actually know where to go or what to do.

I'd give Classic a year before people realize what a load of crap it is and who knows what damage might be dealt to retail by then.
Retarded habits from retail such as requiring some sort of Achievements-alternative, Gear Score addon, and Wowprogress links will make retail even more of a horrible experience than a real classic one.

[Aliven]

No, not at all.
If that was true then we'd, again, be back at the first post. Just play retail.

You see how silly this is? It's either vanilla or it's not.

I indeed see something silly.

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aoe looting, dual spec, etc

Well both dont give an edge.

You dont get more loot if you aoe loot.
Dual spec means you save some gold. Mostly meaningless because classes have one viable spec either way. Or like mage you do x raid in fire and y raid as frost.

[Askyl]

I don't care if "Classic" means a complete re-invented experience from patch 1.0 and progressing forward, or with a more balanced patch only progressing the content (like 1.12.1).

What I do hope, is that you toxic pieces of turds don't play on the same server I will play on. Please, stay away from Classic. What made vanilla great was the community, not if there was or was dual spec, aoe looting etc. That doesn't actually matter at all. The time consuming content that gives great reward mixed with a great community, that is what made vanilla WoW great. As long as features that destroyed the community parts of the game isn't implented, like LFR/LFD, I'm good.

As long as I get that, I'm happy. So please, for the love of everyone who actually did played and enjoyed vanilla (not just a month of it and act like you played all of it, to get E-points) don't even touch classic if you're going to bring this toxic behavior there.

[Deleted]

the people who "fought, scratched and clawed for this" are just fooling themselves.
the nostalgic feeling will never come back even if it was Copy-Paste Vanilla wow with nothing added.

The reason why Vanilla was even considered "special" is because the game was NEW, there was almost nothing like it, most people were clueless on what to do.
There were even High Ranking players (Grand Marshal / High Warlord) back paddling their way to Rank 14.
Nowadays people are much smarter and actually know where to go or what to do.

I'd give Classic a year before people realize what a load of crap it is and who knows what damage might be dealt to retail by then.
Retarded habits from retail such as requiring some sort of Achievements-alternative, Gear Score addon, and Wowprogress links will make retail even more of a horrible experience than a real classic one.

Yes, the nostalgic feeling will come back because some people actually enjoy Vanilla for what it was.
I can say 1,2,3,4...10 reasons why i enjoy more Classic than retail and those reasons will be back on Classic.

So stop pretending is all rose tinted goggles, some people actually know exactly why they prefer CLassic to Retail.

[Guyviroth]

I don't have much of an issue playing Classic as... well, classic. But I think they'd might as well add things like toggleable minimap POI. People will just download an addon to have it anyway, and those who don't want it can just turn it off--or have it toggled off by default.

[Deleted]

You bought gold I assume.

I didnt. But who cares? That's not the point.
The guild pay, or Im a big farmer, ah player or whatever... this have nothing to do with some ig identity

[SirCowdog]

These two points are the driving force behind my personal opinion that vanilla should be exactly as it was and not victim to any of the subjective whims of the playerbase.

Then you'd best break out your 2004 computer and windows XP install, play on 1600x1200 resolution, and hope to god Blizzard operated the game from a mothballed server, because otherwise it's not going to be "exactly" how it was.


There is almost no way that "Classic" servers are going to exactly match original vanilla servers. Recognizing that, and working towards translating an authentic-feeling vanilla experience rather than a direct carbon copy, is the key here. Trying too hard to perfectly re-create the conditions back in 2004-2007 is going to result in just as bad of an experience as it would by applying all the modern conveniences of 2017.

[Akka]

Then you'd best break out your 2004 computer and windows XP install, play on 1600x1200 resolution, and hope to god Blizzard operated the game from a mothballed server, because otherwise it's not going to be "exactly" how it was.

=>

I wonder, do you realize just how stupid your "counter" is and how much it is grasping at straws ? (on top of being wrong, of course, considering we already had 16:9 TV back them, but that's beside the point)
Equating game design with outside-game condition is just retarded, and very obviously so. If you need to go so full-blown ridiculous, it should tell you something about how weak your whole argument is already.

I guess we should start to make a pool of ready-to-post answers because it's becoming tiring to see the same boring spam of idiotic "reasonings" that we should not lost more than ten seconds with.

[Mercane]

The 11M were already there when Wrath started, so no it didn't "bring" them. It's a bit embarassing to not being able to read a graph you posted yourself.

It's pretty ignorant to assume that nobody quit from Vanilla's Launch to the end of Wrath- as to how many people Wrath 'brought in' there's no way for us to know.

[Santoryu]

You know what else is getting old? Casual scrubs asking for QoL changes in the upcoming classic realms.

[Deleted]

=>

I guess we should start to make a pool of ready-to-post answers because it's becoming tiring to see the same boring spam of idiotic "reasonings" that we should not lost more than ten seconds with.

You mean like the "go play retail" line automatically thrown at anybody who dare to ask for multimail ? That's for sure spam of idiotic reasoning that we shouldn't not lost more than ten sec with. ... think about legion, then think about vanilla with multimail without 3rd party addon. yeah it's really idiotic to pretend that's the same....

[Mercane]

You know what else is getting old? Casual scrubs asking for QoL changes in the upcoming classic realms.

Vanilla players, by definition, are the casual scrubs.

[Santoryu]

Vanilla players, by definition, are the casual scrubs.

Hahahaha sure, whatever you say.