Sargon debate with Richard Spencer

[urasim]

When the accepted definition of a word is "all forms of left-wing views", you don't have any ground to stand on when you claim you meant it only in reference to some shadowy subset you've invented in your own head and can't properly define in the first place.

This isn't slang or vernacular; it's using a word incorrectly.

Same goes for "regressive left". It isn't a thing. It's a pejorative insult, nothing more. You may as well be calling people "libtards"; you aren't making any kind of point.

No one is saying all but you. Regressive leftist is someone on the left that wants things like segregation. How is this hard?

[Orange Joe]

While Richard Spencer may be dishonest, when somebody like Milo says neo-nazis and white surpemacists hate him, they aren't wrong, considering Milo is a gay jew with a black husband.

Haven't you guys been screaming they don't exist? Now suddenly when they back up an argument for you they exist?

[Deleted]

People have been trying to ridicule and expose nazis for decades and there are more of them now than there has been in a long time. Obviously, that doesn't work.

For decades?
Are you actually serious?
Look at the "nazis" that tried to speak out on their ideology in the last "decades" and see if they were met with "ridicule", because most of the time they were met with a punch in the fucking face.

[Theodarzna]

Stick with that avatar picture, it's the best one so far.

I see you are a man or woman of taste and sophistication. :3

[Machismo]

Are they wrong in an objective sense, which I find implausible when we talk politics like this, or are they wrong for not sharing your incredible narrow brand of AnCap Liberalism? Who made you the dictator of what is and isn't a thing?

Well, it depends on exactly which view. Some are wrong in a political sense, and others are wrong in a moral sense. Then there are some that are simply objectively wrong.

I have no desire to be a dictator, that would be those authoritarians who want to ethnically cleanse minorities. Why would I stand next to them while they spouted that bullshit?

As for Milo and Shapiro, their stances are simply contradictory to one another. They are logically inconsistent with one another.

[SpookyMoonz]

Haven't you guys been screaming they don't exist? Now suddenly when they back up an argument for you they exist?

I haven't seen anyone say they don't exist; I've seen people acknowledge that they're a fringe group on the fringe of politics with no placement in mainstream political discussion - waving a swastika in a political forum gets you treated as a meme, reasonably; nazis are a fringe. Being anti-immigration, does not fucking make you a nazi. If that was the case, 75% of political parties that were nationally dominant in the West over the past 75 fucking years, can be called nazi.

Saying something is not around every fucking corner like you people do is NOT the same as saying 'they don't exist'.

[vondevon]

-snip- What the fuck? And when has Sargon sat there and said 'women are inferior' - how the fuck does antifeminism equate to misogyny? Jesus Christ.

Definition of feminism
1 : the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes

Anti- means inverse of-

Definition of misogyny
1 : dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women.

So the inverse of "theory of...social equity of the sexes" would in fact be "contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against [a gender]" (in this case it's women)

[Elegiac]

You must have missed when wanting immigration policy means nazism to these people.

When wanting "immigration policy" invariably means "racially biased immigration policy resembling something out of 1930s Germany"; yeah, it's not hard to see why they might call you a nazi.

[Video Games]

Definition of feminism
1 : the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes

Anti- means inverse of-

Definition of misogyny
1 : dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women.

So the inverse of "theory of...social equity of the sexes" would in fact be "contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against [a gender]" (in this case it's women)

If he hated women so much, why did he marry one and have 2 kids?

[SpookyMoonz]

When wanting "immigration policy" invariably means "racially biased immigration policy resembling something out of 1930s Germany"; yeah, it's not hard to see why they might call you a nazi.

Please show me where Sargon advocated for a racially-based immigration policy akin to 1930's SS racial standards and Nazi immigration standards. I'm eagerly awaiting. Considering, the origin of that post, was someone calling Sargon a nazi. I want to see where Sargon says 'I WANT NOTHING BUT ARYANS BEING THE CITIZENS OF THE NATIONS I LIVE IN.'

[Orange Joe]

I haven't seen anyone say they don't exist; I've seen people acknowledge that they're a fringe group on the fringe of politics with no placement in mainstream political discussion - waving a swastika in a political forum gets you treated as a meme, reasonably; nazis are a fringe. Being anti-immigration, does not fucking make you a nazi. If that was the case, 75% of political parties that were nationally dominant in the West over the past 75 fucking years, can be called nazi.

Saying something is not around every fucking corner like you people do is NOT the same as saying 'they don't exist'.

? Feel free to find 1 post of me calling ANYONE a nazi


Been here longer than you, I've seen many of the same faces say nazis aren't a thing.

[Machismo]

If he hated women so much, why did he marry one and have 2 kids?

Misogynists get married all the time...

Was that a serious question?

[Video Games]

Misogynists get married all the time...

Was that a serious question?

Ah. Yeah I hate squash, but I eat it all the time. I truly, truly hate it even though I eat it all the time.

[Theodarzna]

Definition of feminism
1 : the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes

Anti- means inverse of-

Definition of misogyny
1 : dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women.

So the inverse of "theory of...social equity of the sexes" would in fact be "contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against [a gender]" (in this case it's women)

This seems like a Motte and Bailey defence. Philosopher Nicholas Shackel coined the term “motte-and-bailey” to describe the rhetorical strategy in which a debater retreats to an uncontroversial claim when challenged on a controversial one. The structure goes something like this:

First, someone makes a controversial statement. Then when that statement, the bailey, is attacked, the speaker retreats to the motte, the place of “strict terms and/or rigorous reasoning”—falsely claiming that she was just making an obvious, uncontroversial point, one that could not possibly be challenged by any right-minded individual.

When people criticize Feminism they are criticizing the bad, malignant or controversial things. You can't say "Kill all Men!" but then retreat to "Muh Equality, Muh Dictionary" when questioned on what that means.

[urasim]

Haven't you guys been screaming they don't exist? Now suddenly when they back up an argument for you they exist?

Aren't you sick of producing such weak arguments? Name one person and prove they believe that NEO-Nazis and white supremacists don't exist.

[SpookyMoonz]

? Feel free to find 1 post of me calling ANYONE a nazi


Been here longer than you, I've seen many of the same faces say nazis aren't a thing.

I'd again say it's on the basis that nazis are a fringe identity with no relevance beyond sperglords and 4chan memes; for that matter, classical nazis aren't a thing anymore. Actual orthodox nazis aren't a thing anymore - when we're talking about extremely wealthy, extremely elite white men who have enormous social and political influence that believe in aryanism, no, they don't exist anymore; all we have are uncouth white supremacists delved from the lower-rung of certain European countries (and certain parts of America) and we can't classify every white supremacist as a nazi because it doesn't fucking work that way. White supremacy is a trait applied to a variety of political ideologies currently known in the West, not exactly an ideology within itself.

Nazis aren't under your bed anymore.

[Machismo]

Ah. Yeah I hate squash, but I eat it all the time. I truly, truly hate it even though I eat it all the time.

"How can they be racist, if they owned slaves?"

One can hate something, or believe them to be lesser than them, and still be around them. Let's not forget, Misogyny is a generalization, and maybe he simply found one that he tolerated. That being said, I'm not calling him a misogynist.

[Orange Joe]

I'd again say it's on the basis that nazis are a fringe identity with no relevance beyond sperglords and 4chan memes; for that matter, classical nazis aren't a thing anymore. Actual orthodox nazis aren't a thing anymore - when we're talking about extremely wealthy, extremely elite white men who have enormous social and political influence that believe in aryanism, no, they don't exist anymore; all we have are uncouth white supremacists delved from the lower-rung of certain European countries (and certain parts of America) and we can't classify every white supremacist as a nazi because it doesn't fucking work that way. White supremacy is a trait applied to a variety of political ideologies currently known in the West, not exactly an ideology within itself.

Nazis aren't under your bed anymore.

Never said they were? You seem to be confusing me with someone else.

[BuckSparkles]

Haven't you guys been screaming they don't exist? Now suddenly when they back up an argument for you they exist?

Who said they don't exist? We think they are irrelevant in terms of numbers and power, but of course they exist.

[SpookyMoonz]

Never said they were? You seem to be confusing me with someone else.

I..I didn't say you said it directly, obviously nazis were never under your bed even at their peak. One could identify I PROBABLY wasn't being literal with that entire statement - I was just remarking on the hysteria of believing that nazis have any relevance in political discussion now.