Battle for Azeroth Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Caerule]

To answer @rcshaggy:
You're right to assume there might be some complicated feelings between the Darkspear and the Zandalari.

They have always been opposites. The Zandalari are the unfallen empire of the Trolls. The "Civilized" Trolls that pioneered civilization, walking upright, and replaced some of their roots and Loa connection of the Shadow Hunter, with the culture of priests and structured rituals of sacrifice to individual Loa instead. The Zandalari are the remnant of the Empire that once stretched all of Azeroth, that was broken by the rise of the Night Elves. They remained at the heart of what it meant to be a Troll in the glory days. And their influence on Troll culture kept their people stuck in the past, wishing for a return to those old days. Feeling that, despite the new races having popped up everywhere, the world was theirs by ancient right. And this guidance has kept the many powerful Troll Tribes hostile, xenophobic and ever-nostalgic for the glorious past.

The Darkspear on the other hand are the outcasts of outcasts. Driven from Stranglethorn, they met up with the orcs, and while never losing their connection to the Loa, through following the guidance of the Shadow Hunters, they adapted their traditions and looked to the future instead of the past. A future in where, with the Horde, they ended up finding like-minded individuals and being a part of one of the two actual-dominant forces on Azeroth. That the Darkspear were on a new path became quite clear when the Prophet Zul led Zandalari forces to rally the Troll Clans to new hostility in patch 4.1, where Vol'jin walked away from the meeting, choosing to stand against them. The Darkspear reject the Troll Empire.

For years now, all we've seen of the Zandalari has been hostile. They rallied the Amani and Gurubashi against us. They aided the Mogu in Pandaria. They were the antagonist in the Vol'jin book as he recovered among the Pandaren, during a dire conflict.

So how do the Darkspear see the Zandalari? Well, a lot is going to depend on King Rastakhan. The Darkspears have been outcasts and rebels. The Zandalari have been rulers and kings. But while the connection to the Loa may be less personal, the Zandalari are still a major factor of troll culture and respect, and they are still very powerful. If Zandalar bows to the Horde, it means he will have to step away from the old ways. Away from the xenophobic pursuit of a Troll-ruled Azeroth. And embrace a new path, with the Horde. Sure, the Prophet Zul was behind most of the recent hostility, and is apparently now leading a rebellion. But it is a huge step for King Rastakhan to move away from the restoration of the Troll Empire. If the Zandalari now favor the Horde, and embrace like-minded non-Trolls and Troll Outcasts as being the path forward. That does a lot to mend bridges.

So in short, the Darkspear will probably view the Zandalari with a mixture of resentment and hope. And how much of each depends largely on how King Rastakhan sells it. He is The Troll King. But in joining the Horde he would have to accept a lesser role as one equal to the other race leaders. The Zandalari and Darkspear may just be about to become equals. If that's how it goes, that would be an epic moment for the Darkspear. If that's cool with Rastakhan, I don't see too many Darkspear hold on their resentment too long.

[Edoll]

Does anyone have a gif or video of the weird Nightborne bug that made them look like taurens? I can find pictures but I'd like to see it in motion.

[Caerule]

@rcshaggy posted while I was typing, so I'll add more:
I don't see the Amani ever having a good place in the Horde. They come from 6800 years or so of hating Blood Elves. It would take something very unique. For example, the Alliance could invade Quel'Thalas, and in their most desperate hour, the Blood Elves receive aid from the Amani, who do not want to see an Alliance-conquered Quel'thalas. And that would just be a first step to mend the ancient hatreds.

Gurubashi is difficult too. While a well-placed ally against Stormwind, these guys played their part in the events that led to the Darkspear being kicked out of Stranglethorn. There'd be bridges to mend there. But at least they didn't enslave the Loa like the Amani did recently. Except for Hakkar, but I'm sure that can be forgiven.

The Farakki would have to adjust their culture a lot. All that necromancy, cannibalism and human sacrifice doesn't fly in the Horde. Well, possibly the first and a bit of the second, under Sylvanas. I am not certain people would be too exciting to play the thin grey Troll however.

Drakkari. No, I don't see even the other Trolls accept these Ice Trolls. They were up there for a reason. And eating your gods doesn't make anyone happy. Also their place is pretty much in ruin.

That doesn't leave much, except the Hinterlands Trolls who we pretty much already got. They would need renewed story to become interesting though.

Dark Trolls? It's unknown if any yet remain. I have no doubt we'll find them if we ever get a "Dark Below" expansion that takes place in the depths of Azeroth. Perhaps they are related to the "Stone Trolls" aka Drogbar.

[rcshaggy]

@Caerule Well there is one tribe of Forest Trolls who are the Horde side which are the Revantusk Tribe...

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Wow that picture you linked is really cool. I love it

Well I could link you it if you want.

[Caerule]

@Caerule Well there is one tribe of Forest Trolls who are the Horde side which are the Revantusk Tribe...

Yeah. Like I said, we pretty much already got them. They just aren't really used like an Allied Race at the moment. Not seen outside the Hinterlands, and not available as thing you can play.

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I hope the answer about Zandalari and Darkspear helped out at least.

As for a story that could get Forest Trolls back into the Horde. If not the Amani, it's possible if the expansion after BfA has another world remake. Maybe updating the story of the Hinterlands could make it a lot more interesting for Allied Race origins?

Then again, we would already have 2 Trolls in the Horde. Do you think Blizzard will go so overboard with it as they possibly could? I mean, there are a lot of possibly allied races. Trolls have lots of kinds. So do Dwarves. And Orcs. And several more Tauren too. I suppose it remains to be seen how far Blizz will take this .

[Gangreflamme]

Is the ptr still down ? Any builds?

[Aruzan]

Is the ptr still down ? Any builds?

Still down, no builds.

[Ningjinq]

I wonder if they intended to push a new build but something happened at the last second?

[Gangreflamme]

Is it me or it takes longer than usual?

[rcshaggy]

MMO-Champion is not working right for me. :/

[Chickat]

Its still technically possible for a build push for another hour I believe, but probably delayed till tomorrow. Either way if its coming the 16th this needs to be release candidate with no big changes.

[rcshaggy]

https://oxanta.deviantart.com/

[Projectmars]

Seriously, why the fuck are we getting Void Elves instead of Vyrkul. Blizzard messed up big time.

[Aruzan]

Seriously, why the fuck are we getting Void Elves instead of Vyrkul. Blizzard messed up big time.

Taurens already get stuck on doors, Zandalari most likely will along with Highmountain Tauren. Do you really think they'll make Vrykul playable? They'd have to come up with a tribe of small Vrykul (Which would be pretty much what Humans were). Ogres would also have this issue.

[AngerFork]

Seriously, why the fuck are we getting Void Elves instead of Vyrkul. Blizzard messed up big time.

Have you seen all the fan art and people excited about Void Elves? I imagine many of those people would disagree. Besides, it's not like the two are mutually exclusive, there's still a chance for Vrykul to be an Allied Race later on down the line.

[Valysar]

Vrykuls and ogres are too tall yes, so until we don't have a way to make them smaller you'll never have them playable

[rcshaggy]

Vrykuls and ogres are too tall yes, so until we don't have a way to make them smaller you'll never have them playable

But Venture Co has Ogres smaller than most...

[ello]

The real issue with Ogres is the female model. They could come up with one if they really tried but I think that would be too much work for allied races.

[tristannarutofan]

vrykrul are humans with different hair options, faces and hunched over that are also twice the size of player characters.

If you'd change the size of one it would literally be that new kul tiran model. When blizz first did their annoucnement video the first imagine of one was that captain sitting at the table in that dungeon and my first thought was "well i guess it makes sense the occasional vrykrul might leave the life of vikinging and become a pirate"

there is very strong good reason to think that the end of the major campaign on the two islands will unlock 2 more allied races, the Kul'tirans and another for horde (maybe the sneeple? note they use worgen skeleton). Because to me every sign points to...Since the new kultiran model is literally a human sized vrykrul, that that is their answer to it.

same with ogres the only way we'd get one is if we played a "small offshoot ' tribe (similar to how the darkspear are small offshoot tribe of trolls)....and...for the vrykrule thats literally what they are. Humans are just a subrace of Vrykrul so it stands to reason some human tribes might have a stronger Vrykrulian heritage

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The real issue with Ogres is the female model. They could come up with one if they really tried but I think that would be too much work for allied races.

one thing that bugged me was that they talked about the model being a kul tiran but the video showed multiple normal sized humans. To me that makes it seem obvious that (like real life) there are genetic differences. But i wonder if all the female models were placeholders or not. Since the leading lady and her mother seem to be normal i dont think they are all like the goth cat lady.

thats why i have a small theory that they will just add the option for all humans to be either rather than add a Kul tiran allied race. however i find the allied race thing to be more likely.

back to ogres i get the feeling that when they do them that they will go over a huge artistic overhaul. Even if we didnt get the fuzzy worgen that were initially in alpha the finished model was way more human and less monsterous than the worgen in game. Similar to the goblins, they have hairstyles , faces and ears that woudlnt even have been SUGGESTED with the base goblins.

So if/when they do ogres i'm sure some will hate how they look because they are probably going to look like Neil Goodman and Rosanne with tusks and facepaint. with a high res face and more 'human' features

[axlkix]

Any news about new warlock animations in the next build?