[SPOILERS]: Saurfang Stockades Dialogue

[Enrif]

Lord of the Clans says "Hi!"

you mean the adventure game, directed by Metzen, which was canceled 3 years before Golden wrote the Book that summarized the story? yes i heard of it

[TheFirstOnes]

Sylvanas is corrupt I tell you, the old gods forced her to use the plague, she is a good girl, she didnt do nothing

*Pats on Gunner45's back*

It's okay. It's okay.

[Kwento]

you mean the adventure game, directed by Metzen, which was canceled 3 years before Golden wrote the Book that summarized the story? yes i heard of it

Wasn’t this game full of ridiculous stuff like Zul’Jin owning a pawnshop and Deathwing smoking a hookah?

[Enrif]

Wasn’t this game full of ridiculous stuff like Zul’Jin owning a pawnshop and Deathwing smoking a hookah?

stll better story then that of garrosh

[Kwento]

stll better story then that of garrosh

Back then it was all good... Until zombies arrived...

[Graharam]

Calling it now, Saurfang brings back Thrall.

And if there is one, there shall be Metzen.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

• "Her heart is a crater and we have filled it."
• "Its surface blazes bright, masking shadows below."
• "Nothing good ever came out of Silithus!"

We all saw that look on Anduin and Sylvanas's faces when they first held Azurite. We all saw how quickly operations in Silithus descended into violence.

I don't think Saurfang would ever betray the Horde, but he might be the first to note the return of those old whispers - to both sides. Perhaps this is what he wants to talk to Anduin about.

[Qualia]

Seems like betraying the Horde is better than Mak'gora... Much honor such wow nice writers...
He's nothing but talk at the moment. Hopefully this datamined thingie is there just for bait and won't be in at launch.

BFA datamines for now look like machete&katana + lore&characters in a blender...

Going with current theories, Saurfang is just as much of a traitor as Vol'jin was. In other words, it entirely depends on your viewpoint, or who the winner will be lore-wise. Keep in mind that Saurfang never said he wouldn't return to the Horde or the Orcs, he said he wouldn't return to her (Sylvanas') Horde. Like Vol'jin, he is finding himself disagreeing with certain opinions of the Warchief, and thus, might not consider said Warchief's Horde to be the right path the Horde should go down. If Sylvanas is to be defeated and removed from the Horde (or killed), Saurfang will be a patriotic revolutionist that sought to correct the Horde to what it should be - probably what Thrall's Horde was. On the other hand, if Blizzard want to make Sylvanas prevails for some reasons, Saurfang will go down as a traitor who went against the Warchief. What do you think will more likely to be the case? (Well, there are various other scenarios such as, but not limited to, Sylvanas "redeeming" / changing her mindset and everyone will be working together happily against Azshara / N'Zoth / whatever the Void throws at us, but for the sake of simplicity let's just go with these two)

I wouldn't have too much hope in "this datamined thingie is there just for bait" if I'm you (and some others). It's true that things can change between Alpha and Release version. However, Blizzard doesn't have so much spare time to deploy a test "just for bait". They are already pushed for time as it is. Saurfang's ideal clashing with Sylvanas would be a rather important plot point in the story, so I don't think that will be changed much. The minor details (i.e: this speech, the reason behind the clash) might change, but I doubt they would scrap a major plot-point that potentially will span over most of the expansion entirely - just like how Sylvanas' speech before burning Teldrassil changed, but the fact that the Horde attacked it and the tree burned in the end wouldn't change.

[Enrif]

there is something to point out thatis different to the garrosh and vol'jin story.
Sylvanas and Saurfang are both very popular and fan favorites.
Garrosh and Vol'jin were neither before Cata, and even after then they were at most liked but not loved.

Sylvanas and Saurfang are loved by the playerbase since classic(since wc3 for Sylvanas). What ever impact the MoP Story had on the playerbase, the Story of BfA will ramp it up to 11. And we already see this in the community reactions

[Mehrunes]

Well golden just twitted.

"Gentle Reminder that you won’t know if you like the Battle for Azeroth Storylines until you have played the entire expansion after it’s officially released! It’s a journey. Don’t get hung up on bits and pieces you run across now that may or may not even be in the game."

WoD was a journey too. It sucked. Kinda happens when the premise itself is a pile of garbage.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Ooooh it's coming boys, Sylvanas' death is coming

Totally one hundred percent.

[ls-]

there is something to point out thatis different to the garrosh and vol'jin story.
Sylvanas and Saurfang are both very popular and fan favorites.
Garrosh and Vol'jin were neither before Cata, and even after then they were at most liked but not loved.

Sylvanas and Saurfang are loved by the playerbase since classic(since wc3 for Sylvanas). What ever impact the MoP Story had on the playerbase, the Story of BfA will ramp it up to 11. And we already see this in the community reactions

But there's also people that would gladly see either or both of them dead.

I, for instance, dislike Varok's character, I strongly believe that killing his son at the Wrathgate was a mistake, Varok should've been the one who died that day, so I'll gladly grant him his wish and reunite him w/ his family if we ever get an opportunity to do so.

[Enrif]

I reckon it's pretty certain at this point

in, before she becomes the new Loa of Death!

[Friendlyimmolation]

I reckon it's pretty certain at this point

About as certain as pigs flying, nothing in concrete now, and even then Saurfang doesn't speak for all the Horde, nor can he tell the future.


It is quite possible for someone to disagree with a warchief without the warchief dying.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Why? Her character arc since the beginning of Legion is obviously making her a more dark character, the whole process of which started in Cata - Saurfang got a new model, just like Vol'Jin did, he is alienated by Sylvannas and let's face it, Sylvanas is nowhere near as popular lorewise amongst the Horde as Saurfang is. It was obvious when Vol'jin was being set up to overthrow Garrosh and it's obvious now.

Uh, you might want to actually re-read or read anything to do with Sylvanas recently. Her wish to save her people is a lighter direction than she was in Cataclysm.

The Horde isn't going to respect Saurfang nearly as much if he ends up serving or working alongside Anduin. Orcs will disown him, blood elves will mock him, Baine is up in the air.

if by obvious you mean taking a foot and running a mile. Then yes, it is super duper obvious she's going to die.

[ls-]

Baine is up in the air.

Baine will prob high five him

[Mehrunes]

Saurfang lived through all warchiefs, and he is telling we shouldn't misunderstand loyalty for honor.

Which is kinda rich coming from an Orc that misunderstands honor for suicidal tendencies in the first place.

I really don’t see how you are saying this is MoP 2.0 already. Saurfang disagrees with sylvanas but he’s clearly not going to kill her. It’ll probably be more democratic then that (maybe he goes to Draenor to get followers) but even then nothing is pointing to “warchief is committing genocide and doing everything wrong therefore he/she has to die” at all.

Because the way things are now Saurfang is already as anti-Warchief as Vol'jin was in the middle of the second expansion focusing on Garrosh? Before we even properly start the expansion and go to Zandalar?

We only had horde infighting for half an expansion (most of MOP wasn’t too centered around garrosh being an ass, the latter half focused on it entirely), how are people so upset about seeing it again for the 2nd time? There’s literally nothing to be freaking out about, we aren’t going to kill sylvanas she has way too much plot armor. Regardless of that, we only had legitimate horde infighting for half an expac, we get a tiny bit of it in BfA and you’re “tired” of it? The hell?

Because it was poorly done and rushed even the first time, despite having years of build up. Now they are rushing it even more. That's not exactly going to result in more quality out of a sudden. And even that aside, it's redundant storry telling. Seeing the same exact story twice is indeed tiresome. And sign of creative bankruptcy on Blizzard's part. Also, Sylvanas doesn't have plot armor.

[Dagoth Ur]

I will allow myself potential overreaction because that's just crap.

I even don't have as much problem with Sylvanas potentially dying as much as I have with Saurfang plotting with Anduin. Is it that much to ask that fucking Anduin just stays away from the Horde? If I wanted to interact with that unbearable caricature of a character I would roll Alliance.

Saurfang instead of trying to bring change from within thinks it's better to sulk in Anduin's prison cell and repeat honor on loop? Like Thrall, Baine, Rokhan, Lor'themar wouldn't listen to him if he presented his reasonable case against Sylvanas. Also this just makes it seem like Vol'jin's decision was total and utter mistake when we were all lead to believe there's something more to it and Loa gave him some insight into what will happen in BfA.

Ughh... Looks like we're on boat to Obviousland.

[Mehrunes]

I think it's too soon to draw conclusion. And i doubt (or hope) that Blizzard is so "stupid" to do a copy of MoP.

Yet they were stupid enough to do a time travel bullshit copy of the rise of the Horde.

That said, this Saurfang line coming so soon in expansion it's a clear difference with what happened in MoP. The "rebellion" of and against Garrosh was built later on expansion, with very very little hints at beginning of expac. This time it seems more like a reverse MoP, full speed on Faction conflict at beginning, probably slowing down during the laster patches to (maybe) confront the "big bad guy".

Which, lo and behold, only makes the situation even worse rather than redeeming it. A rushed copy is even worse than just a copy. And if they drop faction conflict because of big bad it'll be illogical nonsense. AND a copy of Cata instead (the expansion that started with Cairne challenging Garrosh and Vol'jin threatening him with death, so even that rebellion wasn't as gradual as you make it to be, it was a powder keg waiting to blow from day 1).

Let's have a little faith in Blizzard storytelling, or at least common sense

When have they earned it?

Sylvanas has betrayed what the Horde values more. Saurfang is the horde given form.

The Horde is a dictatorship where Warchief has the absolute rule and sets the direction for it, originally created to destroy the enemies of the Orcs.

[Dagoth Ur]

I dunno why he doesn't just challenge her to Mak'Gora and be done with it, it's not like she's be competition for him

Yeah, agreed. I mean not sure if he would win but at least it would be in character.

I mean plotting just doesn't feel like Saurfang and neither is leaving orcs hanging while he sulks in prison. In Warcrimes he was all about Mak'gora when it was Garrosh in question and now with Sylvanas the only way out he sees is to plot with Alliance? I really hope there's more to it than what's implied so far.