Officer Involved Shooting (again)

[Super Kami Dende]

Recently there was an officer involved shooting close to use that has got the communtiy riled up over it. THIS is the video of what went down. I'm not saying that this guy was without fault or fully innocent because he wasn't. He was most likely high on PCP or meth, he ran from the officer, he ran after being tazed, he assaulted the officer, he fought with the two officers after he was maced, and he grabbed the one officer's baton after the officer took it out. However he did not deserve to be shot.

Sounds like he was pretty deserving of it. People say use "less-Lethal force" they tazed him and he didn't stop and was a danger. No more apt time to put a bullet in him.

[GreenJesus]

You need to stop watching old as stale unfunny skits from about 20 years ago, and maybe get with 2018 and reality. Good people do all sorts of things they shouldn't that is why we have police in the first place, people make mistakes, people get into trouble, that is why police are honored for the service they do, because despite the fact they seen human beings at their worse, they are supposed to be our best, FOR ALL people.

As for what you would could or should do, yes I agree with you, but that doesn't mean you are somehow the judge of what other people do, just because you happened to watch less than a minute of video. Those cops did everything they could, but at the end of the day they are cops, and they have to protect the others and themselves.

and I'm 99.999999% sure you pulled that statistic out of your ass.

People make mistakes kid, and often times these are the men and women that will be their when you do the stupidest shit, and while I don't like you and think your comment is stupid, that also includes you. I would hope that despite whatever mistakes you make, you will live to learn from it, provided you didn't kill or hurt someone else.

It would never be a good day regardless to how stupid you might be, for you to be killed, or that those who love you would have to endure that pain. Human beings don't live long happy lives of always making the right choices.

Having a fist fight with a cop trying to arrest you and then stealing his baton and attempting to beat him with it makes you a bad person. Good people don't beat up cops on bad days. On my bad days I sit in bed and feel sorry for myself, I don't injure or put other people at risk. Beating up a cop wasn't a "mistake". It was his CHOICE to do that. A mistake is forgetting your iphone or keys in your car. He made a conscious choice to beat up an officer.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Having a fist fight with a cop trying to arrest you and then stealing his baton and attempting to beat him with it makes you a bad person. Good people don't beat up cops on bad days. On my bad days I sit in bed and feel sorry for myself, I don't injure or put other people at risk.

People make mistakes all the time, he could have been on drugs, he could have had a medical condition. As for what you do, you aren't everybody and everybody isn't you, but like everybody you make mistakes really, really stupid mistakes, you don't deserve to die because of it, unless you hurt o kill someone else

[GreenJesus]

People make mistakes all the time, he could have been on drugs, he could have had a medical condition. As for what you do, you aren't everybody and everybody isn't you, but like everybody you make mistakes really, really stupid mistakes, you don't deserve to die because of it, unless you hurt o kill someone else

When you wake up in the hospital brain dead because a druggy beat you with a club I am sure you will be thinking "ooo ... its fine.. He was on drugs.. I guess my situation is fine then." O wait.. you wouldn't be able to think that never mind. If he was on drugs, then today he learned the hard way "Don't do drugs kids".

[Doctor Amadeus]

When you wake up in the hospital brain dead because a druggy beat you with a club I am sure you will be thinking "ooo ... its fine.. He was on drugs.. I guess my situation is fine then." O wait.. you wouldn't be able to think that never mind. If he was on drugs, then today he learned the hard way "Don't do drugs kids".

First off one thing has nothing to do with the other, how I feel about the situation one way or another and second if your only reason for showing any kind of compassion or empathy towards anybody else is what you get from it in return, then maybe you should stay in your room and think about that a little more.

However if the moral implications mean nothing to you, then do it from a purely logical and reasonable standpoint.

Going around pointing your fucking finger at the mistakes of others and justifying that bullshit in your mind as ok really makes you no better than anybody you're passing judgement on, because when it comes right down to it, it isn't helpful.

Trust me you aren't the only one that doesn't give a fuck, there are plenty of other self righteous types that feel the same way, and they and you aren't making the world a better fucking place and if you think that kind of shit does lead to a better world if everybody followed it, maybe while you are sitting in your room thinking about shit hows about cracking open a fucking history book, and reading up on societies that embraced that same kind of shit.

There is a reason fucked up places like that don't exist anymore, and why you for as much as I have seen you spew about loving your culture, live HERE in the U.S. So honestly save yourself and spare anyone else your bullshit on what you think other people deserve based on your judgements.

You aren't particularly better than anyone else just because, and your choices although not on display for the world the see even a little bit behind your avatar there, you can be judges just as harsly for your stupidity.

So how about instead of all that, if you actually are the better person behave like one, not because there happens to be a lot of shitty people out there, and those using that as an excuse to go on being shitty to other people.

Nobody who has actually ever lived life sees your obnoxious judgements as you being superior or any better than anybody else either.


OH and no by the way I am not trying to insult you, I am just pointing out that there is a man who is dead, and it's more than a little shitty and obnoxious to be cheering the fucking death of anyone.

[Polyxo]

There's no valid rationale for even pulling out a gun at any point in this altercation, let alone shooting. While it won't happen, the police should be fired and prosecuted.

Also, I like how to some people, the guy swinging the baton he was just being hit with is some danger beyond the pale that must be eradicated instantly with maximum force possible.

[Deletedaccount1]

That officer wasn't trained to use his baton properly. His stance was completely wrong and he was flailing it around, the suspect was easily dodging him. It also looked like he missed his taser. One proper hit from either of those would have incapacitated him. That cop should be fired and prosecuted.

[Cruor]

There's no valid rationale for even pulling out a gun at any point in this altercation, let alone shooting. While it won't happen, the police should be fired and prosecuted.

Also, I like how to some people, the guy swinging the baton he was just being hit with is some danger beyond the pale that must be eradicated instantly with maximum force possible.

I honestly feel like you are crazy if you are not trolling. First off, lets look at the guy. He LOOKS like a thug. You can't always judge a book by its cover, but 90% of the time you can. Then lets see how he acts. He acts like a thug. He runs from the police, he punches the police. Ok, at this point, we are sure he is a scumbag thug gangsta wannbe.

Moving on, the cop TRIED if your way. He tazed him, didn't work. He tried to grab him, guy clobbered him. Another cop maces him, that didn't work. He pulls a club out, guy steals it. THEN he was shot. He honestly asked for it. Hes a criminal violent thug and our streets are better off without him. Do you want him on your streets? I sure as hell don't.

Once again, good people do not punch police. Even if they are wrong, get arrested THEN sue them for wrongful arrest and treatment if they are wrong, don't punch or run. What does it take to get this through your skull? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEvMc-K8XHY Watch that video. If that guy had followed it he would be alive. That's all there is to it.

[Deletedaccount1]

I honestly feel like you are crazy if you are not trolling. First off, lets look at the guy. He LOOKS like a thug. You can't always judge a book by its cover, but 90% of the time you can. Then lets see how he acts. He acts like a thug. He runs from the police, he punches the police. Ok, at this point, we are sure he is a scumbag thug gangsta wannbe.

Moving on, the cop TRIED if your way. He tazed him, didn't work. He tried to grab him, guy clobbered him. Another cop maces him, that didn't work. He pulls a club out, guy steals it. THEN he was shot. He honestly asked for it. Hes a criminal violent thug and our streets are better off without him. Do you want him on your streets? I sure as hell don't.

Once again, good people do not punch police. Even if they are wrong, get arrested THEN sue them for wrongful arrest and treatment if they are wrong, don't punch or run. What does it take to get this through your skull? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEvMc-K8XHY Watch that video. If that guy had followed it he would be alive. That's all there is to it.

You are ignoring the fact that if the officer knew what he was doing, the suspect would never have taken his baton. He probably didn't even need to pull it out had he tackled and cuffed him and didn't miss with his taser.

[Eldar45]

Were those two cops at risk of dying to a baton attack?

One hard hit across the head can be lethal, or can do serious brain damage. A doped out guy running on adrenaline can hit very hard, and at the point that he got a weapon at extremely close range it isn't possible to retreat anymore. I believe that in self-defense scenarios if someone is charging at you, even without a weapon, and within about 7-10 feet you are legally able to use lethal force to stop the assailant. You aren't just defending yourself from risk of death, you are also defending yourself from grievous bodily harm.

The lesson from this shouldn't be the cops should shoot people. The lesson should be don't do drugs and attack cops.

You are ignoring the fact that if the officer knew what he was doing, the suspect would never have taken his baton. He probably didn't even need to pull it out had he tackled and cuffed him and didn't miss with his taser.

Those are big words for someone who has probably never had to attack a drugged up assailant who is trying to do bodily harm to you. It isn't as simple as tackle him and by doing so you put yourself more at risk of injury.

[Cruor]

You are ignoring the fact that if the officer knew what he was doing, the suspect would never have taken his baton. He probably didn't even need to pull it out had he tackled and cuffed him and didn't miss with his taser.

You are ignoring the fact that if the guy followed the video he would be alive and well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEvMc-K8XHY The taser is not perfect, it looked like he did hit but it got his clothing and not his skin, didn't make proper contact. In the heat of the moment in a fight you can't always make things go perfectly. A cop can't be expected to beat up everybody, what if some guy has been in street fights non stop since he was 8? Might get pretty good at fighting. What about female officers vs a big guy? This isn't the politically correct world of games and movies, the toughest women on the planet will get wrecked by the 1,000th toughest man. Is she expected to just hand to hand him and get beaten up or killed?

Don't wanna get killed or beaten, don't fight the police, its such a simple concept. Once again, for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEvMc-K8XHY

[Rotted]

He's high?
He Ran?
He got tazed then ran?
Then assaulted an officer?
Then got maced?
Then fought two officers?
Had enough strength and reactions to take a baton off an officer?

And you're surprised he got shot?

Fucker dam well deserved it. I'm not a advocate of guns nor the use of them. But what the hell do you think this guy who has pumped up on god knows what shit (A lot more than fucking meth I can tell you that) was going to do when he had that baton? He was a risk to the officers any any surrounding person, they reacted as they should have.

[Deletedaccount1]

You are ignoring the fact that if the guy followed the video he would be alive and well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEvMc-K8XHY The taser is not perfect, it looked like he did hit but it got his clothing and not his skin, didn't make proper contact. In the heat of the moment in a fight you can't always make things go perfectly. A cop can't be expected to beat up everybody, what if some guy has been in street fights non stop since he was 8? Might get pretty good at fighting. What about female officers vs a big guy? This isn't the politically correct world of games and movies, the toughest women on the planet will get wrecked by the 1,000th toughest man. Is she expected to just hand to hand him and get beaten up or killed?

Don't wanna get killed or beaten, don't fight the police, its such a simple concept. Once again, for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEvMc-K8XHY

You have an authoritarian view of the relation between the state and the individual that isn't going to convince someone like me. The burden lies on the state, not the individual so the state taking someone's life when there were reasonable measures that could have been taken to stop it are unacceptable. And there were reasonable steps.

You are strawmanning me so hard here. Did I say the cop needs to be able to beat anyone up? No, of course not but he should at least be competent which this officer wasn't. He flailed his baton like a child and let the suspect take it.

This video illustrates proper technique for using a baton. You might notice something here. The instructor in that video is a US Marshal. If you follow these police screw ups over time, you realize that incompetency in police forces tends to happen at the bottom (i.e. local departments) and not at the top where officers are more skilled and receive better training (FBI, SWAT, Marshals, etc.).

My solution? End the drug war among other things so there is less of a need for incompetent police officers.

[Deleted]

He's high?
He Ran?
He got tazed then ran?
Then assaulted an officer?
Then got maced?
Then fought two officers?
Had enough strength and reactions to take a baton off an officer?

And you're surprised he got shot?

Fucker dam well deserved it. I'm not a advocate of guns nor the use of them. But what the hell do you think this guy who has pumped up on god knows what shit (A lot more than fucking meth I can tell you that) was going to do when he had that baton? He was a risk to the officers any any surrounding person, they reacted as they should have.

I have to agree with you, I mean... what more does he need to do before it's justified in the eyes of the community?

[Deleted]

Yes, what more provocation did the nazis need? Of course they had to gas the jews.

OK, time for your medicine and a good nap in the happy room.

[Najnaj]

At the point the second officer showed up, there was still one more taser that could have been used. Yes he was armed for a few seconds before they opened fire on him but it was a damn baton not a gun. They immediately opened fire on him when he took the baton. Non-lethal force could have still been used but they decided to open fire on him instead.

They probably didn't "decide" to open fire. Police are human, not robots. When someone high on meth comes at you with a baton, you tend to panic. This is universal and will never change. Nobody deserves to be shot down on the street but this is what happens when you scare people with guns. It is easy to sit and type about what should have been done but in the same situation I can see myself doing the same thing.

Only two things that can be done is 1. Donn't attack police. or 2 Take away their guns. Option 1 is impossible to legislate but option 2 is not and it is working well in many countries.

[McFuu]

Police did everything by the book, there is absolutely nothing to be said otherwise. People won't be satisfied unless a cop dies too.

[Ghostpanther]

You take a swing on cops and steal their weapons, you're literally asking to be shot.

For sure.

But I have not watched the video in this case. No facebook account.

[prwraith]

Cops can assault you for little to no reason, but according to the police brutality fans in this thread, you can't defend yourself apparently.

So what's the point of having laws like the 2nd Amendment when there's never a lawful ground to defend yourself against tyranny and brutality?

Submitting to an arrest is not submitting to police brutality. You induce brutality when you exhibit it.

[Deleted]

Way too fast with the guns, it's ridiculous.

Way too fast? They tazed him, peppersprayed him, tried to use their nightstick.

Its not like the gun was the first choice.

They did the right thing, from the information we have now.