China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

[Acidbaron]

Read about this recently, apparently it can be something as minor as walking across the street when the light is red. There are cameras at crossings and if you do it like 5 times you can't do anything in that town anymore, like rent.

I mean it has its benefits and negatives we'll see how it turns out.

[dragonballgtz]

Love this part “once untrustworthy, always restricted” I sure this system won't get abused

[Deldavala]

So take this from someone studying extactly this.

Currently there is 3 systems that are being discussed. 2 of them are from companies(Tencent and Alibaba) and the last one is supposed to come from the CCP.

Then ones from Tencent and Alibaba are sort of like a privatized(as privatized you can get in China) "Credit score" as you have in the US. If you have problems paying your bills, not doing payments correctly on the platform, scam people, not paying fines and so forth. You get flagged and might not get to use the services, or get worse rates. Since Alibaba and Tencent have tight relationships with the Chinese banks you can also find difficulty with getting loans.

The last one is something that CCP is working with, but is not yet fully implemented. A lot of the western media is drawing similarities with the Black mirror episode "Nosedive", but in practice the system is currently not that advanced. As it is now, the system is mostly a score that reflects your daily life actions. If you have a criminal record, smaller fines, been reported for misconduct, spreading propaganda/fake news(and similiar), your score will get lowered. If you are then lower than a certain treshold, you have certain liberties(like leaving the country, traveling between provinces) revoked.

To take similarties with the west. If you are an idiot that spread fake news and has had several incidents on public transportation, you are not necessarily put on a No-Flight list in the west. If you do that in China you can accumelate enough negative points to be put on a such list, even if you never have set foot on a plain.

[shadowmouse]

getting reliable Information about China from within is extremely difficult and dangerous.

Erm, not really. The Chinese have a constant flow of gossip, pictures, videos, and "banned" comments. Many of those will come out by the second beer. In the case of taxi drivers and others who have a captive audience, the beer isn't even necessary. Even drinking with police one is apt to get quite a few tales.

Secondly falun gong is not a movement, it's an activity

Bullshit. Meditation is an activity. That particular form of meditation traces back to one practitioner who is pretty well the head of a cult. It gets sanitized for sympathy, but that doesn't change what is going on. It functions as a movement, and that movement here is cult like in its deference to their leader.

Last time I was in Mongolia there was nothing special about their girl's drinking habits.

Are you sure you were drinking with Mongolians? When I dated a girl from Mongolia, she insisted on giving me drinking lessons to make sure that I was up to meeting people. When I ended up drinking with Mongolians, I understood her point. As a student said "for a meal, the men should have a bottle of spirits, and after they drink that they drink a box (case) of beer -- the large ones, not small ones like this (indicating 500ml as small)." She horrified the whole restaurant by having me drink baijiu out of the bottle because "that's the way we do it at home" and it made her feel more comfortable. She was my (quasi-adoptive) daughter's old room mate, so I'm comfortable she wasn't playing games with the foreigner. Many women in China, my fiancee for example, drink little or nothing. Women from the Northeast, Inner Mongolia, and Korea are known as hazardous exceptions to that.

So far, you seem to be pulling comments out of your ass, and not doing much to try to back them up.

You are posting from China,at least according to you. Kindly learn the uses of words before trying to criticize them.

Posting "from" does not mean that I *am* Chinese, and I had previously noted in this thread that I am not Chinese, do not, and in fact by law never in all of my days will have a Chinese ID. Try harder to keep up. As for those "free" journalists, yep, I posted links to more balanced articles. Try reading them. My paycheck doesn't have a thing to do with what I write here, when you can say the same about theirs ... get back to me.

Edit:

So take this from someone studying extactly this.

Great! I'd appreciate it if you'd look back at the articles I linked earlier, and if I've posted bullshit, please call it out with specific references. Contrary to some folks' expectations, I have no interest in promoting fake news. If I spout something that seems bullshit, call that out too (but back up your reasons so I can reply).

[Phookah]

It's pretty hilarious seeing bungee rip open the asses of all the knobs who believe every stupid thing they read about China.

[Deldavala]

Great! I'd appreciate it if you'd look back at the articles I linked earlier, and if I've posted bullshit, please call it out with specific references. Contrary to some folks' expectations, I have no interest in promoting fake news. If I spout something that seems bullshit, call that out too (but back up your reasons so I can reply).

I will do so later. I am off to the movies. I just wanted to chime in since I just did a rather huge presentation and had a debate on the subject.

I will say though, if you want you can get ranked on the social variant(that has no implications yet). You will just get a score that tells you about other stuff namely: “honesty in government affairs” (政务诚*), “commercial integrity” (商务诚*), “societal integrity” (社会诚*), and “judicial credibility” (司法公*). You just need a Chinese bank account and a Chinese registered SIM card.

It doesnt want to write *(xìn) on this forum apparantly.

[P for Pancetta]

Erm, not really. The Chinese have a constant flow of gossip, pictures, videos, and "banned" comments. Many of those will come out by the second beer. In the case of taxi drivers and others who have a captive audience, the beer isn't even necessary. Even drinking with police one is apt to get quite a few tales.

We're not talking about gossip here we're talking about genocide and censorship on a scale that makes 1984 look like a fairy tale. People regularly disappear for talking about these things in public.

Bullshit. Meditation is an activity. That particular form of meditation traces back to one practitioner who is pretty well the head of a cult. It gets sanitized for sympathy, but that doesn't change what is going on. It functions as a movement, and that movement here is cult like in its deference to their leader.

Before 1999 when the prosecution of these people began, it was pretty much like Tai-Chi is today in china with many people just practicing it on the street as a leisure activity. You're spouting propaganda created by the communist party without even realizing it. Or maybe you do but you won't talk about the truth because you're afraid they'll pick you up and drag you down into a prisoners camp somewhere out of sight. I've also met crazy falon gong people when I was in China but that doesn't mean all of them are crazy. It's pretty much the same thing as happened when Turkey had its coupe, it got blamed on a guy who had fled Turkey and his cult-like following.

Are you sure you were drinking with Mongolians? When I dated a girl from Mongolia, she insisted on giving me drinking lessons to make sure that I was up to meeting people. When I ended up drinking with Mongolians, I understood her point. As a student said "for a meal, the men should have a bottle of spirits, and after they drink that they drink a box (case) of beer -- the large ones, not small ones like this (indicating 500ml as small)." She horrified the whole restaurant by having me drink baijiu out of the bottle because "that's the way we do it at home" and it made her feel more comfortable. She was my (quasi-adoptive) daughter's old room mate, so I'm comfortable she wasn't playing games with the foreigner. Many women in China, my fiancee for example, drink little or nothing. Women from the Northeast, Inner Mongolia, and Korea are known as hazardous exceptions to that.

Yes and they weren't anything special about their drinking habits, people in eastern Europe and Russia can handle their liquor better generally. And the Mongolians drinking habits is nothing they should be proud of seeing the rampant problems they have with alcoholism.

So far, you seem to be pulling comments out of your ass, and not doing much to try to back them up.

You're the one who's only arguments are based on personal anecdotes. You're living in a oppressive regime renown for it's brutal censorship, propaganda and violation of basic human rights.

[Coombs]

This sounds an awful lot like being judged for the content of one's character. While not the suavest system, the idea is one I can get behind.

[Hilhen7]

Kind of funny how other countries act like they care so much about censorship / injustice / abuse of the Chinese people.

Did they forget about the opium wars?

[Rooflesstoofless]

Appropriate:

[Freighter]

You're the one who's only arguments are based on personal anecdotes. You're living in a oppressive regime renown for it's brutal censorship, propaganda and violation of basic human rights.

It's funny how people on this forum claim people to be oppressed because of how their idea of the location the other person resides in. I've had people on this forum claim my opinions are not my own because I live in Singapore and claim that I'm being oppressed even though I've never had any problems with the authorities.

[shadowmouse]

We're not talking about gossip here we're talking about genocide and censorship on a scale that makes 1984 look like a fairy tale.

You're throwing around numbers and trying to sound like you have facts. Back 'em up.

You have mysteriously been places and done things, but again you aren't providing any information about when, where, how long. Hell, you could have done a two week, flying tour in 2008 and be talking as if your the old China hand. Lightspark, Dwarfhamster, Katie N, Freighter, Garnier Fructis, and a couple of others I know they can back up what they say -- even if we don't always agree.

You're the one who's only arguments are based on personal anecdotes.

Which puts me ahead of you. Most of your stuff (drinking tales aside) is just something invoked out of thin air without any support at all -- not even personal anecdote. I can at least comment on what I see, you just recite lines.

[Heladys]

I feel like an episode of Black Mirror is coming on...

I know! That was my first thought as well, this is straight out of Black Mirror.

[Seronalis]

From December 2015, look familiar?


Dunno if this is literally the same system of if Sesame Credit was just an early beta test, either way this isn't new it just took a while to really kick in. This is why its important to keep your eyes open, things like this don't magically appear over night

[Deleted]

It's funny how people on this forum claim people to be oppressed because of how their idea of the location the other person resides in. I've had people on this forum claim my opinions are not my own because I live in Singapore and claim that I'm being oppressed even though I've never had any problems with the authorities.

Well, some people living in oppressed countries don't really know much about their own government and what its up to since they have been fed propaganda since they were born and they only have access to state funded news since much on the internet is either censored or in a language they don't understand.

My girlfriend is from northern Vietnam and I met a lot of people over there who thinks Ho Chi Minh was a saint and he did everything right. Of course some younger people dont believe he was a good person but almost all the older people who have been spoon fed propaganda for decades almost worship the guy. It felt weird that I knew more about what has happened in Vietnam since the War than she does growing up there for 22years but after having visited I understood why she didn't.

Sometimes it's easier to see what's going on in a country from the inside but when the state is censoring and using propaganda its hard to get a good grasp of the situation.

[zEmini]

So china wants to become a full blown shit hole dictatorship now? I knew this was creeping up, but I hope teh Chinese tell their government to fuck off.

[Hilhen7]

Well, some people living in oppressed countries don't really know much about their own government and what its up to since they have been fed propaganda since they were born and they only have access to state funded news since much on the internet is either censored or in a language they don't understand.

I instantly thought of trump for some reason...

[Freighter]

Well, some people living in oppressed countries don't really know much about their own government and what its up to since they have been fed propaganda since they were born

Sometimes it's easier to see what's going on in a country from the inside but when the state is censoring and using propaganda its hard to get a good grasp of the situation.

See, this is where it gets complicated for those people who say my opinions aren't my own due to propaganda. I'm not a native. I was born in South Korea, I studied in Australia and now I work in Singapore. Bungee isn't a native in China either, he moved there, from USA I think it was. Life isn't anywhere close to as bad as you have been led to believe in these countries for the average person.

[Hilhen7]

Awesome, thank you.

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Freighter, still doesn’t understand what influence is.

But how do you know that your country is also not using propaganda to brainwash you? Since you would be looking from the inside...

Maybe your country is spreading propaganda against the big scary China. Or scary communist bogy men.

[Freighter]

Freighter, still doesn’t understand what influence is.

You still don't understand that my opinions are my own and not a product of propaganda. It's both hilarious and sad at the same time.