As Horde, i have no motivation to hate the alliance

[Golden Yak]

Of course you need a reason. My dislike for the Alliance is just that I'm not sufficiently invested to play one. My dislike for the Horde is that I used to be, but now I'm disgusted with them.

"They stand for everything we don't stand for!!

Plus, they told me you guys look like dorks."

[Alex86el]

you dont need to have a reason to hate them.
not by human ethics at least.

are you an orc? think the orc way.
the law of the strongest. orc want? orc take if can. is fair.

are you a forsaken? well, for the most part, they cant "feel" much.
and their queen demands complete obedience.
you can either play it like "i wanna achieve something at all cost, with no remorse"
or you can play it like "i must do what my queen says, for my own good".

troll? i must do what my queen says, or i'll be thrown out.
or you're a headhunter who hunts as a sport for trophies and scalps,
and wants to canibalise as many as possible to become stronger.

or you can always see it like "i must do as Sylvanas commands, for my own good".
that's the easy way out.

sure, the alliance may have too many reasons to "hate" the horde.
but that's because they need reasons because of their culture and mindset.

- - - Updated - - -

I hate both factions and have motivation to hate Christie Golden and Ion Hazzikostas needs to be an option.

i dislike many of her choices. especially her pushing anduin so much. i miss varian
but to be fair, Golden is very talented in the way she writes, very colorful and emotional.
she's just not that great when it comes to the bigger picture or... any kind of long storyline.
or maybe she is held back by her higher-ups as to the direction she must go. no one will ever know.

[sillag]

idk man. i had no motivation that i could see and now the motivation blizzard gives me in the book for my tauren druid to go to war is that sylvanas threw a fit when she realized some of the forsaken were making friends with the humans and decided to have them all killed and then lie to the horde and say it was the alliance's fault. if this is the best blizzard has got for me then ion can shove this expansion up his bald ass

well im not gonna sub for an expansion this bad. if it gets good later maybe i will come back and race change to kul-tiras human or something but im not holding my breath. blizzard killed the horde in bfa among a lot of other things that used to be cool about this game.

[KrakHed]

"They stand for everything we don't stand for!!

Plus, they told me you guys look like dorks."

But it's the Horde that stands for everything the Horde doesn't stand for. I don't have enough doublethink to manage this shit.

[DOMONKUN]

FOR the (BLOOD ELF)Horde

[Psychotrip]

right now the only instance of killing your own troops takes place in the future and was done as the area was being overrun by enemy forces. The way this statement is worded suggests that the horde was explicitly killing their own to get raised when the event was killing everything in an area and raising whatever was there. A minor distinction that does change some things considering everyone fighting there was likely to die if they couldn't escape.

>.> they have. They spread their curse to other humans in an effort to prevent being raised again as forsaken during the events of the Forsaken advancement through Gilneas and other regions around tirisfal.

Wait...why not wait until they’re dead? Why does Sylvanas have to kill them herself just to raise them to undeath? What’s the harm in giving them a chance to fight? What’s the point in killing her own troops, even if they’re “going to die anyway”? She can raise them even if she doesn’t kill. Am I missing something?

[Qualia]

Wait...why not wait until they’re dead? Why does Sylvanas have to kill them herself just to raise them to undeath? What’s the harm in giving them a chance to fight? What’s the point in killing her own troops, even if they’re “going to die anyway”? She can raise them even if she doesn’t kill. Am I missing something?

Because she was plague-bombing the battlefield. Their troops, even though was faltering, was holding the Alliance together as they clashed head-on when she decided to do it. Some troops realized what was happening and retreated, many others didn't (either didn't know about it, or wasn't in right condition to retreat to safety in time). However, waiting for the Alliance to kill her troops first might means that Alliance soldiers would be able to advance and might not be as stacked together as they were anymore (= the plague might not kill as efficient). Her actions might be cold-hearted, but they certainly had some logic behind it. Essentially, her goal wasn't to kill her own troops per se, but to ignore their deaths to cause as much damage to the Alliance as possible.

[Psychotrip]

Because she was plague-bombing the battlefield. Their troops, even though was faltering, was holding the Alliance together as they clashed head-on when she decided to do it. Some troops realized what was happening and retreated, many others didn't (either didn't know about it, or wasn't in right condition to retreat to safety in time). However, waiting for the Alliance to kill her troops first might means that Alliance soldiers would be able to advance and might not be as stacked together as they were anymore (= the plague might not kill as efficient). Her actions might be cold-hearted, but they certainly had some logic behind it. Essentially, her goal wasn't to kill her own troops per se, but to ignore their deaths to cause as much damage to the Alliance as possible.

But they’d be clustered near the gates to the city, creating a 300 style funnel scenario. That would probably make the plague even easier to use.

[Blizzard Moneybot]

I think the best way to get horde players riled up and actually provide some proof of the story's BS that the alliance is out to get them is a massacre of horde civilians and the burning of horde capitals. Let the horde be the underdog again, but having no cities, and no homes and being actively hunted.
Then the alliance can be 'morally grey' like the horde. This would ofc, require a removal of the soy king

sure, the alliance may have too many reasons to "hate" the horde.
but that's because they need reasons because of their culture and mindset.

You don't need to go into mental exercises to justify 'defending yourself from invasion, aggression, and an enemy who seeks your extermination under the auspices of *their survival*' What needs explanation is why Alliance races bend a fucking knee to HUMAN POTENTIAL when HUMAN POTENTIAL failed to secure justice, compensation or anything of the sort for them in response to the crimes visited upon them by the Horde. The fact Tyrande let Saurfang live instead of putting an arrow through his head on principle shows how pathetic they are. I'm sure they will find the Light soon. Plenty of them in the Cathedral of Light now.
When you have a weak, omega sack of shit like Anduin the Soy King in charge who still wants to make peace cause he hasn't lost shit to the enemy he's trying to hug, you get boring Alliance, and will never have 'motivation to hate them' as a Horde player if you're trying to rationalise it.

[Mehrunes]

But they’d be clustered near the gates to the city, creating a 300 style funnel scenario. That would probably make the plague even easier to use.

That's precisely why she did it before. Because Alliance knew of the Blight and not even Alliance under Blanduin they sucks so much at war to think Sylvanas wouldn't deploy the Blight as the Alliance funneled into a chokepoint they couldn't even pass through because of the gate, when there was no harm to Horde soldiers. If the Alliance won that skirmish and defeated all Horde forces present, they'd retreat to protect the siege weapons not destroyed by the Azerite war machine (since IIRC it focused only on the siege towers) and wait for a significant breach before rushing.

[mickybrighteyes]

Wait...why not wait until they’re dead? Why does Sylvanas have to kill them herself just to raise them to undeath? What’s the harm in giving them a chance to fight? What’s the point in killing her own troops, even if they’re “going to die anyway”? She can raise them even if she doesn’t kill. Am I missing something?

probably to avoid giving the Alliance the heads up that something was about to happen. You're focusing on the raising of troops as the big move, but that seems more like a bonus act on top of surprising them with the blight barrage and catching them when they were committed to rushing the gates.

[Goremonger]

Night elves can not be forgiven for their genocide of the Shatterspear Tribe.

[Deleted]

My point was it is illogical to hate enemy soldiers because they are just doing their jobs

So should the Gilneans just lay down and let the Horde do their job?

and my example with your logic that genn should hate sylvanas not garrosh even though garrosh ordered the invasion then with your logic jew shouldn't hate Hitler for holocaust but the soldiers who acted on hitlers orders.

It makes sense to hate both. But Garrosh isn't even alive anymore.

[Terongor]

So should the Gilneans just lay down and let the Horde do their job?



It makes sense to hate both. But Garrosh isn't even alive anymore.

No they they should fight but shoudn't hate people who following the orders of their superiors. when knowing that if Sylvanas would have disobeyed she would have faced Horde and the alliance at the same time, they just did what they had to, to survive. So you are saying those jew doctor(who helped because their families were sparred if they helped) who helped nazis in their experiment should be judged as the nazi doctors where.

[Nathasil]

You are all ignoring a very important factor: Alliance players by and large do NOT WANT the Alliance to become more like the Horde. That is why they chose to play Alliance.

The way the factions were set up in warcraft has always been:
Horde - be aggressive for no reason at all; burn, steal and plunder even if you do not need the resources gained from it. If there are no Non-Horde to fight...just fight against yourself. The Horde is in essence a bully, who cannot coexist with anybody or anything. Of course there are exceptions - like Thrall or the Tauren...and that#s exactly why they are looked down upon by the Horde by and large.
Alliance - Take care of your own matters and only fight to defend yourself.

If you believe it or not, but a lot of players actually do not like the way the Horde is and would simply quit the game if the Alliance became a growling mob like them.

If Blizzard pushes the Allaince to become more like the Horde, many players will simply leave the game for good. Why is that so hard to understand? You can easily see this by comparing how many players of both factions engage in PvP or roll on PvP servers (whose only mechanical difference is to allow you to bully other players)...or just look at this poll right here. Blizzard has done EVERYTHING in their power to make the Alliance angry...and we just don't like it.

Seeing Teldrassil burn does not make me want to kill Horde players. Why would it? It would not bring the Tree back. It just makes me sad and consider dropping the game because why play if there is nothing in this world i can enjoy?

This is also the reason why faction-based PvP will ALWAYS fail. Horde will always be more active in PvP leading to all kinds of imbalance and wait time issues.

Edit:
And just to clarify...i am not trying to talk down on the Horde or put the Alliance way on a pedastal. They are just different. Being aggressive for no reason in a video game is FINE. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it. But so is finding this attitude to be immature and going for the "other" option, which is the Alliance. The factions are not the same and the mindset of the players is to a large extend not the same. Which is actually good for the game, but it also means that there never will be a real "morally grey" conflict that both factions can identify with. In the end, there is the fundamental difference that the only reason for the Horde to exist is to destroy the Alliance. While the Alliance can and wants to exist just fine with or without a Horde - we simply don't care about it. This obsession with the "faction conflict" is pretty much Horde-exclusive...and it is part of why i consider the Horde just too immature to enjoy playing its quests.

[Mehrunes]

The way the factions were set up in warcraft has always been:
Horde - be aggressive for no reason at all; burn, steal and plunder even if you do not need the resources gained from it. If there are no Non-Horde to fight...just fight against yourself. The Horde is in essence a bully, who cannot coexist with anybody or anything. Of course there are exceptions - like Thrall or the Tauren...and that#s exactly why they are looked down upon by the Horde by and large.
Alliance - Take care of your own matters and only fight to defend yourself.

Edit:
And just to clarify...i am not trying to talk down on the Horde or put the Alliance way on a pedastal. They are just different. Being aggressive for no reason in a video game is FINE. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it.

If it's so FINE, then why are you once spreading falsehoods about Alliance in this regard? Alliance started Alterac Valley. Alliance started hostilities in Mulgore and the Barrens. All three happened because Dwarves wanted to dig shit up and didn't care the Horde was the owner of that territory. Alliance attacked the Horde in Stormheim because Genn and Rogers have a hate boner for the Horde. They even had to break Anduin's orders to do that. The Alliance attacked the Horde in Silithus because they wanted Azerite samples, about which they didn't know much, while the Horde appeared to know more. And, most importantly, the Alliance started the previous faction war that lasted since WotLK till the end of MoP. Look at all dat "only defending itself". Look at all dat ability to coexist with anybody or anything.

You can easily see this by comparing how many players of both factions engage in PvP or roll on PvP servers (whose only mechanical difference is to allow you to bully other players)

Umm, you do realize PvP was utterly dominated by humans for more than half of WoW's duration, right?

...or just look at this poll right here. Blizzard has done EVERYTHING in their power to make the Alliance angry...and we just don't like it.

Except more than half of Alliance posters that voted, voted that they want to destroy the Horde. Meanwhile for the Horde it's the other way around. Top notch looking at the poll. Alternatively, top notch twisting it to suit your narrative.

In the end, there is the fundamental difference that the only reason for the Horde to exist is to destroy the Alliance. While the Alliance can and wants to exist just fine with or without a Horde - we simply don't care about it.

Except the Alliance was a reaction to the Horde. When Horde was defeated the Alliance crumbled. When Horde reformed, the Alliance saw a resurgence.

[Leodric]

You are all ignoring a very important factor: Alliance players by and large do NOT WANT the Alliance to become more like the Horde. That is why they chose to play Alliance.

The way the factions were set up in warcraft has always been:
Horde - be aggressive for no reason at all; burn, steal and plunder even if you do not need the resources gained from it. If there are no Non-Horde to fight...just fight against yourself. The Horde is in essence a bully, who cannot coexist with anybody or anything. Of course there are exceptions - like Thrall or the Tauren...and that#s exactly why they are looked down upon by the Horde by and large.
Alliance - Take care of your own matters and only fight to defend yourself.

If you believe it or not, but a lot of players actually do not like the way the Horde is and would simply quit the game if the Alliance became a growling mob like them.

If Blizzard pushes the Allaince to become more like the Horde, many players will simply leave the game for good. Why is that so hard to understand? You can easily see this by comparing how many players of both factions engage in PvP or roll on PvP servers (whose only mechanical difference is to allow you to bully other players)...or just look at this poll right here. Blizzard has done EVERYTHING in their power to make the Alliance angry...and we just don't like it.

Seeing Teldrassil burn does not make me want to kill Horde players. Why would it? It would not bring the Tree back. It just makes me sad and consider dropping the game because why play if there is nothing in this world i can enjoy?

This is also the reason why faction-based PvP will ALWAYS fail. Horde will always be more active in PvP leading to all kinds of imbalance and wait time issues.

Edit:
And just to clarify...i am not trying to talk down on the Horde or put the Alliance way on a pedastal. They are just different. Being aggressive for no reason in a video game is FINE. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it. But so is finding this attitude to be immature and going for the "other" option, which is the Alliance. The factions are not the same and the mindset of the players is to a large extend not the same. Which is actually good for the game, but it also means that there never will be a real "morally grey" conflict that both factions can identify with. In the end, there is the fundamental difference that the only reason for the Horde to exist is to destroy the Alliance. While the Alliance can and wants to exist just fine with or without a Horde - we simply don't care about it. This obsession with the "faction conflict" is pretty much Horde-exclusive...and it is part of why i consider the Horde just too immature to enjoy playing its quests.

I think what people want is an Alliance with more inner conflict than it is presented at the moment. In the past the Alliance had many problems (dwarves couldn't stand eachother, partly still mistrust. Defias causing troubles, Fandral and Tyrande and so on), but nowadays it seems a bit too easy.

I agree though with the essence of your post. When I see people (mostly horde biased posters) complaining about the current lore or complaining about golden, then it seems to me that they haven't paid a lot of attention regarding what the Horde has been doing since forever. If you want a barbaric, war-centered faction starting wars play the Horde, if you like order then play the Alliance.

[The Emperor]

Then change faction. As simple as that. We won't miss a traitorous pacifist who has no intention to fight and considers Alliance 'good guy'.
I personally like the direction our Undead Queen Sylvanas is taking the Horde, and anyone who can't live with it should defect and stop this whining.
I never liked Thrall and his balanced shamanistic ways, but did I complain? No. And now you're all gonna serve my banshee Queen, and if not, you will be killed and serve regardless.
Death to the living, all hail Queen Sylvanas!

[Deleted]

I think its also a kick in the teeth to the alliance since they just take so much shit before fighting back like little cowards. Horde just stomps them and stomps them over and over and nothing is ever done, horde burns their house to the ground and they just hand them the keys to their neighbors.

If they want to balance things out, the alliance needs to go on the offensive, and BIG TIME! if it were the case that the alliance invaded lordaeron first, the whole story would make a lot more sense. the alliance has a backlog of grievances to get through and its damn well about time for them to fight back, instead sylvanas twirls her mustache and burns a city to ashes, because the alliance need MORE reasons.

If the factions are grey, then blizzard needs to add some pure black into the alliance color pallete and the horde needs a bucked of white. Factions are not grey vs grey, its black vs white masquerading as grey vs grey, all i ask is blizzard either be honest or ammend, either commit to good vs evil or rectify the gigantic disparity

[

That is the problem, the alliance Needs to be the one who fights back and ACtually starts winning ANY battle, so far Despite lroewise alliance have 5-1 the numbers of horde races, atleast Equel(if not more mages) More tech(gnomes and dreanie vs goblin) They somehow always get their teeth kick in.
BFA would ahve been a place the alliance could start he war, which would give the horde a reason to Not be the bad guy for ones., But the alliance wont do that as, they are clearly the More inteligent and "good" guys of the story.

The hordes have NO reason to start the war, Sylvanas does, but orcs,turaen, trolls, blood elves, pandaren have NO reason for it.

[Gavll]

Fuck Anduin and his peace BS. I want warmonger Jaina in charge and to obliterate the Horde. Especially Orgrimmar. /spit