Abortion in Ireland: Yes wins

[Lawci]

Okay first thing first. The amount of people who get an abortion because of rape, contraception failure or medial reason threatening the life of the mother or the child are much much much much much lower than what you imagine. Well over 90% of abortion are because of straight up negligence and/or irresponsibility.

In my book, that small amount of people who find themselves in these unfortunate situation should get an abortion if they want it and they shouldn't even pay for it IMO (although I don't know how they would prove contraception failure with some types of contraceptions, no one is collecting used condoms). My issue is with the overwhelming majority who just don't give a shit about anything and just want an easy fix after fucking up (pun intended) instead of preventing the problem from happening in the first place.

All of this makes for a terrible way of thinking, this whole "sure go ahead, do everything wrong we'll fix it later" kind of attitude is really damaging in the long term for our society. This is more than just giving women 1 more choice after the many choices they already had before the fact.

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Nope, think further, have your phone nearby, ready to dial 911 once your nose starts bleeding. Maybe you'll get there.

The statistics here would disagree with you. Owing to the fact that they had to make an expensive trip abroad, abortions sought by Irish women have consistently been thought through at length. All of this has already been covered and debunked throughout this campaign.

Also, not very fun fact, the 8th Amendment has literally caused the deaths of actual, living, breathing human beings, not to mention it's stopped them from accessing other health services like chemotherapy, because those treatments may harm the foetus.

If you're gonna try and condescend, at least know what you're talking about.

Signed,
Someone who actually followed and helped in the campaign.

[Moralgy]

About time, gratz Ireland, you moved past the past a little bit more!

[dumathoinn]

"Pro-lifers" are boiling.

I like the fact that the first thing said is something negative to an opposing opinion on the subject. Very mature.

[Deleted]

And as usual people don't get it. You know the fact that how European countries have birth rates below replacement levels? No one is saying that there won't be babies. But considering how many abortions there were when it WASN'T legal as to opposed to how many there might be now that it is...yeah.

But feel free to take it any way you want, I don't have a view on abortion itself, but it seems to me that there are WAY more abortions that are those of convenience as opposed to necessity. But then again, less Europeans means more immigrants right? They don't have a birth rate problem.

Well, it isn't like you get an abortion and then never get kids. There are a lot of factors that go into the whole aspect of how many kids you tend to get, but abortion in Europe is not a particularly major one.

[dumathoinn]

And plenty of those who have been or will be aborted would still vote 'yes'.

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A foetus isn't a human being. Your argument ends there.

Please tell me where it says that a "fetus" isn't a human being this is a matter of perspective only.

[Swalload]

And plenty of those who have been or will be aborted would still vote 'yes'.

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A foetus isn't a human being. Your argument ends there.

1. I never said it was, although, fetuses carry on the genetic data required to become what they are supposed to become, a fetus in itself is not a thing or a species, it's only a state in the development of the body. The fetus in a woman's body is inevitably a human fetus, not a dog fetus or a generic fetus(that doesn't even exist). So by definition, we are indeed talking about something that is factually human. There I said it, and you're wrong.
2. Who the fuck do you think you are to suggest that it's fine to kill a foetus just because you wrongly believe "it's not human"? Go kill a dog, it's not human, go on, idiot.
3. What seems like an argument in your distorted perspective is in reality a lesson, from me to you. Did you constantly disagree with everything your teacher taught you in school? I hope not. Same thing here, just learn.

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Please tell me where it says that a "fetus" isn't a human being this is a matter of perspective only.

It's not a matter of perspective at all. There's a fact, and there's this guy being wrong and uneducated.

[Swalload]

The statistics here would disagree with you. Owing to the fact that they had to make an expensive trip abroad, abortions sought by Irish women have consistently been thought through at length. All of this has already been covered and debunked throughout this campaign.

Also, not very fun fact, the 8th Amendment has literally caused the deaths of actual, living, breathing human beings, not to mention it's stopped them from accessing other health services like chemotherapy, because those treatments may harm the foetus.

If you're gonna try and condescend, at least know what you're talking about.

Signed,
Someone who actually followed and helped in the campaign.

I agree my point went straight outside of the specifics of this case, which is different than the usual pro-life vs pro-abortion issue because I'm more familiar with this subject and not so much with the problems specific to Ireland. My apologies.

[Lawci]

The constitution never disallowed abortion in the first place.

Eh? The whole point of the referendum was to remove an article in the constitution of the Irish state that elevated the life of a foetus above the rights of the woman, which in turn disallowed abortion.

[Deleted]

2. Who the fuck do you think you are to suggest that it's fine to kill a foetus just because you wrongly believe "it's not human"? Go kill a dog, it's not human, go on, idiot.

It is fully legal to get your dog killed at any time, for any reason. Mainly because it is not human.

[Lawci]

I agree my point went straight outside of the specifics of this case, which is different than the usual pro-life vs pro-abortion issue because I'm more familiar with this subject and not so much with the problems specific to Ireland. My apologies.

Accepted.
/10char

[Swalload]

Unless someone is having sex for the explicit purpose of getting pregnant, framing it as "making the decision to create life" is, at best, disingenuous.

That's true, let me rephrase that to "having irresponsible sex while knowing all the consequences but doing absolutely nothing about it".

[Swalload]

It is fully legal to get your dog killed at any time, for any reason. Mainly because it is not human.

And most would argue that it's a terrible thing to do, regardless of it being legal or not.

Also how is killing something that's not human legally justifying killing something that is human?

[Najnaj]

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With the open border, a short drive south and done.

..and pay for it I assume. I am no expert on this topic but I would guess that this will not be cheap.

[Deleted]

And most would argue that it's a terrible thing to do, regardless of it being legal or not.

Also how is killing something that's not human legally justifying killing something that is human?

Well, we tend to not legally classify them as such, so it is a work around.

[Mlz]

Please tell me where it says that a "fetus" isn't a human being this is a matter of perspective only.

The only way to perceive a foetus as a human being is to artificially create that notion. You are free to consider a foetus a human being as soon as it is conceived and never abort it but you should never get to have a say regarding other people and their pregnancies.

1. I never said it was, although, fetuses carry on the genetic data required to become what they are supposed to become, a fetus in itself is not a thing or a species, it's only a state in the development of the body. The fetus in a woman's body is inevitably a human fetus, not a dog fetus or a generic fetus(that doesn't even exist). So by definition, we are indeed talking about something that is factually human. There I said it, and you're wrong.
2. Who the fuck do you think you are to suggest that it's fine to kill a foetus just because you wrongly believe "it's not human"? Go kill a dog, it's not human, go on, idiot.
3. What seems like an argument in your distorted perspective is in reality a lesson, from me to you. Did you constantly disagree with everything your teacher taught you in school? I hope not. Same thing here, just learn.

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It's not a matter of perspective at all. There's a fact, and there's this guy being wrong and uneducated.

1. We do not consider stem cells to be humans, for a reason. Unless you're crazy enough to claim that too, of course.
2. An alive woman is more important than a clump of cells, simple as. If killing a dog that can't feel pain, has no consciousness, who wouldn't be able to survive without a host organism, does not resemble a dog and not even a puppy in the slightest would be a life changing option for someone else then most people would probably pull the plug, rightfully. And looking back at my description of the said 'dog', does such an organism really even is a dog to begin with?
3. I was taught to make up my own mind based on evidence and logic. Might be a shocker to someone like you.

[Swalload]

A plant is "life". Do you think it has a right to life?

Most of you on this board don't have the mental capacity to actually have this debate and you just shout one liners that you think are clever.

Pretty wild comparison there. I suppose you're the prophet we've all been waiting for, please teach us, show us the truth.
You offer absolutely nothing of value to the conversation and belittle people for no reason. Have a seat.

[Najnaj]

And most would argue that it's a terrible thing to do, regardless of it being legal or not.

Also how is killing something that's not human legally justifying killing something that is human?

A toenail is human and it has the same emotional life and a 5 week old fetus.

For the record, I am not for totally free abortion after a certain amount of time. Once it has some sort of an emotional response it is human. I just do not like when we use bronze age mythology to tell people what they can and can not do. After around 10-12 weeks elective abortions should be banned imo. Once it can think it has rights.

[ManiaCCC]

Pretty wild comparison there. I suppose you're the prophet we've all been waiting for, please teach us, show us the truth.
You offer absolutely nothing of value to the conversation and belittle people for no reason. Have a seat.

Well, you offered very little too but I'll bite. You claimed thinking fetus is not human being is wrong. Do you have anything to support this? Or this is just your belief?

[kail]

Better late than never. The right to control what happens and resides in your body is a rather basic right. If the right to life supersedes bodily autonomy, it opens up too many precedents.

[Evangeliste]

Those are the 1%. The others are just irresponsible whores, literally.

I'm sure "your mother should have..." ethic is on people's mind after reading your remark. Or alternatively and sadly, you've overlooked the fact that your own mother is potentially a "whore" too by your own sweeping generalisation.