Unarmed Man beaten by Arizona officers wants police held accountable

[Noxx79]

You are still assuming.

This forum likes to label people by assumption.

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Don't own a gun. I guess that statement doesnt work with me.

So that’s what you have issue with? You just admitted that you have no problem with cops violating 4th 7th and 8th amendments.

You can also be a rabid supporter of the 2nd amendment without owning a gun. Just like you can question the 2nd amendment whole owning a gun.

Your quip about not owning a gun means nothing.

[SpellCleave]

Two points for starters:

Dude should've followed all orders from the start, gotten off his phone and respected what the cops wanted him to do.

The cops should not have used that much force to get him to comply. Far to much assault from the officers.

I'd stand on the side of the man being arrested here. Shame on the officers for being so excessive. I feel that with all the supposed training these officers may have had (or were supposed to have had) they'd know how to subdue a non-compliant individual with less force than was used here.

The man didn't help his case by threatening (albeit a pretty empty threat what with him cuffed and on the ground) them and yelling at them afterwards. But i can't put much fault on him for that since the officers acted fairly out of line.

We need less shitty cops.

[Bakis]

3rd world cops whats new, really.
This is what poorly trained and unaccountable officers bring to the table.

[Deleted]

You didn't answer the question.

What do you do in that scenario, as laid out above? If you reach for your ID, the cop assumes you are reaching for the gun and shoots you. If you do not reach for your ID, the cop assumes you are being noncompliant while armed, and shoots you. If you get out of the car and have not been specifically directed to do so, you could be (rightly) perceived as a credible threat, and the cop shoots you. If you refuse to get out of the car after being directed to do so, you are noncompliant while armed, and the cop may shoot you. If you willingly get out of the car when asked, surrender your weapon during the interaction, or provide any information other than what is immediately necessary and directly asked, you are willingly giving up your own rights.

What do you do? Forfeit your rights? If so, why do we even have rights in the first place?

When did I say anything was tantamount to becoming a slave?

Please read and actually understand what I am saying before you respond.

You do this thing called communication, ask what he wants you to do, and then do it.

I know.

Hard.

No misunderstanding and you don't get decorated with lead...

[Antiganon]

You do this thing called communication, ask what he wants you to do, and then do it.

I know.

Hard.

No misunderstanding and you don't get decorated with lead...

So when the officer, who knows you are legally carrying a concealed weapon, asks you to present ID, what do you do?

Do you reach into your pocket for your ID, giving the appearance you are going for your gun?

Or do you refuse, knowing that the officer will assume you are going for your gun, and react accordingly?

The other option is that you willingly hand your weapon to the officer, willingly allow him to search your vehicle, and willingly answer any and all questions asked. Otherwise known as surrendering your rights.

[Araya]

Normally I would say yes police should be held accountable. But that happened in America where the police are apparently free to beat, shoot, and generally harm citizens with 0 repercussions, so I doubt anything will happen.

[jakeic]

To anyone who sees nothing wrong here, name a single profession in which you can beat an unarmed and unwilling person and not be fired or held responsible?

Every officer there should be fired, how any of them are ok with what happened just goes to show how rotten and tainted the police are. There are six officers detaining a guy and they beat him, a guy that wasn't even being arrested. This is first rate negligence and incompetence.

[Mistame]

And yes, that's all it takes for someone to deserve a "beat down." Disrespecting an officer and not following his/her instructions.

"Disrespecting" an officer is not illegal and is not an actionable offense by officers. And more importantly, officers never have the right or the authority to punch a citizen. Ever.

[Allybeboba]

Like I always say in these instances...

If they had only complied...
And...
Somehow, I don’t think the MSM is telling the entire story.

Cheers

[Netherius]

If you're going to insult someone make sure you're quoting the right words first.

And yes, that's all it takes for someone to deserve a "beat down." Disrespecting an officer and not following his/her instructions.

No where in any state law does it state extreme physical violence is a proper response to non compliance. No where.

[The Oblivion]

he very clearly deserved what he got

[Tackhisis]

I don't believe officers would hold him down and even bind his legs without a good reason. A bodycam footage is needed before judging on the incident.

[Antiganon]

I don't believe officers would hold him down and even bind his legs without a good reason. A bodycam footage is needed before judging on the incident.

Security camera mounted in the ceiling isn't good enough?

More to the point, assuming the only difference is that bodycams have audio, what could this man have said that justifies the officer's actions, in your mind?

[The Oblivion]

Security camera mounted in the ceiling isn't good enough?

More to the point, assuming the only difference is that bodycams have audio, what could this man have said that justifies the officer's actions, in your mind?

the camera that showed him refusing commands and resisting arrest, yeah its good enough. open and shut case. cops were in the right and scum got what he deserved.

[Deleted]

People have to realize that police officers are the physical enforcement of the government, they are tyrannical by nature (and absolutely necessary), this thin veil of civility that we've created in the west, wherein police officers "may not" use unecessary force is just an experiment, because for 99% of human history, violence has always been the first reaction to a dissenting individual.

I'm not saying I want to go back to a system where the police will brutalize you for absolutely nothing en masse, but you're fooling yourself if you think that the relative peace we've had from the police is here to last, they have monopoly on violence and will ensure that they keep it.

If you want to keep your body out of harms way, you should immediately submit to these people, they are very important cogs in a machine that has historically shown to be incredibly violent.

[Antiganon]

the camera that showed him refusing commands and resisting arrest, yeah its good enough. open and shut case. cops were in the right and scum got what he deserved.

So the cops were justified in repeatedly punching his face while holding his back against a wall? They were justified in shoving his face into an elevator door so hard that it stopped moving?

Note I never said they weren't justified in using force to put him in a sitting position. Hold him still, hook his knees, drop him on his ass.

No part of that requires punching.

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People have to realize that police officers are the physical enforcement of the government, they are tyrannical by nature (and absolutely necessary), this thin veil of civility that we've created in the west, wherein police officers "may not" use unecessary force is just an experiment, because for 99% of human history, violence has always been the first reaction to a dissenting individual.

I'm not saying I want to go back to a system where the police will brutalize you for absolutely nothing en masse, but you're fooling yourself if you think that the relative peace we've had from the police is here to last, they have monopoly on violence and will ensure that they keep it.

If you want to keep your body out of harms way, you should immediately submit to these people, they are very important cogs in a machine that has historically shown to be incredibly violent.

I can understand the pragmatist view here.

What I don't understand is people acting like the officers behavior is acceptable.

Sucking it up and dealing with it because you like being alive is one thing. Willingly supporting gross abuses of power is something else entirely.

[callipygoustp]

System of law in the USA needs to take a note from Blizzard's WoW development playbook: when something has been relegated to uselessness, get rid of it. What's been relegated to uselessness? The court system. Get rid of courts and allow officers to meet out punishment how ever they see fit. Quit dicking around America, do it!

Bonus if the death penalty is then allowed nationwide.

[Deleted]

I can understand the pragmatist view here.

What I don't understand is people acting like the officers behavior is acceptable.

Sucking it up and dealing with it because you like being alive is one thing. Willingly supporting gross abuses of power is something else entirely.

It's absolutely not acceptable, but this is how reality works. Democracy, civility is just a huge experiment, most likely temporary and all progress can be undone with just a few years, we have plenty of proof of that even in the modern era. Enjoy it while it lasts though.

[Antiganon]

It's absolutely not acceptable, but this is how reality works. Democracy, civility is just a huge experiment, most likely temporary and all progress can be undone with just a few years, we have plenty of proof of that even in the modern era. Enjoy it while it lasts though.

Right, but here we are, on an anonymous internet forum, where people are free to speak of the excesses of those in power with zero fear of retribution, and they support the tyrants openly, using statements like "Scumbag got what he deserved" and "Watched it again with audio, the cops are 100% in the right here."

Its deeply unsettling that my country has come to this.

[Deleted]

Right, but here we are, on an anonymous internet forum, where people are free to speak of the excesses of those in power with zero fear of retribution, and they support the tyrants openly, using statements like "Scumbag got what he deserved" and "Watched it again with audio, the cops are 100% in the right here."

Its deeply unsettling that my country has come to this.

He might not have deserved it, but he put himself in a situation where they could do this to him. This is why I said that if you want your body intact, you should submit to these people, because they will find a reason to show you who the boss is, the system will get away with it.

There's no point in resisting when you are 1vs7, because they will excercise their right to be tyrants.

So, in my mind he's atleast partially responsible and he's the one who has to deal with the consequences.