The Brexit aftermath thread

[Pann]

Suffragettes?
Miner's strike?
Poll tax?
Stop The War?

etc.

You're saying there won't be civil unrest... ok, well let's see what happens when economic shit hits the fan and people start losing their jobs.

There won't be. I'm not saying there won't be a few protests that get out of hand but there will not be wide spread civil unrest.

[Acidbaron]

Let's imagine a hard brexit for shits and giggles, where does the UK even end up in? The other branches of the EU what focuses more on trade but still require rules to be uphold despite no say in from members don't want the UK, Norway literally said that.

So they are going to end up where exactly? At the Mercy of who, the current american administration? And some of you are cheering this one why exactly?

[Triks]

Let's imagine a hard brexit for shits and giggles, where does the UK even end up in? The other branches of the EU what focuses more on trade but still require rules to be uphold despite no say in from members don't want the UK, Norway literally said that.

So they are going to end up where exactly? At the Mercy of who, the current american administration? And some of you are cheering this one why exactly?

That has been the dilemma for Eurosceptics like Lamont and Osborne. They didn't like the EU but knew full well that the UK would be under its influence one way or another. Let me put it this way, Osbone believed (and still does) that the Euro is a badly-designed currency (it is) but during the Greek Eurozone crisis he was ready to save a currency he absolutely loathed because he understood what the collapse of the Eurozone would spell for the UK.

The myth that the UK could just ignore the absolute economic behemoth and be a plucky little country that buckaneers off the coast is just that - a myth.

[Pann]

A pretty scathing assessment of David Davis - http://politics.co.uk/blogs/2018/07/...nd-the-swagger

I particularly like; "He looked terrible on the podium doing joint press conferences next to Barnier. The Commission negotiator looked far better briefed, composed, well dressed and in control. He even told better jokes. It was like the dynamic between David Brent and his boss Neil in The Office."

[alexw]

That has been the dilemma for Eurosceptics like Lamont and Osborne. They didn't like the EU but knew full well that the UK would be under its influence one way or another. Let me put it this way, Osbone believed (and still does) that the Euro is a badly-designed currency (it is) but during the Greek Eurozone crisis he was ready to save a currency he absolutely loathed because he understood what the collapse of the Eurozone would spell for the UK.

The myth that the UK could just ignore the absolute economic behemoth and be a plucky little country that buckaneers off the coast is just that - a myth.

So they want to be pirates, is that it?

[Slant]

That has been the dilemma for Eurosceptics like Lamont and Osborne. They didn't like the EU but knew full well that the UK would be under its influence one way or another. Let me put it this way, Osbone believed (and still does) that the Euro is a badly-designed currency (it is) but during the Greek Eurozone crisis he was ready to save a currency he absolutely loathed because he understood what the collapse of the Eurozone would spell for the UK.

The myth that the UK could just ignore the absolute economic behemoth and be a plucky little country that buckaneers off the coast is just that - a myth.

You tell that to the people that believe in that myth just like they believe aliens built the pyramids. The problem isn't that the smart people in your country didn't make a conscious decision, whether it was yay or nay. The problem is that the vast majority of people have replaced religion with politics. Literally, they pick a side and from then on they believe that side. And much like a Liverpool fan will tell a hot girl to get lost when she announces on their first date that she's a Manchester supporter, they'll support their picked side, no matter the rationality.

Look at Trumpkins. Look at Brexiteers. There's no logic or rationale behind it. There's just the belief. A belief instilled by ruthless propagandists that paid close attention to what Goebbels said: "If you repeat a lie often and loudly enough, no matter how outrageous, the people will eventually give in and believe it."

[Pann]

So they want to be pirates, is that it?

Well they do like to call themselves Brexiteers! Yarrr.

[Triks]

A pretty scathing assessment of David Davis - http://politics.co.uk/blogs/2018/07/...nd-the-swagger

I particularly like; "He looked terrible on the podium doing joint press conferences next to Barnier. The Commission negotiator looked far better briefed, composed, well dressed and in control. He even told better jokes. It was like the dynamic between David Brent and his boss Neil in The Office."

Damn...

That's a roast.

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You tell that to the people that believe in that myth just like they believe aliens built the pyramids. The problem isn't that the smart people in your country didn't make a conscious decision, whether it was yay or nay. The problem is that the vast majority of people have replaced religion with politics. Literally, they pick a side and from then on they believe that side. And much like a Liverpool fan will tell a hot girl to get lost when she announces on their first date that she's a Manchester supporter, they'll support their picked side, no matter the rationality.

Look at Trumpkins. Look at Brexiteers. There's no logic or rationale behind it. There's just the belief. A belief instilled by ruthless propagandists that paid close attention to what Goebbels said: "If you repeat a lie often and loudly enough, no matter how outrageous, the people will eventually give in and believe it."

The problem isn't that - people will always belief stupid crap and politicians know this and use this. The problem was calling a referendum on such a sensitive issue and for such a complex question during the fallout of both the migrant crisis and the Eurozone crisis in order to "unite the party". After that the referendum became a vehicle for everything.

EDIT:

This is a bit anecdotal but if you ever find yourself in a situation where your people are divided NEVER ask for unity - they will interpret it as assimilation/defeat - but for a mandate. At least it works for my family....

[Slant]

A pretty scathing assessment of David Davis - http://politics.co.uk/blogs/2018/07/...nd-the-swagger

I particularly like; "He looked terrible on the podium doing joint press conferences next to Barnier. The Commission negotiator looked far better briefed, composed, well dressed and in control. He even told better jokes. It was like the dynamic between David Brent and his boss Neil in The Office."

My personal favourite is this:

"This is his great and final mistake, his one last piece of ignorant over-confidence. It is also the one which could still drive us over the cliff edge. The EU are not bluffing. A chaotic British exit is to be avoided, but it is not as bad as carving up the single market - the very engine of the European project. Davis has not understood this. Nor has he understood, even after all this time, that Britain's lack of customs and regulatory infrastructure puts it in a weaker position than the EU when it comes to no-deal. He is a man on a bicycle playing chicken with a lorry."

It's what we've told Brexiteers on this forum time and again. That the EU actually is very bureaucratic and will simply go through the motions, no bluffing, no faking, just business as usual. A trade agreement in reverse, so to speak. I still don't get how people don't take the EU seriously. If nothing else, Brexit is a giant stage for the EU to assert to not just itself, but to the whole planet that it is a serious player and don't fuck about. This isn't the EG anymore. This is a serious institution that has but one job: Act in the interest of all its members. No playing around.

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The problem isn't that - people will always belief stupid crap and politicians know this and use this. The problem was calling a referendum on such a sensitive issue and for such a complex question during the fallout of both the migrant crisis and the Eurozone crisis in order to "unite the party". After that the referendum became a vehicle for everything.

EDIT:

This is a bit anecdotal but if you ever find yourself in a situation where your people are divided NEVER ask for unity - they will interpret it as assimilation/defeat - but for a mandate. At least it works for my family....

What do you mean, mandate? I'm intrigued.

As for the first paragraph... that aspect, while true, is a bit too simplistic on its own for me. Of course those are the big problems if you look at the face of it. But my personal question is... Farage and Johnson, heck, even Davis... they aren't stupid. They can't believe the shit they're talking. This is just a sham. Why the hell do it? Do they hate their nation so much that they take the piss on it on the international stage? What has Great Britain done to them? Or are they really that clinically retarded? No, not insult.. I mean literally, retarded in the medical sense. IQ of sub 40 and so on.

[Slant]

They belong to a privileged political class in a country that let them get away with incompetence just for a few jokes. I don't know if they are stupid but they were granted enough privilege to not be able to tell they are not as smart as they think they are.

Well, there's that. But perhaps it's the Trump disease. You know, believing that the world will rearrange itself to fit your fantasy if only you're stubborn enough?

[Triks]

My personal favourite is this:

"This is his great and final mistake, his one last piece of ignorant over-confidence. It is also the one which could still drive us over the cliff edge. The EU are not bluffing. A chaotic British exit is to be avoided, but it is not as bad as carving up the single market - the very engine of the European project. Davis has not understood this. Nor has he understood, even after all this time, that Britain's lack of customs and regulatory infrastructure puts it in a weaker position than the EU when it comes to no-deal. He is a man on a bicycle playing chicken with a lorry."

It's what we've told Brexiteers on this forum time and again. That the EU actually is very bureaucratic and will simply go through the motions, no bluffing, no faking, just business as usual. A trade agreement in reverse, so to speak. I still don't get how people don't take the EU seriously. If nothing else, Brexit is a giant stage for the EU to assert to not just itself, but to the whole planet that it is a serious player and don't fuck about. This isn't the EG anymore. This is a serious institution that has but one job: Act in the interest of all its members. No playing around.

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What do you mean, mandate? I'm intrigued.

As for the first paragraph... that aspect, while true, is a bit too simplistic on its own for me. Of course those are the big problems if you look at the face of it. But my personal question is... Farage and Johnson, heck, even Davis... they aren't stupid. They can't believe the shit they're talking. This is just a sham. Why the hell do it? Do they hate their nation so much that they take the piss on it on the international stage? What has Great Britain done to them? Or are they really that clinically retarded? No, not insult.. I mean literally, retarded in the medical sense. IQ of sub 40 and so on.

Mandate for THEM to GIVE you AUTHORITY. In both cases you are trying to strengthen your position or to fulfill your plan. In the first case where you ask for unity, you essentially ask them to abandon their ideas and integrate within the mass. When you ask for them to give you authority, you are treating them as equals and suddenly they have a steak in what you are doing. It's a very slight difference and you have to pick your words correctly to deal with it.

They want money, fame and attention. Why work when you throw a couple of soundbites and people will pay you £40,000 for 90 min on stage? Farage is in Putin's pocket but the other two don't really care all that much about the EU to be honest.

[Deleted]

As for the first paragraph... that aspect, while true, is a bit too simplistic on its own for me. Of course those are the big problems if you look at the face of it. But my personal question is... Farage and Johnson, heck, even Davis... they aren't stupid. They can't believe the shit they're talking. This is just a sham. Why the hell do it? Do they hate their nation so much that they take the piss on it on the international stage? What has Great Britain done to them? Or are they really that clinically retarded? No, not insult.. I mean literally, retarded in the medical sense. IQ of sub 40 and so on.

Farage does it because he wants power. That's why he backed out of UK politics after being defeating in the MP elections, and why he kept going back for MEP elections, all he cares about is grabbing as much power as he can get his grubby little hands on and soon as he gets defeated he runs off pretending that he's won.

Boris comes across as an idiot but he really isn't, he's conniving and devious. He wanted to be Prime Minister after Cameron, that's why he backed the Leave bid, at that point no one thought it would win, so he backed it, so when the next GE pops up he can campaign not only with his toff buddies, but with the regular working folk, the sort of people who've always voted Labour, a bit of "hey I was on your side, fighting in your corner, where was the Labour party then huh?", and it probably would have worked, if Leave didn't win. You could see it in that first press conference that BoJo and Gove held the day after the results, it looked like they were giving a eulogy at a funeral.

David Davis is actually just an idiot though. He's accomplished nothing, was given the shitty job of Brexit Secretary because Gove and BoJo didn't want it and May didn't want to go up against them so soon after gaining the top spot, so she fobbed it off to the only tool who would take the job and think he was being rewarded.

[Slant]

Mandate for THEM to GIVE you AUTHORITY. In both cases you are trying to strengthen your position or to fulfill your plan. In the first case where you ask for unity, you essentially ask them to abandon their ideas and integrate within the mass. When you ask for them to give you authority, you are treating them as equals and suddenly they have a steak in what you are doing. It's a very slight difference and you have to pick your words correctly to deal with it.

They want money, fame and attention. Why work when you throw a couple of soundbites and people will pay you £40,000 for 90 min on stage? Farage is in Putin's pocket but the other two don't really care all that much about the EU to be honest.

You know what, I like your approach. I'll try it out the next time I'm mediating something. Thanks, man!

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Farage does it because he wants power. That's why he backed out of UK politics after being defeating in the MP elections, and why he kept going back for MEP elections, all he cares about is grabbing as much power as he can get his grubby little hands on and soon as he gets defeated he runs off pretending that he's won.

Boris comes across as an idiot but he really isn't, he's conniving and devious. He wanted to be Prime Minister after Cameron, that's why he backed the Leave bid, at that point no one thought it would win, so he backed it, so when the next GE pops up he can campaign not only with his toff buddies, but with the regular working folk, the sort of people who've always voted Labour, a bit of "hey I was on your side, fighting in your corner, where was the Labour party then huh?", and it probably would have worked, if Leave didn't win. You could see it in that first press conference that BoJo and Gove held the day after the results, it looked like they were giving a eulogy at a funeral.

David Davis is actually just an idiot though. He's accomplished nothing, was given the shitty job of Brexit Secretary because Gove and BoJo didn't want it and May didn't want to go up against them so soon after gaining the top spot, so she fobbed it off to the only tool who would take the job and think he was being rewarded.

Ah, thanks for the insight. All I see from Farage are his speeches in the EUP and, by god... everytime I do that I literally want to just slap his stupid grin off his face.

[Shadowmelded]

Yeah... but who is they? It kind of implies the whole of her party want to see her go. And I genuinely don't think that's the case. Tories are split. Simple as. In the same way Labour is split.

I do not believe that the minority of Brexiteers who want May out, out-number the number of Remainers in her party who want her to stay.

If it was a confidence vote in just the 1922 committee then yeah, they most likely don't outnumber the remainers. If the ERG rebel though, they could make things pretty difficult given how slim the Government's majority is. Depending how zealous they are, a confidence motion in the commons might not be out of question.

[cubby]

Nothing good will come of Brexit.

In fiction maybe, the fact is the UK will be much diminished by Brexit, irreparably so.

Brexit is an idea proliferated by morons, financed with nefarious purpose in mind by those that the uk population furthest from their minds, and I wouldn't describe a £40 billion loss to our GDP "not expensive at all".

It's my understanding that the same people/mind-set that voted for Brexit are also those that voted for Trump here in the U.S. Ignorant people seem to have a habit of staying that way, and then voting against their own best interest.

[Deleted]

It's my understanding that the same people/mind-set that voted for Brexit are also those that voted for Trump here in the U.S. Ignorant people seem to have a habit of staying that way, and then voting against their own best interest.

we just call them middle class white people here.

[dribbles]

Nothing good will come of Brexit.

In fiction maybe, the fact is the UK will be much diminished by Brexit, irreparably so.

Brexit is an idea proliferated by morons, financed with nefarious purpose in mind by those that have the uk population furthest from their minds, and I wouldn't describe a £40 billion loss to our GDP "not expensive at all" and we still haven't left.

LOL nice one calling 17.4 million people morons, that was the figure at the 2016 referendum, 27 million people voted for Brexit supporting parties in 2017 - again all morons? I bet if there was another poll in 2018 the figures for those millions of people would be higher still - more morons I suppose.

If we end up as a colony of the EU in 2019 there will be more in favour of brexit still and it will be thanks to a small minority of treasonous remainers that we stay shackled to the EU. They are the real morons in this, against the wishes of the vast majority of the populous. They should be sought out and taken through Traitors Gate to the Tower.

[Demolitia]

LOL nice one calling 17.4 million people morons, that was the figure at the 2016 referendum, 27 million people voted for Brexit supporting parties in 2017 - again all morons? I bet if there was another poll in 2018 the figures for those millions of people would be higher still - more morons I suppose.

If we end up as a colony of the EU in 2019 there will be more in favour of brexit still and it will be thanks to a small minority of treasonous remainers that we stay shackled to the EU. They are the real morons in this, against the wishes of the vast majority of the populous. They should be sought out and taken through Traitors Gate to the Tower.

When you have such an important decision make, and this happens the day after the referendum, then yes, the term morons is probably warranted

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It's my understanding that the same people/mind-set that voted for Brexit are also those that voted for Trump here in the U.S. Ignorant people seem to have a habit of staying that way, and then voting against their own best interest.

It appears politicians blaming the poor and the immigrants (or Mexico, or the EU, or the Arachnids from Klendatu) for their own shortcomings and cowardice/greed still works.

[Kallisto]

LOL nice one calling 17.4 million people morons,

If the average brexit voter is like you then yeah. They are absolute morons.

If they are readers of the Sun/Mail/Express/Daily Star then I'll consider them so beyond morons they are in need of going back to school to get basic education.

that was the figure at the 2016 referendum, 27 million people voted for Brexit supporting parties in 2017 - again all morons? I bet if there was another poll in 2018 the figures for those millions of people would be higher still - more morons I suppose.

No it was because FPTP basically in 99% of English constituencies mean if you're not voting for Labour to keep out the Tories or voting Tories to keep out Labour you're waisting your vote. BTW 56% of the country voted left of centre. If you're so up about Democracy why are you not screaming for a left of centre coalition to be made. Or is it because you don't care about Democracy just about your side.

If we end up as a colony of the EU in 2019 there will be more in favour of brexit still and it will be thanks to a small minority of treasonous remainers that we stay shackled to the EU. They are the real morons in this, against the wishes of the vast majority of the populous. They should be sought out and taken through Traitors Gate to the Tower.

51/49 last vote.

Of the 51% many of those were over 70. Of which were the largest group of leave voters. At least 1million of those have died.

At the same time similar number of 15-17 year olds (Since we're past 2 years of the vote) are now eligable. Of this the Overwhelming majority are in the remain camp. Most polls show if the vote was today Remain would win. Remain has been consistently leading for over the past year (outside of 1-2 polls in march)

[cubby]

It appears politicians blaming the poor and the immigrants (or Mexico, or the EU, or the Arachnids from Klendatu) for their own shortcomings and cowardice/greed still works.

They certainly keep ringing that ignorant bell on this side of the pond as well.