Jaina and the Blight?

[Friendlyimmolation]

Yes a fel portal lasts longer but they need to know how to use it, a normal mage cannot just suddenly switch to fel or use fel without being corrupted by it. Fel is the polar opposite of arcane.

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So what the fuck is the point of the guardian then if elven mages are so godly powerful by your logic?

Because the Guardian was a solution to a human problem because the humans refused to be careful with their magic like the high elves were?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Because the Guardian was a solution to a human problem because the humans refused to be careful with their magic like the high elves were?

It seems unlikely any reasonable number of high elf wizards could stop the avatar of sargaras with them having such a hard time in the war of the ancients then getting stomped by the scourge.

[Friendlyimmolation]

It seems unlikely any reasonable number of high elf wizards could stop the avatar of sargaras with them having such a hard time in the war of the ancients then getting stomped by the scourge.

No one did well in War of the ancients. The only reason the conclave failed was because of Dar'khan.


The avatar of Sarg's goal was to corrupt Aegwyn, not kill her. if you shoved into one high elf the power of multiple mages, then they'd fair just as well in that situation, better, or worse, depending on how the titan planned to ruin/corrupt them.

[Qualia]

She was born 3 years before the first war so you're right, she is 36. Which makes a great difference considering the other contenders are like 10000+ years old.

And even if wowpedia is outdated on that (the source goes to a twitter page no longer existing), she can be 60 and it would still fall short to mages from the Nightborne, the Nelves, from the Belves and other high end mages in the setting.

I'm not sure how being 10,000+ years old matter, given that power in WoW doesn't always increase tremendously with age. Otherwise, the most powerful beings in WoW would have been ordered by how ancients they are - which isn't always the case (Malfurion and Illidan are two big examples). One may argue that being 10,000 years old would give you more knowledge - but it actually isn't the case here. The former Alliance races were gathering their knowledge and research magic together in Dalaran. Dalaran - and not Silvermoon - was the largest hub of magical study and researches. We had Elves, Humans, Dwarves and Gnomes, even a few dragons in disguises participated in researches to further magic studies. 10,000 years of magical knowledge? Those were part of the foundation of Dalaran's knowledge - which Jaina (and many other mages) has full access to.

In the end, it falls to innate power or (no meme intended) potential - which Jaina (and some others) just have the edge over those "other contenders" (not sure exactly whom you meant, though). After all, humans were stated to have better affinity to magic, seeing that High Elves mages were even startled because of the humans' affinity to magic, even though those humans lacked "grace and subtlety" (and I don't know where you got the bits that Elves had better affinity at magic here since it clearly wasn't the case in Chronicle). Illidan, Gul'dan, Kalec, Khadgar, Azshara, plus all Guardians would still be clearly better mages (spellcaster in Gul'dan's case since he didn't start with Arcane amgic) than Jaina - to name a few non-humans who are more powerful;

[Lorgar Aurelian]

No one did well in War of the ancients. The only reason the conclave failed was because of Dar'khan.


The avatar of Sarg's goal was to corrupt Aegwyn, not kill her. if you shoved into one high elf the power of multiple mages, then they'd fair just as well in that situation, better, or worse, depending on how the titan planned to ruin/corrupt them.

Even if the avatars goal wasn’t to kill her it was still insanly powerful and the battle isn’t described as easy. Even the husk of the avatar was powerful and we don’t have illidan dispatch it Easily and he did have the power of multiple highelf mages and then even more power on top of that.

[Geofferson]

In every Fantasy Universe there is always a "most powerful" mage/sorcerer/sorceress.

In the Warcraft Fantasy Universe that most powerful mage/sorcerer/sorceress is Jaina. Blue Dragons, except for maybe the Aspect, are never more powerful that mortal Mages. In every scenario that features Powerful Mages in the current age Jaina is always the most powerful. Khadgar would be more powerful if he actually accepted the mantle of the Gaurdian be he always refuses it. Never once is Khadgar ever called most powerful or more powerful that Jaina.

I play a main a Horde Rogue, I'm not an Alliance Fanboy in any way shape or form and I agree that Jaina is "most powerful" at this point in the Lore.

I don't understand why people can't accept Jaina as being this powerful. Ever since her introduction in WC3 she has been totally OP. I don't even like Jaina as a Lore Character and I abhor Characters that can do anything they want... but Blizzard has ALWAYS had Jaina be ridiculously powerful.

Get over yourselves, Blizzard wants Jaina to be OP and they always have written her that way. Blizzard says that Thalyssra and Zul are afraid of Jaina... so they are. You can say it's stupid, and I do, but that doesn't change the fact that Blizzard says Jaina is that powerful.


EDIT: Also... Med'an was removed from Cannon and technically never actually existed.

[Qualia]

In the Warcraft Fantasy Universe that most powerful mage/sorcerer/sorceress is Jaina. Blue Dragons, except for maybe the Aspect, are never more powerful that mortal Mages. In every scenario that features Powerful Mages in the current age Jaina is always the most powerful. Khadgar would be more powerful if he actually accepted the mantle of the Gaurdian be he always refuses it. Never once is Khadgar ever called most powerful or more powerful that Jaina.

Jaina is only canonically stated to be "the most powerful *human* *sorceress* *alive*", so I'm not sure where you get the "the most powerful mage/sorcerer" bit from. Khadgar, on the other hand, was stated to be "the most accomplished of all living wizards and one of the most powerful magi in Azerothian history". Not just one of the most powerful magi alive, one of the most powerful magi in Azeroth history - and Azeroth history are filled with powerful figures (ones who are way more powerful than Jaina) such as (but not limited to) Illidan, Azshara, or every single Guardians. Jaina is powerful, but I'd be very skeptical about the claim that she is more powerful than Khadgar at the moment. She clearly hadn't done anything to show that was the case.

[Geofferson]

For fucks sake, I really don't understand the hair splitting between Sorcerer and Sorceress its the same thing. Having a dick doesn't make you better at magic.

Khadgar is more technical and has more experience than Jaina. Thalyssra and the Nightborne have more experience than Khadgar and Jaina.

Jaina has been written to have a ridiculous amount of raw magical power. Khadgar knows more about magic and does the whole telepathy and illusion thing and sometimes makes me a ring.

Jaina isn't written to be the most talented or knowledgeable mage she is written to have an absurd amount of raw power. In the current Time, not the ancient bullshit, whenever a single Mage does something crazy with magic it is always Jaina doing it. Khadgar and other mages always have help.

Illidan isn't a mage or mortal anymore and we don't know what the deal with Azshara is so can't really comment on her.

I think Jaina is too powerful but that's how Blizzard writes her. I agree it's stupid but that's how Blizzard writes her.

[Qualia]

For fucks sake, I really don't understand the hair splitting between Sorcerer and Sorceress its the same thing. Having a dick doesn't make you better at magic.

It's true that having a dick doesn't make you better at magic, and I never meant to imply that. What I meant to say was that, the term "sorceress" is used solely to denote female spellcaster(s). In other words, Jaina was only the most powerful among female spellcasters alive. That doesn't mean she must be the most powerful spellcaster (in general, with both gender) - in fact, if that was the case, they would have used a more generic term (i.e: mage) instead of limiting her to a smaller group (limited by both race - "human" and gender - "sorceress").

Khadgar is more technical and has more experience than Jaina. Thalyssra and the Nightborne have more experience than Khadgar and Jaina.
Jaina has been written to have a ridiculous amount of raw magical power. Khadgar knows more about magic and does the whole telepathy and illusion thing and sometimes makes me a ring.
Jaina isn't written to be the most talented or knowledgeable mage she is written to have an absurd amount of raw power. In the current Time, not the ancient bullshit, a single Mage does something crazy with magic it is always Jaina doing it.
Illidan isn't a mage or mortal anymore and we don't know what the deal with Azshara is so can't really comment on her.
I think Jaina is too powerful but that's how Blizzard writes her. I agree it's stupid but that's how Blizzard writes her.

I'm not even sure where you get the part that Jaina had more raw magical power than Khadgar from. I'd like some citation, please, or I'd sadly have to treat it as headcanon.

Jaina has never done anything crazy with magic without the Focusing Iris. No, what happened in the cinematic, while indeed cool, was hardly something that exceptionally powerful like people thought. What she did was flashy, but subjectively, conjuring many arcane canons and can only blast a hole on a wall is pretty unremarkable when we think about the destruction wrecked by other most powerful characters. Khadgar caused more destruction with his spells. MU Gul'dan (not even AU Gul'dan who later was empowered by the Legion, MU Gul'dan) did better. Illidan did better. Oh, by Illidan, I meant the Night Elf Illidan, not Illidan after he consumed the Skull of Gul'dan, just in case. Most Guardians definitely were more powerful. Khadgar is currently most accomplished spellcaster, and considered one of those extremely (most) powerful magi in Azeroth history (which counts both dead and alive) - who, as I listed a few names, were way more powerful than Jaina, that speaks volume about his power.

Jaina is definitely powerful, but she is hardly as powerful as some people think she is.

[FelPlague]

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment..._in_lordaeron/
This is how jaina cleared the blight (volume, turn it on)

[Stormdash]

So it takes years for paladins druids and shaman to cleanse the scourge plague (the one from warcraft 3 onward) but Jaina can just remove the Forsaken Blight 2.0©® in just a spell? No one ever managed to cleanse the new blight anywhere but the red dragons with their lifeflames, and even then the results were questionable ??!!!

Is there any explanation about that in BFA or did Blizzard just decide to turn Jaina into the new OP Thrall character?

Best ways to fanwank it are like Combat says, she cleansed the air not the land. Added, maybe it can be dealt with better before it has time to seep and settle? Also worth considering, she probably didn't "cleanse" it so much as displace it; that frost nova would have undoubtedly also involve a sudden snap of cold air and just "whooshed" it elsewhere, not actually like neutralized it.

[Odinfrost]

And my complain with jaina isnt even the teleportation.. Its the perfect frost spell that didnt kill any aliance char.. But froze over all of sylvanas skeletons.. And stoped the blight.. Plus giant ship with arcane canons..

How many times do this need to be said. There were no alliance in the plague cloud (aside from the dead and raised ones who cannot really count as alliance anymore), so there was litterally no way for jaina to accidentally kill anyone with her spell

[Deleted]

Can't she just use the same magic and cleanse Lorderon? There are even plot points from Wotlk that shows how easy it is to remove the blight. There is no reason in lore why the alliance should not occupy and rebuild Lorderon to it's former glory.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Can't she just use the same magic and cleanse Lorderon? There are even plot points from Wotlk that shows how easy it is to remove the blight. There is no reason in lore why the alliance should not occupy and rebuild Lorderon to it's former glory.

Removing the blight isn’t the same as healing the land. Sure they could retake lorderon but the land will be comply unuseable for ages so what’s the point?

[LanToaster]

And my complain with jaina isnt even the teleportation.. Its the perfect frost spell that didnt kill any aliance char.. But froze over all of sylvanas skeletons.. And stoped the blight.. Plus giant ship with arcane canons..

Soo, giant ass flying City is fine?
But Flying Ship isnt?

TBH, as many people said, you never ever see any Alliance character inside the blastrange of the Frost Spell, aswell, as the spell only travels through the Blight cloud, so if there was someone from the Alliance still, he would´ve been dead anyway.

Next, I need to be honest here, I dont have a problem that Jaina knows a more badass Variation of Arcane Missiles, she doesnt even shoot much more than a typical arcane mage. Just bigger. Maybe she even prepared something that she triggered for those Cannons.

Just because it isnt explained/shown, doesnt mean it doesnt exist. As people said, its sad that people just cant appreciate something thats just "cool".
But I think honestly, people are just here to bitch and moan. If you would actually complain because of the Story, you would´ve quit long ago. Since several Expansions its only crying and complaining about the lore.

To be honest i dont really know how the aliance can lose this war.. Not with god titan thunder empress jaina.. perfect princess anduin.. and co at their side..

And might i add as a little point the aliance has the vindicar.. they could blow up ogrimar at any point if blizz so felt like it..

While I might not agree with your exaggeration, (As I said, maybe the grand and powerfull magic she used in that one Instance was beforehand prepared), but I agree with you here that in theory the Alliance has much more War Assets than the Horde.
Note however the, "In Theory", there are many factions you would consider Alliance, that are not necessarily alliance.

Also, the WarGoal of the Alliance doesnt appear to be "Total Anihilation", so a party like the Horde under Sylvanas has a much easier way to Win her cause, because she just Nukes everything, doesnt care about civilians or friendly fire.
I doubt Anduin would go that far.

[Deleted]

Soo, giant ass flying City is fine?
But Flying Ship isnt?

TBH, as many people said, you never ever see any Alliance character inside the blastrange of the Frost Spell, aswell, as the spell only travels through the Blight cloud, so if there was someone from the Alliance still, he would´ve been dead anyway.

Next, I need to be honest here, I dont have a problem that Jaina knows a more badass Variation of Arcane Missiles, she doesnt even shoot much more than a typical arcane mage. Just bigger. Maybe she even prepared something that she triggered for those Cannons.

Just because it isnt explained/shown, doesnt mean it doesnt exist. As people said, its sad that people just cant appreciate something thats just "cool".
But I think honestly, people are just here to bitch and moan. If you would actually complain because of the Story, you would´ve quit long ago. Since several Expansions its only crying and complaining about the lore.


While I might not agree with your exaggeration, (As I said, maybe the grand and powerfull magic she used in that one Instance was beforehand prepared), but I agree with you here that in theory the Alliance has much more War Assets than the Horde.
Note however the, "In Theory", there are many factions you would consider Alliance, that are not necessarily alliance.

Also, the WarGoal of the Alliance doesnt appear to be "Total Anihilation", so a party like the Horde under Sylvanas has a much easier way to Win her cause, because she just Nukes everything, doesnt care about civilians or friendly fire.
I doubt Anduin would go that far.

Ahm.. Dalaran is flying with the help of several mages.. Jaina is going solo in controling that ship.. If its something so simple let my mage toon summon one too.. :3

The problem isnt the inner complexeties of what base spell she is using for the canon spell or not.. Its how she is basicly a swiss blade of a mage.. You need something done.. Bam she got you..

The cinematic didnt make me go "WHoa thats COooOL" it made me facepalm..

I think legion was a near perfect exp.. It had anything a lore nerd would like.. Asside from a couple lore hicups..

And finaly the fact that the aliance dosent need to.. Or has anyone to dirty their hands.. Is again a example of bad writing.. :3

[Stormdash]

Can't she just use the same magic and cleanse Lorderon? There are even plot points from Wotlk that shows how easy it is to remove the blight. There is no reason in lore why the alliance should not occupy and rebuild Lorderon to it's former glory.

Well, the ostensible decimation of their invasion/occupying force in the process would be a reason. In dialogue seems pretty clear they got largely wiped out in the attempt to take the place only to end up with no place. And it also makes more sense if one reconciles that Jaina didn't cleanse the Blight so much as displace it somewhere else. Under that premise, the narrative goal of Lordaeron being a de facto Alliance defeat for having spent a whole lot to get absolutely nothing still holds up.

[MikeBogina]

You mean how sylvanas can fly and deploy entire cities of blight in an instant? mhm.

Yeah flying, so powerful... and she didn't use powers to deploy the blight, it's a chemical weapon.

[FelPlague]

Yeah flying, so powerful... and she didn't use powers to deploy the blight, it's a chemical weapon.

Yet how did she deploy all of them? how did they deploy? its not like she pulled a string.

[LanToaster]

Ahm.. Dalaran is flying with the help of several mages.. Jaina is going solo in controling that ship.. If its something so simple let my mage toon summon one too.. :3

You have your Magical Flying Disc. With Trails. Dont see Jainas Ship having a trail. But you got 3!

The problem isnt the inner complexeties of what base spell she is using for the canon spell or not.. Its how she is basicly a swiss blade of a mage.. You need something done.. Bam she got you..

Well, I would´t say though, as I said, the Cannons are nothing really more than Big fucking Arcane Missiles.
The Frost attack for the Blight, kinda looks like a big ass FrostNova. Which also wasnt a InstantCast like usually, it needed quit a cast time for what it actually did.

And finally, she didn´t deus ex machina in the final confrontation. Why? Dunno, maybe OOM, maybe the Grand Spells she used actually needed Preperation. In that case maybe she took the ship because it could hold the prep for the Arcane Shots, one could read many things in it.

The cinematic didnt make me go "WHoa thats COooOL" it made me facepalm..

I thought it was cool, would´ve been boring if she just popped up, and did her stuff.

I think legion was a near perfect exp.. It had anything a lore nerd would like.. Asside from a couple lore hicups..

Well, I remember the loud complaining and whining about the Legion SpaceShips.

But I also enjoyed Legion, even though the Legion kinda felt a bit weak overall. (Not as bad as the IronHorde though)
But apart from the BrokenShore at the beginning the Legion never actually won any ground. (Was even worse when we went to Argus, they could´ve had Aggramar patroling zones, like the FelReaver back in Burning Crusade.)

If you think about it back in LichKing, you were in almost every zone reminded how weak you were compared to the Lichking, and even after you fortified your foothold in IceCrown, the lichking just comes to visit you, to show you he´s still the boss, and doesnt really care about you.

But, again, i still really enjoyed legion.

And finaly the fact that the aliance dosent need to.. Or has anyone to dirty their hands.. Is again a example of bad writing.. :3

Dunno what you are getting here right now. But I think that might be the point blizzard is going to.
On one side you have Sylvanas, who is like forever pursuing only her own goals, and trying to gain a Future for her people. (Taken from what I think she might´ve wanted to achieve in Stormheim) She is reckless and has no problems doing anything she can do to get out on top.

On the other side you have Anduin, who since forever just wanted to have peace, (taken from Pandaria) he dont want to sacrifice his morals, or beliefs.
Right now, (unless you know Story spoilers from the Addon) you cant really talk about "Bad writing" because you dont know the entire story.
Maybe Anduin will be forced to sacrifice his Morals, and get his hands dirty. Maybe sylvanas needs to learn that shitting on everyone wont take her to her goals.

With how much I enjoyed Legion, i´m actually positive that they will get a decent story going.

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Yet how did she deploy all of them? how did they deploy? its not like she pulled a string.

She send BlightCaller to do that. Honestly, while you dont see that in the Alliance Video, in the Horde Video she clearly sends Blightcaller: "You know what to do", and when Anduin Arrives, she stalls for time.

You could ask how she knew exactly when Blightcaller was ready.