I don't get the negativity regarding BFA

[Cows For Life]

So why all this doom and gloom?

One month in and player activity levels are back down to, maybe even slightly below 7.3.5 levels.

[Deleted]

One month in and player activity levels are back down to, maybe even slightly below 7.3.5 levels.

Really? All I see is more players than in Legion, based on my guild and friends list.

[Cows For Life]

Really? All I see is more players than in Legion, based on my guild and friends list.

Janz: My self-selected anecdotes are more valid than inaccurate server data polling!

[bigbleach]

To be honest, I had a lot of fun with this expansion. Sure, there are some things that bother me, but every expansion has those. I don't like the Heart of Azeroth or the Azerite Armor system, island expeditions are kinda fun but could have cooler rewards and Warzones are only interesting from a lore standpoint. Having to unlock Allied races with a long rep grind is dumb and takes the fun out of it. I even still begrudge the fact we can not fly.

But in spite of all of this, Battle For Azeroth is a decent expansion. It has 6 zones, where Legion only had 5 and one of those was heavily gated for max level. Zandalar especially looks awesome, and characters like Bwonsamdi are really cool. I even love Nathanos in this expansion, and I usually hate the Forsaken. Visually, this expansion looks just gorgeous. I can't remember the last time when an expansion actually had leveling and dungeon gear sets that I liked. The zones look beautiful.

All in all, I would say that this expansion had to offer pretty much all the things every other expansion offered. New content in the form of quests, dungeons and a raid. And certainly not lacking in quality either. So why all this doom and gloom?

I love BFA so far. They fell short on a few things, like there is no incentive to keep doing WQ's once you get your reps maxed for a mount. There isn't anything fun like the withered training or epic questline like suramar. Islands do kind suck... But other than those few things, I am in love with this expac. Raiding is good, M+ are quite challenging. Fairly alt friendly, much more so than Legion.

[Nyel]

You don't get to call an expansion with actual features a "WoD moment"

Even if said features are lacking, they are at least features.

WoD has NOTHING after you hit 100. It had one feature and you sat in that feature for the entirety of the expansion.

So yeah, stop referring to BFA as WoD. It isn't perfect, but it's not WoD.

Allied races = new character models
Garrison = "Ship"
Challenge mode = mythic+
Draenor perks + new talent row = Azerite light

Granted, we do have Warfronts and Island Expeditions as "features" but I'm not sure if they even should be counted at the moment. Yes, they are features. But they're so lackluster / bad that we wouldn't recognize if they just removed them.

And I talked about the "WoD moment" and not that BfA is WoD. The first weeks of WoD and BfA are just very similar when it comes to Blizzard communicating, issues and player reaction. That's what I meant with "WoD moment".

[Mafic]

WoW devs are like helicopter moms suffocating the innovation and fun of players. o.O

[Wildberry]

You don't get to call an expansion with actual features a "WoD moment"
Even if said features are lacking, they are at least features.
WoD has NOTHING after you hit 100. It had one feature and you sat in that feature for the entirety of the expansion.
So yeah, stop referring to BFA as WoD. It isn't perfect, but it's not WoD.

Can we stop with this absolute revisionism? WoD had features, too, by that logic.

Garrisons are, whether you like it or not, a feature. They were bad, but they were a feature. And from the Garrison, we had Stables Content, and Gladiator's Sanctum content. Not to mention Garrison Invasions. Oh, and don't forget about Ashran.

WoD had content, it just sucked. Sounds quite a bit like the current expansion, actually.

Sure WoD might have saw a lot of content get cut. BfA's "content" was released unfinished.

[Deleted]

Janz: My self-selected anecdotes are more valid than inaccurate server data polling!

If you have such statistics, might as well provide them?

[Deleted]

If you have such statistics, might as well provide them?

Post #272 in this very thread.
https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...8#post50128548

[gobio]

Q: I don't get the negativity regarding BFA
A: Because I don't get the new allied races as adventised during beta pre-sales.

[Deleted]

Post #272 in this very thread.
https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...8#post50128548

I don't really see anything special about that. Of course there is spike on the release. For a few days people took maybe vacations days and stuff to play more than usual, which reflects on that figure, and then went back to normal schedule, which again reflects on that figure. Would you expect everyone to just forget about their lives to play WoW 24/7 because there was a new expansion?

For reference, this is my main server/faction: http://warcraftrealms.com/weeklyacti...09&factionid=3

Activity is actually on the rise.

[Charge me Doctor]

Janz: My self-selected anecdotes are more valid than inaccurate server data polling!

They are more important for an individual player, because having a healthy guild and big friendlist with active players will result in good times even when accurate server data polling says otherwise. And vice-versa, when accurate server data polling says that you should have a good time and game is great and alive - you sit there in the middle of orgrimmar, alone, guildless, with dozens of players in a friendlist with "last offline: 1 year ago".

That's the difference.

- - - Updated - - -

Post #272 in this very thread.
https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...8#post50128548

"Data is collected using the latest version of the CensusPlus UI Mod."

[Deleted]

One month in and player activity levels are back down to, maybe even slightly below 7.3.5 levels.

How do you know.

[Deleted]

I don't really see anything special about that. Of course there is spike on the release. For a few days people took maybe vacations days and stuff to play more than usual, which reflects on that figure, and then went back to normal schedule, which again reflects on that figure. Would you expect everyone to just forget about their lives to play WoW 24/7 because there was a new expansion?

For reference, this is my main server/faction: http://warcraftrealms.com/weeklyacti...09&factionid=3

Activity is actually on the rise.

Just to clarify:
1. Until blizz stopped publishing subnumbers during the the mass exodus of wod, warcraftrealm stats were almost identical to the official subnumer-curve
2. Just cherrypicking 1 server doesnt reflect a good samplesize to make statements for the overall activity
3. especially not, if the last update was in july
4. All we can see is trends, we cant pull accurate numbers from warcraftrealms, only trends
5. when activity drastically drops it implies that subs drop too, thats just logic (and experience from other expansions, see 1.)
6. If you see the great picture: Raging forums, I-quit-threads everywhere, negative fansites, (even) most of the content creators are very negative, warcraftrealms stats, emergency AMA, emergency stream today, it all fits together.

And there is actually NO evidence, that the "silent majority" is actually having the best time ever.

Doesnt mean you cannot have fun ofc. People can still have fun.

[Revamp Man]

Content great
Systems shite

Great quests
Great zones
Some characters just too likable or you love to hate (love Flynn hate Ashvane)
Dungeons are super fun overall
Islands are an interesting spin on small group content

M+ system broken on launch and rewards not communicated
Raids broken for some with a transmit only weapon...that only made sense in legion
Warfront broke entire queue system for EU
Azerite gear is a chore and some pieces were changing the required level just to extend the grind
Traits bugged
Bugs from alpha STILL THERE
Warmode kinda wonky for a day thanks to legiondaries
Slowing gearing down
Removing gear swapping in m+
Removing master loot under the guise of stopping ninjas...which was done when ml required a guild group
Telling the players expecting the m+cache to work similar to beta due to the removal of azerite gear from the loot tables was...wrong??

Literally every system has had major issues this expansion

Do I hate bfa?? No I'm enjoying it with my friends and raid team

Am I going to accept it and thank blizzard every time they feed me a shit sandwich? No I'm going to provide feedback
I don't want to hear they will do better next time
I don't want to hear they weren't prepared
I don't want to hear sorry
I want my game to work

[Deleted]

Content great
Systems shite

Great quests
Great zones
Some characters just too likable or you love to hate (love Flynn hate Ashvane)
Dungeons are super fun overall
Islands are an interesting spin on small group content

M+ system broken on launch and rewards not communicated
Raids broken for some with a transmit only weapon...that only made sense in legion
Warfront broke entire queue system for EU
Azerite gear is a chore and some pieces were changing the required level just to extend the grind
Traits bugged
Bugs from alpha STILL THERE
Warmode kinda wonky for a day thanks to legiondaries
Slowing gearing down
Removing gear swapping in m+
Removing master loot under the guise of stopping ninjas...which was done when ml required a guild group
Telling the players expecting the m+cache to work similar to beta due to the removal of azerite gear from the loot tables was...wrong??

Literally every system has had major issues this expansion

Do I hate bfa?? No I'm enjoying it with my friends and raid team

Am I going to accept it and thank blizzard every time they feed me a shit sandwich? No I'm going to provide feedback
I don't want to hear they will do better next time
I don't want to hear they weren't prepared
I don't want to hear sorry
I want my game to work

I agree with that and want to add my biggest issue: arrogant and/or plain untrue communication on decisions. I was very active here when they made all these ML/PL changes. When everything seemed to be serving only one purpose - making the players appreciate RnG which really isn’t “random” and serves as another way of extending content by replacing everything they could with slot machines. Claiming it’s for the best of players. Arrogant lies are not good communication standards.

[ToxicFlame]

It's not Blizzard's job to fix the community. Their job is to fix their game. It's the communities job to fix the community.

why would there be a community if there's no incentive to build any? if people could solo m+ and raids and get the same rewards i bet you there would be a lot that would do it and ignore all the community part.

[Deleted]

And there is actually NO evidence, that the "silent majority" is actually having the best time ever.

Just like there is no factual evidence of the opposite either. But that doesn't stop the people stating so here.

I don't really give a rats ass about any other servers than the one I play on, either. Why would I?

[Revamp Man]

I agree with that and want to add my biggest issue: arrogant and/or plain untrue communication on decisions. I was very active here when they made all these ML/PL changes. When everything seemed to be serving only one purpose - making the players appreciate RnG which really isn’t “random” and serves as another way of extending content by replacing everything they could with slot machines. Claiming it’s for the best of players. Arrogant lies are not good communication standards.

I have hope for 8.1
My biggest issue was the players defending the worst changes
"Multiple gear sets for a dungeon is stupid/holding me back" from someone who never pushed a +8
"Guilds ninja too much good on blizz I show up I deserve loot" from someone angry they didn't get gear on progression from the boss they wanted but ignore the fact that in a week they likely get showered with loot. My group had a new holy pally join in hfc and he got 4pc BiS trinket and weapon first night.

Some even celebrate this hurting other players...etc

The ilvl restriction on trading gear...blizz if a boss drops a caster staff but nothing for my ww spec maybe I want to spec to get the staff to trade to my friends. Maybe if I have a 355 staff and a 355 oh drops I want to trade it to my friends because I don't have a mh and they do.

Give us control blizz I'm not an autistic 3 year old I just want to play

[ToxicFlame]

Content great
Systems shite

Great quests
Great zones
Some characters just too likable or you love to hate (love Flynn hate Ashvane)
Dungeons are super fun overall
Islands are an interesting spin on small group content

M+ system broken on launch and rewards not communicated
Raids broken for some with a transmit only weapon...that only made sense in legion
Warfront broke entire queue system for EU
Azerite gear is a chore and some pieces were changing the required level just to extend the grind
Traits bugged
Bugs from alpha STILL THERE
Warmode kinda wonky for a day thanks to legiondaries
Slowing gearing down
Removing gear swapping in m+
Removing master loot under the guise of stopping ninjas...which was done when ml required a guild group
Telling the players expecting the m+cache to work similar to beta due to the removal of azerite gear from the loot tables was...wrong??

Literally every system has had major issues this expansion

Do I hate bfa?? No I'm enjoying it with my friends and raid team

Am I going to accept it and thank blizzard every time they feed me a shit sandwich? No I'm going to provide feedback
I don't want to hear they will do better next time
I don't want to hear they weren't prepared
I don't want to hear sorry
I want my game to work

this summerized my feelings about bfa so well that i am going to bookmark this and quote it every time someone asks why i dislike/unsubbed in bfa.
Only part i disagree with is island expeditions, in my opinion they took the worst part about dungeons and raids, put it on a circular shaped map with no real context/meaning and called it new content. Maybe the pvp version is better, i haven't played that though and it honestly seems like 3v3 with trash thrown in.