[Spoiler] The Alliance does X in Zuldazar and Baine's immidiate reaction is:

[Super Dickmann]

Oh, by this point in the war the Darkspear have every personal reason to go ham on the faction war, the list of reasons including :
1. There is literally no turning back after genocide at Teldrassil.
2. The Holy Land of all trollkind is under invasion by the Alliance.
3. The Holy land of all trollkind is under invasion by Kul Tirans, #1 hated enemy of the Darkspear Tribe.

Zandalar and the enlightened (opposing of Zul's heresy and nostalgia-fevered dreams of the old empire) rule of both Rastakhan and Talanji could even represent a future beyond Sylvanas' Horde, but the Alliance needs to go away for that to happen. Vengeance for Sen'jin, vengeance for Rastakhan.

If only Lordareon had happened before Teldrassil, man.

It'd solve so much of this trainwreck it's not even funny. And yes, Darkspear would be baying for blood that their enemy is Kul Tiras out to finish what Daelin started and Talanji forgiving the faction that killed her dad and wrecked her home would be absolutely ridiculous.

[Wildberry]

And that is the problem here. You failing to see that other characters did the same, if not even worse things, than Baine did, yet somehow keep sticking it to Baine, but ignoring the rest.

No, I see exactly why you're making the comparison. You're just wrong, and it was pointed out pages ago. You're just digging your heels in the sand and screaming "nuh uh," but you haven't actually countered any of my initial criticism of your hamfisted comparison.

Because, once again, my point wasn't to defend his character, but point out how other characters get a pass where he seemingly doesn't.

And it's been pointed out time and again that this point is wrong. Regardless, this wasn't the first claim you made, and I'm not letting you slide on that.

You've been responding to me for how many pages now? I'd say it is pretty deserving.

At this point I'm just here to enjoy the worst arguments I've seen on MMO-Champion in a long while.

You simply can't let go and admit that Baine, while being a dull and ineffective character, doesn't warrant more hate than other characters. The latest stunt in this endeavour is to blame Baine for not doing anything at Lordaeron, when you have the entirety of the Horde, except him and Saurfang, keep their mouth shut.

The Trolls are leaderless, Saurfang did more than Baine, Gallywix doesn't have any moral problem with it, and it's pointed out previously how Lor'themar should have said something.

Congratulations, in this one specific instance, one person is as bad as Baine. And they got flack for it. And you know, since it's a Blood Elf, shouldn't he be immune from criticism? After all, it's just those dastardly Blood Elves that are sabotaging the reputation of noble Baine Bloodhoof, right?

[dreamfillah]

It'd solve so much of this trainwreck it's not even funny. And yes, Darkspear would be baying for blood that their enemy is Kul Tiras out to finish what Daelin started and Talanji forgiving the faction that killed her dad and wrecked her home would be absolutely ridiculous.

It would mean we could've had Vol'jin still be alive in time for the faction war expansion, and the literal troll expansion.

None of the circumstances of how the Zandalari make contact with the Horde would've been any different, they'd have only needed to write the burning of Teldrassil in a more intelligent way, i.e not "BURN IT". A freak accident with Azerite weaponry would've been appropriate and boom, we now have a world-war where Vol'jin can go out for Alliance blood with their Kul Tiran allies and the future of all trolls at stake when the Alliance diverts their fury at Zuldazar.

Sylvanas could've been left as the wildcard similar to what Genn and apparently now Tyrande are doing for the Alliance.

[korijenkins]

I love how obvious it is which people are Sylvanas fanboys.

[Ravingmad]

Hopefully, we'll see Baine a little more active in the future. But oh wait, none of that matter because daddy Vol'jin is coming back.

[Super Dickmann]

It would mean we could've had Vol'jin still be alive in time for the faction war expansion, and the literal troll expansion.

None of the circumstances of how the Zandalari make contact with the Horde would've been any different, they'd have only needed to write the burning of Teldrassil in a more intelligent way, i.e not "BURN IT". A freak accident with Azerite weaponry would've been appropriate and boom, we now have a world-war where Vol'jin can go out for Alliance blood with their Kul Tiran allies and the future of all trolls at stake when the Alliance diverts their fury at Zuldazar.

Sylvanas could've been left as the wildcard similar to what Genn and apparently now Tyrande are doing for the Alliance.

This expansion would make leagues more sense with Vol'jin in charge and every element of it seems tailored for him as the leader. He is the one with a link to Bwonsamdi, with the Zandalari Empire, with opposition to Zul, who personally rejected his offer. He's the one who's people have taken hits from Kul Tiras and who would be ready to fight them. And the best part is they could still do the Sylvanas and Genn stuff on the side without losing nothing about the focus.

[dreamfillah]

This expansion would make leagues more sense with Vol'jin in charge and every element of it seems tailored for him as the leader. He is the one with a link to Bwonsamdi, with the Zandalari Empire, with opposition to Zul, who personally rejected his offer. He's the one who's people have taken hits from Kul Tiras and who would be ready to fight them. And the best part is they could still do the Sylvanas and Genn stuff on the side without losing nothing about the focus.

Only seeming "loss" is the focus on Saurfang, but then again, that's exchanged for Vol'jin who was screwed out of his Warchief's reign in WoD and Legion.

[Powerogue]

So what you're saying is Baine is staying true to his characterization of seeking an end to war? How awful! :O

So far Sylvanas has forced him to sever ties with his friend Anduin, committed massive war crimes, left Saurfang to die, and gotten a horde capital destroyed.

Gee why would Baine want this to end when the Alliance, going by the mission tables, are already knocking on his door?!

[Hubbl3]

left Saurfang to die

Yes, next time I will just drag him out of there and throw him into the sea.

[Svad1287]

I am pretty sure Cairne, would have stood his ground like Baine is doing now. Hell, in the original classic wow intro for the tauren, the voice over, speaks to their peaceful natures and how they love and revere nature... Sylvanas fucked that up litterally by burning Teldrassil, and laying waste to Darkshore + assorted other zones, yet to come.

[dreamfillah]

So what you're saying is Baine is staying true to his characterization of seeking an end to war? How awful! :O

So far Sylvanas has forced him to sever ties with his friend Anduin, committed massive war crimes, and gotten a horde capital destroyed.

Gee why would Baine want this to end when the Alliance, going by the mission tables, are already knocking on his door?!

Besides it being insensitive to Talanji semi-literally grieving over the body of her father and God-King (seriously, rude), it's poorly delivered for reasons as such:

1. This makes the issue of nobody talking about the consequences of Teldrassil burning, and the super-villainesque soul-damning tactics Sylvanas pulled all the more egregious. Why back out now, when all that's said and done, but now the Alliance have a far larger advantage? (Not nitpicking his reasoning, but the writer's for having him be silent/taciturn on all of the horrible shit you mentioned until now.)
2. The way he brings it up can easily be taken as whining, that's his lot in life in how his character is written.

But no seriously, the problems with Baine saying the stuff he is are far more deep-rooted than the characters themselves, it's the mind-locks and mental gymnastics pulled/left ignored for the whole story to work. Baine is just the unfortunate sandbag of all these critiques.

[Wildberry]

I am pretty sure Cairne, would have stood his ground like Baine is doing now.

I don't even like Cairne, but that's clearly not what Baine's doing.

Cairne had an objection to something he thought Garrosh did, that Garrosh denied. He still assaulted him and challenged him to a mak'gora.

Baine just... whines about stuff he's seen Sylvanas do.

[Aeula]

I am pretty sure Cairne, would have stood his ground like Baine is doing now. Hell, in the original classic wow intro for the tauren, the voice over, speaks to their peaceful natures and how they love and revere nature... Sylvanas fucked that up litterally by burning Teldrassil, and laying waste to Darkshore + assorted other zones, yet to come.

Stood his ground?

Baine: Oh no, we lost a battle. Let’s surrender.
Everyone else: Shut up Baine!
Baine: *Shuts up*

Compare that to how Cairne reacted to Garrosh.

Honestly I hope the Alliance burn Thunder Bluff to the ground. Maybe then Baine will attach some prosthetic balls and stand up for once.

[Wildberry]

Honestly I hope the Alliance burn Thunder Bluff to the ground. Maybe then Baine will attach some prosthetic balls and stand up for once.

Why waste good Tauren? Just place Baine in the way of angry Genn and Tyrande, and hope nothing bad whatsoever happens to him.

[Super Dickmann]

I love how obvious it is which people are Sylvanas fanboys.

This is what Magnagarde actually believes.

[Aeula]

Why waste good Tauren? Just place Baine in the way of angry Genn and Tyrande, and hope nothing bad whatsoever happens to him.

That would be the best solution to the Baine problem, sure. But he’s the only Horde character Christie Golden and the Alliance like. So I doubt we’ll be rid of him so easy.

[Wildberry]

This is what Magnagarde actually believes.

This is actually funnier than the other edit of this.

[The Iron Fist]

Don't care about the opinion of the OP when he misspells "immediate" wrong twice.

[Hubbl3]

This is what Magnagarde actually believes.

Ahaha, nice.

[Schattenlied]

The Alliance kills the King of the Zandalari, allies in the negotiation table of sorts, and his immidiate thought process as someone who is suppose to be part of the Horde and to support his allies is...



What the actual hell is going with this guy? Why does Blizzard KEEP writing him this way?

Because he has a brain. The Alliance just rolled in, decimated the Zandalari navy and sacked their capital city... Like Nathanos says, victory is within the Alliance' grasp. That is exactly the time to open negotiations, but Sylvanas is either too stupid or too selfish to see that and refuses to give up her throne, regardless of how many of her own people die in the process of her selfishly trying to cling to her power.