Awful lore characters that seem to be forced into the storyline: the self inserts.

[Chonar]

feign death, mate.

Curses!
BAMBOOZLED AGAIN!

[therealstegblob]

You haven't reduced anyone to anything lol you are just sticking your fingers in your ears going lalalallalalala I can't hear you and straight up lying about the ptr content.

So, in other words, you're accusing the Red Shirt Guy and his blog of lying...?

[Deleted]

Too much forced women, such as Talanji

Actually, if men always go kill themselves in wars, women are left to take over. :P

[Verdugo]

Why do people ignore Jaina. She is a self insert ever since Golden started writing her and turned her into a mage god for no reason, culminating in a boss fight where she reveals she was just toying with us, something not seen since fucking Lich King.

[Arrashi]

Why do people ignore Jaina. She is a self insert ever since Golden started writing her and turned her into a mage god for no reason, culminating in a boss fight where she reveals she was just toying with us, something not seen since fucking Lich King.

Because if you say that everyone will spin it to make you look like you don't like women.

[ravenmoon]

OP you sound very bitter and angry. Like you hate everyone and every character should die.

If this isn't the case, perhaps dialling down the rhetoric.

[ArguesWithStrangers]

I am tired of players crying cause their favorite characters don't play out the way they dreamed. The story moves and we all have characters we like meeting unfortunate ends and characters we dislike. It's not your game and you are not special. Get hired by blizz, get in the dev team and try to get your way, if you care so much. It's their game.

This is like crying that film X didn't turn out the way you wanted. No shit Sherlock. It's not you making it. It's impossible to please everyone. Don't be so self centered. Theres a dev team and it's their story they are telling, not yours.

Wait, we shouldn't complain when a product that is made to entertain us fails to do so? I mean, in a larger sense I agree, people often take their dislike too far and give it more emotion than it deserves. That being said, it's not illegitimate to come on here and say, "I really didn't like thing X, and here are my reasons." I don't like what they did with Alleria or the Void Elf storyline. The whole thing seems forced and unearned to me. It doesn't stop me from playing the game. It just means I don't enjoy that aspect of the story.

[Mehrunes]

Nathanos has been around forever, but he's only really started taking a major role within the last few years. I honestly hate his current characterization, because it doesn't mix well with his lore, and he comes off as too much of a self righteous cunt for a character with the history they have. Nathanos would be better suited as a "gunny highway" style character, not Angelica Pickles.

What do you mean "current characterization"? Nathanos behaves how he always behaved. He openly treated the players with disdain in Vanilla. He was extremely loyal to Sylvanas in Vanilla. He was cruel and ruthless (over extremely petty shit) in Vanilla.

[Nerovar]

Nathanos is a self-insert? No way, man.

[A Young Munch]

Turalyon is the classic elf-banging human knight/warrior.
Except he can't bang her anymore because of the whole Void vs Light thing

But so far, he is no self-insert.


Nathanos though? Just terrible

Nathanos is one of those characters that, on paper, I would absolutely love. Unfortunately, he, Sylvanas and Anduin are all so unbearable that I legitimately get angry when I interact with them because they're stereotypes with legs and everything they say and do is predictable.

[Mehrunes]

inb4 you accuse me of photoshopping this or something equally fucking retarded.

I have no need to to such thing. Because as your quote shows, I talked about about what you put in bold (I'll use a larger font size to put emphasis here for obvious reasons).
Here, a quote to make sure you get it:

Weirdly enough, the part you so generously put in bold does not exist on the page you linked.

Now let's go back to your previous post.

Alex was lead world designer, which means he was writing and directing quests and world content, i.e. writing it as the lead designer i.e. the lead writer, there isn't an actual "lead writer" position at Blizzard, and Kosak was only a game designer though I do believe he took over lead world designer/writing for the Firelands patch and beyond(?), but the point being that Metzen was just in a token 'creative development' role, which means he was just OK-ing whatever Alex was coming up with.

Would you look at that, the part about Afrasiabi being Lead World Designer wasn't what you put in bold. I.e. was not what I talked about in what you quoted here. I clearly was talking about you talking about what Afrasiabi's role as Lead World Designer entailed, which, once again, is not supported by your link whatsoever.

As to why I was not talking about Afrasiabi being Lead World Designer, it seems I will need to myself again on that I am perfectly aware that Afrasiabi was Lead World Designer in Cata. Once again, I brought it up before you did:

If I suck at this, there is no word to describe your own performance. Alex Afrasiabi wasn't the lead writer for Cataclysm, Dave Kosak was. Afrasiabi was lead world designer. And was so disjointed from the rest of the writing team that he caused the fuckup with portrayal of Garrosh in Stonetalon you mentioned. Metzen stepping down as the lead narrative designer because of his involvement in other projects at the time does not constitute him not working on Cataclysm. He outright quit Blizzard altogether in 2016 yet was still involved in parts of Battle for Lordaeron in BfA.

So your little picture and vitriol spewing here achieved quite a lot of nothing. Well, nothing productive at least, because it did show that:

You suck ass at this, lol.

So:

Are you ready to just call it quits yet lol.

Jesus Christ lol. You said "Alex isn't the lead writer, he's the lead world designer", which IS THE SAME THING. The Lead World Designer is basically "Lead Writer". Alex wrote all the quests, he fucking outright fucking said in his own fucking words that "Yeah, I wrote that Garrosh questline because I didn't know what the MoP team was up too haha". Like god damn dude how are you this fantastically off the point of my fucking argument it's so fucking sad.

But he didn't say that about MoP team. His Stonelaton Cata quest was already disjointed from the rest of Cata Garrosh. Kinda weird for the main guy responsible for Cata's story :3

Now, are you ready to explain pull out from some dark crevice what a Lead Narrative Designer (which Kosak was) is supposed to be if the Lead World Designer is the lead writer of WoW team?

[McFuu]

What do you mean "current characterization"? Nathanos behaves how he always behaved. He openly treated the players with disdain in Vanilla. He was extremely loyal to Sylvanas in Vanilla. He was cruel and ruthless (over extremely petty shit) in Vanilla.

He treated outsiders with disdain in vanilla, because he was alone and constantly attacked by the Alliance.

His current attitude of jealousy and disdain to the player is incredibly out of character for having such a history as Nathanos. Also being a general of Silverman he would know of proper ways to treat subordinates.
Basically the history of nathanos Marris would make him a formidable foe, who wouldn't be trusting of everyone.
Nathanos Blightcaller, was forward and direct in EPL.
The current jilted, whiney, fuck boy behavior of Nathanos is completely out of context for someone who in life would know what it was like to be dismissed by his contemporaries (only human ranger general, fought hard for that distinction, elves didn't like him because he was better) and in death surrounded by allies of the one elf that knew his worth and went out of her way to free him, she also went out of her way to free the PC as well.

So no, his characterization is different from the epl nathanos. Once you earn his respect in EPL he doesn't treat you negatively anymore. Current Nathanos does, even though he is talking to the same pc that helped him in epl. It's not an accurate characterization of him.

[Deleted]

A human with a hot elf babe - check
Becomes the leader of a different culture - check
Is actually better at the job also without any flaws whatsoever - check

I'm sorry but that just screams atleast Mary Sue to me. This description currently describes:

High Exarch Turalyon
Nathanos Blightcaller
Jaina (although in this case, she dated a 1000 year old dragon lul)
Rhonin
Varian Wrynn
and with the exception of no babe in his sight, Anduin Wrynn

Sure some of these aren't self inserts, but they didn't do the Lightforged Draenei any justice by making a human their leader.

It's better to just play the game from a human PoV, because that's what I intend to do also.

[My User Name]

Sounds like the player character since WoD

[Deleted]

Sounds like the player character since WoD

Where is my hot elf babe?

[matrix123mko]

A human with a hot elf babe - check
Becomes the leader of a different culture - check
Is actually better at the job also without any flaws whatsoever - check

I'm sorry but that just screams atleast Mary Sue to me. This description currently describes:

High Exarch Turalyon
Nathanos Blightcaller
Jaina (although in this case, she dated a 1000 year old dragon lul)
Rhonin
Varian Wrynn
and with the exception of no babe in his sight, Anduin Wrynn

Sure some of these aren't self inserts, but they didn't do the Lightforged Draenei any justice by making a human their leader.

It's better to just play the game from a human PoV, because that's what I intend to do also.

Wasn't Rhonin Dalaranian?

[Deleted]

Wasn't Rhonin Dalaranian?

Goes back in time to save the whole Night Elf race and teach them a thing or two about arcane magic? hmm...

[Faroth]

I wasn't a fan of the revelation of "Oh Vereesa isn't a bitch anymore and also has two Rhoninspawn" from the Three Sisters comic

......you're quite literally years late to the party on this knowledge. The kids have been around a long time now.

[Friendlyimmolation]

......you're quite literally years late to the party on this knowledge. The kids have been around a long time now.

give it a few more years, I'm sure they'll fall down a well or something.

Or Lor'themar will kill them in self defense when they try to bite him or something.

[Mehrunes]

He treated outsiders with disdain in vanilla, because he was alone and constantly attacked by the Alliance.

His current attitude of jealousy and disdain to the player is incredibly out of character for having such a history as Nathanos. Also being a general of Silverman he would know of proper ways to treat subordinates.
Basically the history of nathanos Marris would make him a formidable foe, who wouldn't be trusting of everyone.
Nathanos Blightcaller, was forward and direct in EPL.
The current jilted, whiney, fuck boy behavior of Nathanos is completely out of context for someone who in life would know what it was like to be dismissed by his contemporaries (only human ranger general, fought hard for that distinction, elves didn't like him because he was better) and in death surrounded by allies of the one elf that knew his worth and went out of her way to free him, she also went out of her way to free the PC as well.

So no, his characterization is different from the epl nathanos. Once you earn his respect in EPL he doesn't treat you negatively anymore. Current Nathanos does, even though he is talking to the same pc that helped him in epl. It's not an accurate characterization of him.

If by outsiders you mean "Horde members personally picked by Sylvanas", then sure. And the quest in which we earned his respect still opened up with him calling us worms. That was the last quest (in a long chain with many more similar remarks) so the reason why he didn't treat the player negatively after that quest is because he didn't treat player in any way after this quest. As we have no longer interacted with him afterwards. As such, we couldn't see if his respect resulted in him no longer insulting us or not. And, to my knowledge, he hasn't called us anything as severe as worm or imbecile in Legion or BfA .