MDI curiosity

[dragnipur]

If a team has only 1 rogue like Puolukka why aren't they considering using invisible potions?

[Sentynel]

They don't wanna waste a stat potion question mark

[dragnipur]

Why everyone is playing alliance?

[Deathrange]

Why everyone is playing alliance?

Shadowmeld from Night Elves

[starkey]

Why everyone is playing alliance?

nightelf is Op for shadowmeld

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Also the Orb despawned during Method EU temple run, im willing to bet Blizzard will actually fix it now.

[dragnipur]

I don't like Naguura and the fat comentator.They are not very good at it.She is fine as streamer but that is it.Should have invited FinalBoss.I loved him at Method world first stream.He was awesome.

[Frolk]

Should have had Preach be a caster, with Adam Bay from FinalBoss

[Taeldorian]

I don't like Naguura and the fat comentator.They are not very good at it.She is fine as streamer but that is it.Should have invited fatboss.I loved him at Method world first stream.He was awesome.

Xyronic was fantastic at casting. He analyzed things that others didn’t, got into specifics as to why teams are doing exactly what they’re doing and broke down mistakes really well. For his first time I thought he did really well today.

[dragnipur]

Xyronic was fantastic at casting. He analyzed things that others didn’t, got into specifics as to why teams are doing exactly what they’re doing and broke down mistakes really well. For his first time I thought he did really well today.

Ok he is a little forgiven if it is his 1st time commenting.

[dragnipur]

Will the warrior be the only class tanking this MDI?Last year was just DK this time is a warrior?Blizzard are not good in balance.

[Barzotti]

Will the warrior be the only class tanking this MDI?Last year was just DK this time is a warrior?Blizzard are not good in balance.

Rentari played DK yesterday.
Balance is good overall. Balance is not good for the 0,01% of the best players in a 5 man competitive setting.

[dragnipur]

Rentari played DK yesterday.
Balance is good overall. Balance is not good for the 0,01% of the best players in a 5 man competitive setting.

damn i missed it then.

[Barzotti]

damn i missed it then.

You didn't miss much, his team's run was clean but he lost because the dps difference between him and the warrior tank he faced was ridiculous.

[Marrilaife]

Will the warrior be the only class tanking this MDI?Last year was just DK this time is a warrior?Blizzard are not good in balance.

Didn't double rogue give it away already? When a class is so good you'd rather get 2 of them than any else that could bring something unique to the table?

Anyway imo they should change the rules to enforce some class diversity, like bans or you can't use same class x times in series, I said in in some other m+ / MDI thread, it's becoming boring to watch when nearly every team is the same comp.

Blizzard might try to balance specs about single target dps but then they don't care about things like aoe or cleave having humongous differences between classes. So yeah, we need aoe in m+ = outlaw rogue / prot warrior fiesta. You need multi dot = situation like in BODA raid spriests, locks and boomkins are above every other class.

And yes, prot warrior isn't "fine" when you see tank competing with dps classes on pulls, and these dps classes are already cherry picked to be the best for dps in that scenario, you could say it's fine if tank outdpses a dps if it's a weak aoe class like affli lock (even though in my opinion creating dps specs with weak / no aoe is silly and a problem on its own), but when it holds ground against strong dps classes and does similar dps to them, that's just lame.

And yes, one team used blood dk and they lost the dps race even though the other team had more deaths overall. All it has proven was that it's not worth to play any other tank except warr.

[Eggroll]

I'm curious why MMO-C isn't frontpaging the MDI, though... mods? anyone?

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Anyway imo they should change the rules to enforce some class diversity, like bans or you can't use same class x times in series, I said in in some other m+ / MDI thread, it's becoming boring to watch when nearly every team is the same comp.

I like the idea of a rule like can't use same class x times. Would certainly spice things up

[Daan]

M+ balance is a big joke now and Blizzard doesn't even care.

[Tojara]

Xyronic was actually fine at casting, one of the best ones there IMO.

Invisibility potions have too much of a downside. They are inferior to shroud in every single way, and also lock you out of combat potions for 5 minutes. You wouldn't think this is a big deal but not being able to use speed potions or combat potions pretty much ruins some strategies that a lot of these teams used.

MDI format allowing one class/race swap per match was actually pretty welcome, but it's too bad that the class balance is so rigid at the moment that any team opting to do this generally lost. If you want a good highlight of this, the King's Rest with the Blood DK is a pretty good example of the discrepancy in tank DPS. The team with the Blood DK did a few pulls that were far more risky and for the most part had a cleaner run, but still lost because of the difference in DPS between the two teams (the other team even had to wait for their resto druid to run all the way back because he ran off the side of the bridge by mistake).

As far as shifting the meta up from a tanking perspective, it's not nearly as bad as it looks. Tank variance could easily be solved if Blizzard decided to close the gap (whether it be by buffing or nerfing, or meeting somewhere in the middle) on tank DPS. Healing and DPS meta on the other hand are far more difficult to break however. On the healing side Druids just have far more utility than any other healer in dungeon content. The DPS role is probably the most difficult to break because melee versus range is inherently skewed based on design philosophy alone. BFA dungeons have a way higher requirement on interrupts and disruption, which outside of elemental shaman zero other range actually posses. Add in the necessary requirement of shroud of concealment, and the only way you see more range is if their DPS is absolutely above and beyond everything else. Demonology fell into this category but was promptly nerfed several weeks after.

I found it odd that the engineering combat rezzes weren't allowed, yet scrolls and drums were allowed.

[Hypasonic]

I'm kinda out of the loop when it comes to high m+ teams and such, but I do find it odd when I see groups using the standard meta of protwar/r.druid/double rogue....and then elemental shaman. I mean sure, ele is decent, but is it really better than a monk in that setting, given the fact the monk is increasing the already high prot wars dps aswell as the rogues and druids also?

But as I said, I dont pay much attention to high keys or the like, so I could be missing something specific to a certain dungeon where shamans excel in etc.

I guess earthquake is pretty strong (as an interupt)

[Tojara]

Well clearly elemental shaman wasn't enough. They still won some games, but when it came down to it, they lost.

Losing out on 5% physical damage from the monk adds up, so the only way an elemental shaman makes up for it is by playing with their kit. Shaman in general have the best interrupt in the game, occasional knockdowns from earthquake, pretty absurd AoE damage, and impressive ST damage (which if you play around with 2-3 targets, can be really amazing, you see this in Freehold with them opting to proc the turtle reaping so he could keep flameshocks up and pump into the boss). Primal earth elemental is also really nice too.

In the end it still wasn't enough though. I actually don't mind if teams have mirror setups on a particular map, but it's a little sad that it was nearly the same composition for every dungeon. Had they had the rule of allowing one swap per dungeon in place for the Legion MDI, you probably would have seen teams take advantage of that more (prot paladin/warrior for Upper Karazhan possibly, mages for BRH, warlocks for Arcway/Cathedral).

[Marrilaife]

Tank variance could easily be solved if Blizzard decided to close the gap (whether it be by buffing or nerfing, or meeting somewhere in the middle) on tank DPS.

Tbh I would use prot paladin as a point of balancing tank dps, it's decent, but not op. So basically nerf warrior and buff everyone else remaining: dk, monk, druid, dh to the paladin level. Then you would have the question which tank provides better utility.

Warrior would still be strong with spell reflect cheese that would be on top of their damage (i.e. they should be nerfed to the point they're competitive without spell reflecting for dps, but not broken op as now competing with dps on damage, and still be able to get juicy spell reflects). Also providing battle shout, aoe stun, aoe fear, ability to break fear on himself, second stun single target if talented, etc.

DK would have usual mass grip / combat rez / control undead.

Monk has ring of peace, physical debuff, aoe stun, paralyze, teleport etc.

DH has magic debuff, prison, silence sigil... still I think their defensive cds would need some work on top of it.

Druid would have combat rez, stampeding roar, ursol's vortex, remove enrage, stun or typhoon. However I think frenzied regen needs a big buff for druids to be comparable to warrior / dk / paladin. Either reduce cd a lot, or increase the healed amount a lot. Otherwise it doesn't compare to ignore pain, light of the protector or dk healing (yes dks do most healing but also take most damage). Also make poison dispel work in bear form for guardians (you could leave it out for other specs for pvp reasons) so it's equal to monk / paladin.

And paladin has bubble, bop, freedom, sac, lay on hands, extra interrupts, etc.

So every tank has some utility, but the damage and survivability needs balancing. Druid / dh need survivability buff, nearly every tank needs a dps buff and warrior needs a nerf.