200k-250k Players: Classic Wow Numbers - North America Only

[Barzotti]

No, claiming classic has more than retail is at least a reasonable guess that you can indicate by some 3rd party sources. Both claims are not equally dumb, one is likely the other is unlikely. This doesn't mean either of them is correct, just that if you had to pick it would be the likely choice, don't you think

If someone doesn't have anything to back up his claims (hard data provided by Blizzard) and relies on indirect, partial data that you can't connect to the number of players in game (reddit, MMO-C, twitch), it's wishful thinking at best and dishonesty at worst. You can use 3rd party sources if it's at least connected to the game (like wowprogress for the number of guilds who downed boss X for example).

[Frozenbro]

Classic vs Retail "debate" is probably as toxic as political "debate" at this point

There should be no debate at all thats the funny part, classic lvling > retail lvling, retail endgame pve > classic endgame pve, thats all there is to it.

[kenn9530]

No, claiming classic has more than retail is at least a reasonable guess that you can indicate by some 3rd party sources. Both claims are not equally dumb, one is likely the other is unlikely. This doesn't mean either of them is correct, just that if you had to pick it would be the likely choice, don't you think?

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It's likely classic has more, and less likely retail has more. The end.

actually retail has never lost any of its players, anyone playing classic will still pop onto retail even if its just to do the basic stuff, and as time passes more and more who have tried classic will just stop completely as the time investment is just too much for what you get out of it.

[lollerlaban]

Last time it was computed retail subs fell below 3m.
Classic broke 1m and is climbing FAST.

Wouldn't be surprised if Classic beats out retail during Phase 2.

How is it climbing fast when queues are dropping overall?

I think the most laughable part is you expecting the overall population to increase. I've got news for you, sweetheart

[Qnubi]

If someone doesn't have anything to back up his claims (hard data provided by Blizzard) and relies on indirect, partial data that you can't connect to the number of players in game (reddit, MMO-C, twitch), it's wishful thinking at best and dishonesty at worst. You can use 3rd party sources if it's at least connected to the game (like wowprogress for the number of guilds who downed boss X for example).

"bla bla uninteresting"

Actually let's just skip this assuming part. What would you say if Classic had more? And what would say if Retail has more? That's what is really interesting to me. Is there something you would say or point out? Would you be shocked, surprised or even angry or sad? This is what I actually want to know. The rest is meaningless to me.

[Barzotti]

It doesn't matter to me either way, both options are viable and possible and your and my conclusion are gut feeling based on 3rd party data. I chose that option since it's at least SOME evidence. What evidence do you have? You claim retail has more, what data can you provide that shows it could have more?

I'd like you to show me when I claimed Retail has more players than Classic.

[munkeyinorbit]

Must be a huge eye opener for Blizzard.
15 year old game out pacing it's retail version of the game...

Blizzard had the formula right the first time around, now it's time to continue it!
All blizzard needs to do is add some epic raid mechanics and new dungeons/raids/zones without doing a raising of lvls.

Classic must live on!

If we take blizzard as the authority on numbers then what you are saying is a big ask. Let's say 1m is true. Blizzard expects the population to decrease 90%. This has 2 questions. And without shitting on retail, answer honestly.

1. Where will those 900k subscribers come from and where will they go?

2. Is 100k players really enough to justify basing content on Classic as it stands?

I'm only one person with a list of 50 friends. Out of my friends 1 has come back specifically for Classic. 4 others have switched to classic for one reason or another bit still play BfA. 5 are BFA exclusive and the rest have not come back at all. Using myself, there is definitely a drop in people playing wow which I assume is because BFA is bad. But the majority of people who do play classic still play BfA.

I think that those 900k will go back to BFA and I do not think that 100k is enough new subscribers to justify new content. But it's ok if I'm wrong because the main thing is that there are definitely more people playing wow than this time 2 weeks ago and that's cool.

[Qnubi]

I'd like you to show me when I claimed Retail has more players than Classic.

I have edited my post, I have a more pressing matter at hand I'd like to have answered.

[Barzotti]

"bla bla uninteresting"

Actually let's just skip this assuming part. What would you say if Classic had more? And what would say if Retail has more? That's what is really interesting to me. Is there something you would say or point out? Would you be shocked, surprised or even angry or sad? This is what I actually want to know. The rest is meaningless to me.

What would I say? Nothing. People like Classic? Go on, enjoy your game! Same goes for Retail. I like WoW no matter the versions of the game, and both versions help funding the game I like.

But drawing definitive conclusions (not against you in particular, but we've read plenty of them in those forums the last few days) only one week after release and without any hard data is disingenuous.

[Frozenbro]

Is there something you would say or point out? Would you be shocked, surprised or even angry or sad? This is what I actually want to know. The rest is meaningless to me.

It's meaningless to me too, i dont care if classic or retail has more players, cause to me retail has and will always have the superior raid experience and thats what i enjoy.

[Tojara]

First off there's no official numbers. Secondly, why don't we wait a bit to see whose still around in a couple of months. Whether or not it's 15 years old doesn't really mean a damn thing, this things been hyped for like a decade now, so of course there's going to be huge interest in it.

The game has evolved over the years whether people like it or not. Implementing live features into classic would be met with resistance, just like implementing classic features into live does. The amount of autistic screeching over flying being removed every expansion is about the same amount of screeching you hear from super die hard classic enthusiasts when they find out there's a couple spots of grass in Mulgore that look a bit better than it did in the original.

I love both games for different reasons. If I want challenging raid content I'm going to hit M+ hard for the first month or two of a new patch, and do mythic raiding on live. Classic is much more chill, the leveling is 'challenging', and it certainly had that world feel. The PvE content being easy isn't really a deterrent to me, and only super naive people could claim that it's anything but easy. If you want to play classic because you expect super hard PvE content, you're going to be pretty disappointed. Again, not the reason I love it. Would still prefer classic raids over normal/LFR and maybe even heroic difficulty on the live version of the game.

I'd never want them to change live in response to classic. Vanilla being changed is a direct response from an evolving and breathing MMO. No matter what they do, people are going to be pissed off with changes and we just have to accept it. Be thankful there are different versions of the game available so that you can pick your flavour without having to shit all over what somebody else might like.

[WowClassic]

Fuck off we can all see that Classic is destroying retail.
WoW broke a fucking twitch record over LoL and fortnite after 15 years of release and not by any new expansions.
No the good old 2004 WoW did it. Like it broke records in 2004, it still breaks fucking records today.

Thinking retail is better then classic is just stupid.
PvP/PvE is probably in general better in Retail but everything outside of that, what made WoW... well WOW...
is FAR better in classic

And to think this is only PHASE 1. Once we get the pvp systems, big boy raids and sick ass tier sets this game is going to blow retail out of the water.

If you don't think Blizz is going to make retail more like Classic you are dumb at this point.

[Frozenbro]

If you don't think Blizz is going to make retail more like Classic you are dumb at this point.

They could make the lvling experience of retail meaningful like it is in classic, but thats about it, dont dare to touch retail raiding to make it retarded mode like classic.

[Estravolt]

And to think this is only PHASE 1. Once we get the pvp systems, big boy raids and sick ass tier sets this game is going to blow retail out of the water.

If you don't think Blizz is going to make retail more like Classic you are dumb at this point.

Can I quote you when naxx gets destroyed in 2 hours from release?

[iDruid]

And to think this is only PHASE 1. Once we get the pvp systems, big boy raids and sick ass tier sets this game is going to blow retail out of the water.

If you don't think Blizz is going to make retail more like Classic you are dumb at this point.

No. Everybody who thinks this is a Classic versus retail zero sum game are the ones who are less than aware of whats going on.
Retail will not be made more like Classic and one is not better than the other, nor is one killing the other.

Blizzard made it one subscription and planned a phased approach to Classic content because they look at it as one product. Some will play only one, but most will play both. You will see a retail patch followed by a classic phase, and then a retail patch, etc... The popularity will swing back and forth and it will allow them to gap content in each by giving something new in both worlds in alternating cycles.

[WowClassic]

They could make the lvling experience of retail meaningful like it is in classic, but thats about it, dont dare to touch retail raiding to make it retarded mode like classic.

Much more than that, classes will be overhauled to be Classic like, where class identity is more important than spec identity. Talent system overhaul most likely. Expect lot of QoL to be removed as well. Retail will basically be classic with modern graphics, otherwise it will die. Sad!

[lollerlaban]

And to think this is only PHASE 1. Once we get the pvp systems, big boy raids and sick ass tier sets this game is going to blow retail out of the water.

If you don't think Blizz is going to make retail more like Classic you are dumb at this point.

Can you guys stop thinking that phase 2 will attract more people, it won't.

[Frozenbro]

Much more than that, classes will be overhauled to be Classic like, where class identity is more important than spec identity. Talent system overhaul most likely. Expect lot of QoL to be removed as well. Retail will basically be classic with modern graphics, otherwise it will die. Sad!

Well your name already shows that you are a troll, but ill bite anyway, classic has nothing to give to retail aside from the lvling experience, they wont turn retail into this trash https://clips.twitch.tv/ShakingFroze...zWwD1QJ3t92uC8

[Xjev]

As of right now there are 14 servers released for Classic.
Each server has been classified as medium/high/full.

Herod is expected to have a 10k+ queue. Based on pure speculation, Herod has 40,000 players on it.

Let's say on average, each server has 15k players registered to it.
With the 14 servers released as of today, we're talking about 210k players.

Within a 32.2222222222%, repeating of course, degree of confidence; I say classic wow has 200-250k players as of today.

The good news, according to blizzard a "low" tag as of today is more players then the highest population servers of vanilla. (5k population).
We're getting the classic experience in less then a week!

That's a wild guess for concurrent number of players, that are logged in at the same time.

[Revamp Man]

Classic vs Retail "debate" is probably as toxic as political "debate" at this point

And just as pointless