Thunderfury to MT or Rogue?

[Puupi]

Fury warrior.

[Bigbazz]

Unless a hunter is up there doing melee attacks, the proc will never happen for him. All melee weapon procs require you to do a melee attack. This includes proc enchants like Crusader. Not sure if you were talking about the proc for the rogue or the hunter.



I fully agree with this. There's absolutely no reason a rogue should use this since there are tons of other weapons out there that are better for a rogue during vanilla.



The reason for tanks using it even on the Illidan fight was not for the proc that did damage or lowered the target's resistance to nature spells. The reason that tanks used it was for the reduced attack speed by 20%. It was an amazing proc after attack speed debuffs were nerfed. Not sure you were even aware of that particular debuff. But yes there were tons of main tanks in high end raiding guilds including Nihlium that used TF all throughout BT.

This is just not correct.

 Patch 1.9.0(3-January-2006): The attack speed slowing effect from Thunderfury has been reduced to 20%, and no longer stacks with other such effects such as Thunderclap. The rate at which the weapon procs has also been lowered.

TF debuff doesn't stack with Thunderclap, and if you have a dps optimised raid group you're effectively threat limiting your raid by using a TF because its single target threat output is lower than a TBC blue. The best thing about TF in Vanilla was the threat output, but the weapon was nerfed serveral times already in Vanilla, with the proc threat being nerfed at the start of TBC it put the nail in the coffin.


Check out this Nostalrius thread on the topic of Thunderfury Nerfs

https://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=703

[Aphrel]

This guy gets it. Think of all the exposure the guild would get. Find a way to market that. Make real money from it

was a paladin guildmaster in a relativly casual guild on stormscale-eu back in vanilla that had tf.
Not sure how he pulled that off without causing a G-disband.

[Astalnar]

Always go with the tank.

[vsb]

Main tank.

Or you will not have Main tank anymore.

[msdos]

Doesn't a rogue in the best gear possible want slow weapons? Aren't they technically gimping themselves if they use TF or does the proc do a lot of dmg or something?

Lol@giving them a weapon that would gimp their dmg output.

[Kaver]

Should Thunderfury go to the MT or a Rogue in the raid?

Always to the Main Tank (and I’m a Rogue).

Making sure the Main Tank generates as much threat as possible is alfa omega. More main tank threat means the WHOLE raid can dps more.

[avitush]

MT first.

You would _maybe_ give it to a DPS first if you don't have a reliable enough MT to feel comfortable giving said MT Thunderfury. But giving it to your MT will generally benefit the raid far more. Warriors can put out absurd amounts of threat with that thing.

[Caperfin]

You kinda contradict yourself when you say "it's for people who can't manage their threat", and then "players shouldn't come close to a warrior's threat" in the next sentence - the entire point of DPS at a high level was to push as close to the 130% (for ranged) and 110% (for melee) threshold for pulling aggro as possible without actually doing it.

Let me rephrase. Tfury is a solution for bad players in guilds who can't manage their threat. In a good guild, tfury is "overkill" since players should already be managing their threat well.

Naturally, im not accounting for worldfist/progression that's an entirely different topic.

[m4xc4v413r4]

There is no reason for a Rogue to need Thunderfury, it's a tank weapon.



This isn't accurate at all, Thunderfury was nerfed in TBC and was not worth using beyond Karazhan. The rare person who still used it in TBC was mostly using it for status, not because it was good. If the proc had not been nerfed then it would have only been used because Warriors still had no AOE threat capability in TBC, still replaced on bosses by higher damage weapons with better stats.

Don't forget the base damage on Thunderfury is low even by Vanilla standards, the proc is the only reason it's used. With that said, Thunderfury is not even a BIS Rogue weapon in Vanilla, if you did have it then you would be replacing it with a Vanilla weapon, not a level 70 blue.

BS. I didn't know any tank that had one that didn't use it all the way to Black Temple.

[AeneasBK]

Doesn't a rogue in the best gear possible want slow weapons? Aren't they technically gimping themselves if they use TF or does the proc do a lot of dmg or something?

Lol@giving them a weapon that would gimp their dmg output.

I was lead to believe this too, although the topic is clearly still up for debate re: "What is the best rogue DPS spec" - I was lead to believe it's Combat Swords, and that you need a slow MH for that and as a rogue you'd find better DPS from Viskag off Onyxia than using Thunderfury.

But I'm not claiming that as truth, I'm interested what experienced rogues might have to say about it...

- - - Updated - - -

No good tank is going to feel good about watching their dps stop attacking because they don't want to pull threat.

For horde guilds without Salvation it's going to turn Vael from a frustrating fight into a complete cheese

[Schattenlied]

so much so was the reverse true that you NEEDED Tricks of the Trade and Misdirects to keep aggro

Considering we had neither of those in our raid at the time, I'm gonna say, no.

[Caperfin]

Managing threat for most classes means stopping their dps.

Nope, we've learned plenty of threat diminishing notions over the years: vanish, LIP, BoP, etc... and have improved tank threat: fury tanking, potion threat, etc...

[GreenJesus]

I heard it was more for holding aggro than for DPS right?

[Caperfin]

But I'm not claiming that as truth, I'm interested what experienced rogues might have to say about it...

It will depend on the proc chance and what tfury gets triggered by and also if it can be increased by some obscure stuff like PI or damage potions.

[Caperfin]

Only rogues can vanish and LIP/BoP are panic tools for when someone has overtaken the tank in threat when the best solution is to not overtake the tank in threat which those don't help you do.

Gee wonder what way you can improve tank threat. Hmm maybe by giving them Thunderfury?

What you are saying is that the best solution is for dps not to overtake tank threat in the first place? Well, this is exactly what doesn't happen in good guilds because everyone is playing optimally. Players would need to screw up to start approaching tank threat.
Idk if you've seen my previous post but I suggested tfury for new guilds and progression otherwise your are just trying to solve a non-issue (threat) and the weapon could be given to a rogue

P.S. LIP/BOP, etc... are merely solutions for those rare mess ups involving threat/aggro.

[Ange]

You give it to rogues after you've gotten at least 2 for your tanks.

Not giving legendarys to the most helpful raidguild member will get every guild what they deserve - the BEST and OPTIMAL class with TF will leave the guild for a better one and nobody should be even mad at those players.

The only funny thing about this, that nothing will be learned from it.

[Caperfin]

Well until Naxx is cleared every raiding guild is a progression guild. Giving it to a rogue is a dumb idea when it comes to what benefits the raid. The dps a rogue gains from wielding TF in their OH isn't going to be noticeable in a 40man raiding guild where you have 20 other dps. You'd also have to subtract the dps bonus a tank would get from using it from that rogue's dps to actually see how much dps your raid has gained. Then if any dps class(aka Warlocks) has to pause their dps that's dps that could've been gained if the tank had TF instead of the stupid rogue.

You give it to rogues after you've gotten at least 2 for your tanks.

A progression guild is a guild doing content that has yet to be done for them in that content patch. After that the content becomes farm. I see no point for a warrior to receive tfury at the point when stuff goes on farm.

As pointed out in earlier posts, I don't even advocate for the weapon to go to a dps rogue but a Rogue Tank.

[Caperfin]

That's a dumb way to look at progression. You're gearing up because you want to be able to do the next raid that comes out so you're progressing towards that. Otherwise you'd just stop raiding after you've killed Ragnaros.

Rogue tanks are terrible but if you want to be a hipster go ahead and try to be one.

A guild's progression stops after content is cleared. Then comes farming ced content until the next patch and the whole process restarts again. I'm not saying anything revolutionary. I am in fact a Rogue Raid Tank and they're far from perfect but a fun way to help with the trivialisation of the game.

[zhero]

A single vanish makes that a non issue.

Edit:

To answer the question of OP though, it's much more valuable for your tank.

never bank your non-issues on a 5 minute cooldown