new forsaken leader spoilers

[Mardux]

Ooooh Nooooo, The Forsaken actually get to grow as a faction and have a new identity outside of its tyrannical ruler? The Horror!!

I don't care if its Voss or Calia, I just want to see the forsaken given a bloody chance to grow outside of the same leader whos been making them follow the same grotesque path since WC3.

Grow as a faction? When blizzard makes them alliance (which is what will happen once they give them to Anduin’s and the Naa’ru’s new baby Calia), they are going to end be just like nelves. A token punching bag, just like They are now. Whole lot of growth potential there.

[Atticon]

And every Forsaken player cried out in horror.

Not me. It's going too fast, and half of the story being in the BfA prequel novel makes that even worse (as well as Lilian Voss' off-screen character development prior to BfA). But it's what makes sense for the Forsaken's story arc. The only alternative is them all dwindling/being killed off after making everyone their enemy.

Having Menethil rulers is why they became the Forsaken. This is tone-deaf idiocy by Blizzard.

[Mardux]

Finally the forsaken have a real, rightful Menethil ruler, as it should be.

Yeah. Cuz having a Menathil leader turned out so great last time.

[tromage2]

to fight against n'zoth?

Under the Alliance. we of the Horde only need footsoldiers to serve the almighty Alliance.

[Nnyco]

Just what we need another horde faction leader that scuffles after anduin.

[Muxtar]

I hope we get new faction where Sylvannas is leader so I can leave this bullshit with Aliance-ish Horde.

This very much. Or I will stop logging in retail even for quests. This stuff has just become total shitshow.

[Malikath]

RIP Forsaken. Enjoy being humans with a skin condition.

that's exactly what they've always been.

[Stormdash]

Not me. It's going too fast, and half of the story being in the BfA prequel novel makes that even worse (as well as Lilian Voss' off-screen character development prior to BfA). But it's what makes sense for the Forsaken's story arc. The only alternative is them all dwindling/being killed off after making everyone their enemy.

You skipped a Menethil king, fam.

[Makorus]

WoW Community: We hate Sylvanas she's bad and a bad leader! We need someone else.

What the WoW Community actually wants: Bylvanas (Pretty much Sylvanas but has a different name).

[Stormdash]

There is literally no reason to even keep the name Forsaken at this point.

[Timotei]

I'd rather burn all the cities in the world and go to hell with Sylvanas than accepting asspulled Artha's sister as leader of the Forsaken.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Blizz writers need a collar that zaps them every time they write honor at this point.

[Super Dickmann]

Not me. It's going too fast, and half of the story being in the BfA prequel novel makes that even worse (as well as Lilian Voss' off-screen character development prior to BfA). But it's what makes sense for the Forsaken's story arc. The only alternative is them all dwindling/being killed off after making everyone their enemy.

On the off chance you're not taking the piss, explain why you find Calia a preferable alternative to either Voss or a Council-setup of established Forsaken characters (Lydon, Belmont etc.). Not whether she's inevitable, since she is, but why you think that's somehow superior to the prior two setups. Or even to the whole race defecting with Sylvanas and becoming WPVP targets and quest mobs.

All I am saying is: Have a bit of patience, allow the characters to actually be introduced before you rip them to shreds. I mean with this kind of attitude do you actually expect anyone to take this playerbase seriously? If you want to influence the writers and devs of Blizzard to actually change things the playerbase should be more constructive and less "bad writing, lol, Blizzard so stupid" (which I know you, Dickmann, are trying to be, most others are not).

Also I maintain that Calia as leader of the Forsaken could be a completely valid and interesting character. That she does not fit the picture you build from past quests only underlines the point I made above. Things change, otherwise the game world becomes stale.

I don't know why you're using the fact that new lore trumps old lore as a gotcha. I'm well aware that BTS and now BFA negate everything that occurred prior and take precedence. Therein lies the entire problem. What BTS and BFA have produced is pure garbage. I don't need to wait and see when it comes to Calia, I've already waited and saw and Blizzard have not been subtle. Every problem with Calia heretofore mentioned in this thread is not only currently being realized but was already called out and explained way back when BTS took place.

Change has no inherent value. It can be good or bad. This for instance is change for the worse - it's not progression because to even take place it had to eschew elements in Cataclysm to now transplant these positives into their newly created pet character, such as the embrace of Lordaeronian identity. It does not open 'new' avenues because the exact same experience is catered to were you to roll human or worgen or what have you, and the previous experience - that is the experience marketed and in existence for fifteen years is absent. The only one this has appeal to is people who previously did not have an interest in the Forsaken while those who did are the ones who lose the most out of it. I hope someone does genuinely like this garbage, if only so that I can buy that it existed as anything other than a purely destructive exercise.

As for having an impact, I just post shit on an internet forum, no one here is individually going to have any impact on Blizzard. The one thing that did have impact was not cultured criticism but outrage over the night elves getting shafted and over being stuck with Saurfang, which produced changes in 8.1 and bore out into at least three quests of actual content in 8.2.5. That is what got them moving. Waiting and seeing got us this.

[Friendlyimmolation]

There is literally no reason to even keep the name Forsaken at this point.

The full name was Forsaken of hugs.

[Stormdash]

WoW Community: We hate Sylvanas she's bad and a bad leader! We need someone else.

What the WoW Community actually wants: Bylvanas (Pretty much Sylvanas but has a different name).

They wanted the "what are we if not slaves to this torment?" Sylvanas they kept insisting to Blizzard and anyone who would listen that they saw - the one that was permanently broken and isolated from her people and her past, driven by vengeance but tempered by sorrow, etc. The one they kept insisting was really in there no matter how hard Blizzard pushed the character toward mustache-twirling villainy.

I think Blizzard could have smartly basically turned Delaryn into that character, but... nope, the point of Blizzard's writing of Horde storylines is "what will make the most Alliance reaction channels nod in thoughtful approval?"

[Rhlor]

[Deferionus]

Voss I can almost understand (she's been part of the forsaken lore for a bit via the starting zone, horde rogue order hall, and the war campaign), but if they force Calia, who has zero connection to the forsaken, down our throats I am done with this game. Light undead are the antithesis of the forsaken.

Her connection predates World of Warcraft when the Menethil crown ruled Lordaeron. She is the rightful heir. The forsaken are the same people her family ruled over.

[Makorus]

They wanted the "what are we if not slaves to this torment?" Sylvanas they kept insisting to Blizzard and anyone who would listen that they saw - the one that was permanently broken and isolated from her people and her past, driven by vengeance but tempered by sorrow, etc. The one they kept insisting was really in there no matter how hard Blizzard pushed the character toward mustache-twirling villainy.

I think Blizzard could have smartly basically turned Delaryn into that character, but... nope, the point of Blizzard's writing of Horde storylines is "what will make the most Alliance reaction channels nod in thoughtful approval?"

So a character with no development who might as well not exist because the character people want is paper-thin?

The reason WoWs lore stagnates so fucking much is because every time Blizzard tries to do anything with any character, people rage like man children that they should not change the status quo. All they want is the same old characters of Thrall, Sylvanas and Arthas, with no chances to their character.

[Super Dickmann]

They wanted the "what are we if not slaves to this torment?" Sylvanas they kept insisting to Blizzard and anyone who would listen that they saw - the one that was permanently broken and isolated from her people and her past, driven by vengeance but tempered by sorrow, etc. The one they kept insisting was really in there no matter how hard Blizzard pushed the character toward mustache-twirling villainy.

I think Blizzard could have smartly basically turned Delaryn into that character, but... nope, the point of Blizzard's writing of Horde storylines is "what will make the most Alliance reaction channels nod in thoughtful approval?"

Delaryn is unironically more of a Forsaken character than Calia, what with basically having Sylvanas' exact backstory. She has no cultural connection to Calia whatsoever - not religious, not racial, not in terms of history. The notion that she needs Calia to give her hope, whatever that buzzword means, is preposterous.

As for Sylvanas, she isn't the reason the Forsaken are so gutted. They could've had Sylvanas bail on the Forsaken and if you didn't have BTS you'd still have a strong foundation to keep going. Making the Forsaken a bunch of saddo victims of Sylvanas who humanity always wanted to be friends with and who are actually perfectly compatible with the Light gutted the race. Having them develop from a personality cult of one queen to actively seeking out to be the personality cult of another because they're unable to solve their own problems in 8.3 is the finishing blow.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Her connection predates World of Warcraft when the Menethil crown ruled Lordaeron. She is the rightful heir. The forsaken are the same people her family ruled over.

The Forsaken are the same people the way the orcs are still the blood crazed demon worshippers in the first invasion

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Delaryn is unironically more of a Forsaken character than Calia, what with basically having Sylvanas' exact backstory. She has no cultural connection to Calia whatsoever - not religious, not racial, not in terms of history. The notion that she needs Calia to give her hope, whatever that buzzword means, is preposterous.

Even in death night elves can’t escape being taught by humans dear god