Elements of classic paladin class to be implemented in retail

[threads]

just give me wrath ret back and delete combo points already.

[Aleax]

simply stay classic if u want classic paladin

This.

Though I miss Blessings for all specs, and maybie Auras.

I would be ok with the return of a simple Blessing of Might for all specs just to buff guards against hostile PCs (all specs).

Auras? I think they made them bad since the start because I am sure they thought Auras affect too much people at once, so they made it bad for that... Realizing that they had little use, they killed Auras... That being said I miss a single Aura against Fear (Unyielding Faith was so, so bad). And maybie, a devotion aura, affecting NPCs too.

But if auras come back they should not be pathetic... They should be a reason to bring a paladin in RBG for example.

Seals? I miss Seal of justice, in its last iteration, not the classic one. Was able to slow any PCs, on their mounts too, and Flag carriers in BG including Druids because it was reapplied automatically if dispelled. Priceless.

The other Seals, I don't miss them, I think that in their last iterations, Devs absolutely tried to make them bring something, and they tried hard. In return Seals brought so less that they were deleted by the devs.

Anyhow, I am not that much of a fan of the paladin iteration right now. I miss a 1H+shield Shockadin dps style. I don't miss the classic paladin mecanics and spells overall, +I want a brainstorming for the current paladin.

[Jamie081]

As sadistic as it sounds, I actually miss auto attacks doing a big chunk of ret damage. It felt so satisfying when you landed a crit and got Vengeance which made your hands glow white.

[Elkas]

As sadistic as it sounds, I actually miss auto attacks doing a big chunk of ret damage. It felt so satisfying when you landed a crit and got Vengeance which made your hands glow white.

Vengeance's mechanics and crits have nothing to do with auto attacks.

[Jamie081]

Vengeance's mechanics and crits have nothing to do with auto attacks.

https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=20049/vengeance

Vengeance Rank 1
Requires Paladin (Retribution)
Gives you a 3% bonus to Physical and Holy damage you deal for 8 sec after dealing a critical strike from a weapon swing, spell, or ability.

Since when?

[Velerios]

Divine Intervention - I miss this spell too, but I know that it was needed to be removed in the classic-version of it: since you could actually trivialize some content with Divine Intervention. This would neede to be changed so that you can't cancel it mid combat; and in instances you get teleported to a save-spot; something that blizzard can predict.

Seals and Judgment yes, that should come back: BUT NOT AS IN CLASSIC: recasting a seal every 30 seconds was stupid: make them buffs that stays 1 Hour; but make them viable to be switched around for different reasons. Blessings: I like more buffs in the game: Hated it when they removed every buff in the game: only good thing about BfA-Class design is that my priest can now cast Fortitude again.

Auras does not make a lot of sense in a world where damage-resistance do not exist. But hey, maybe something totally new here would be nice.

Still: we need more buffs, and paladin should have the most of them (as should shamans have them with their totems too (but not the same)). And what we DEFINITIVELY DON'T NEED IS TO HAVE SEAL OF CASINO FROM CLASSIC BACK. Paladin in Classic was a crapfest, and if you want to play vanilla-paladin: play vanilla/classic/whatever.

[Elkas]

https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=20049/vengeance

Vengeance Rank 1
Requires Paladin (Retribution)
Gives you a 3% bonus to Physical and Holy damage you deal for 8 sec after dealing a critical strike from a weapon swing, spell, or ability.

Since when?

Since the tooltip states it triggers from everything that can crit.

You stated that triggering vengeance was the reason "why" it was awesome having your main damage come from auto attacks. The way vengeance works however, has nothing to do with *just* auto attacks, making your stated "awesome reason" very questionable.

[DotEleven]

Since that tooltip states it triggers from everything that can crit. Your reason why having your main damage come from auto attacks to then "proc vengeance" is a pointless argument.

He never said main damage. He said doing a huge chunk of damage (while critting with the auto-attack) was satisfying.

You're the one who then claimed

Vengeance's mechanics and crits have nothing to do with auto attacks.

While then being shown that it also does it from a weapon swing and as such did have something to do with auto-attacks even if it did also have something to do with other spells and ablities.

[SIKELOL]

really bad systems for years and now this, wtf.

[Jamie081]

Since the tooltip states it triggers from everything that can crit.

You stated that triggering vengeance was the reason "why" it was awesome having your main damage come from auto attacks. The way vengeance works however, has nothing to do with *just* auto attacks, making your stated "awesome reason" very questionable.

I didn't say it was from JUST autoattacks, I said the autoattack crits doing big damage and proccing vengeance were what I enjoyed. You completely misunderstood what I said then corrected me by being wrong anyway, twice.

[Elkas]

I didn't say it was from JUST autoattacks, I said the autoattack crits doing big damage and proccing vengeance were what I enjoyed. You completely misunderstood what I said then corrected me by being wrong anyway, twice.

No I perfectly understood you. It's just that your link with vengeance and white damage makes no sense.

(Nor does the "big white crits" you said in that post just now, since those are still in retail.)

[Jamie081]

No I perfectly understood you. It's just that your link with vengeance and white damage makes no sense.

Vengeance can proc from autoattack crits and I said I like that. You obviously didn't understand me at all or even Vengeance for that matter.

I didn't say that it procs ONLY from autoattacks, that was what you said when you were putting words in my mouth.

(Nor does the "big white crits" you said in that post just now, since those are still in retail.)

Your reading comprehension is terrible, I haven't said big white crits anywhere.

[Elkas]

Vengeance can proc from autoattack crits and I said I like that. You obviously didn't understand me at all or even Vengeance for that matter.

I didn't say that it procs ONLY from autoattacks, that was what you said when you were putting words in my mouth.

Your first initial statement implied that you did link them together. You even defended your point of view by highlighting that.

How vengeance is experienced in classic, and after, is in its whole not tied to auto attacking. Yes, auto attacks triggers it, but any attack can.

Your reading comprehension is terrible, I haven't said big white crits anywhere.

I mean...

autoattack crits doing big damage

Come on dude.

Listen, I'll make it easy on you by clearly summarize the points you want to make (from what I can gather), since you are unwilling or incapable of doing so;

1. You want auto attacks to be a larger percentage of your total damage. Currently in classic it sits at around 50% of our damage, but you don't want it to be that much (but higher than the current 10% in retail).

1. You miss vengeance.

Correct?

[Jamie081]

Your first initial statement implied that you did link them together. You even defended your point of view by highlighting that.

How vengeance is experienced in classic, and after, is in its whole not tied to auto attacking. Yes, auto attacks triggers it, but any attack can.

I mean...


Come on dude. Listen, I'll make it easy on your a clearly summarize your point since you are unwilling on incapable to do so;

1. You want auto attacks to be a larger percentage of your total damage. Currently in classic it sits at over 50% of our damage, but you don't want that much

1. You miss vengeance

Auto attacks can trigger vengeance, that was my original point. You're basically telling me what I already know. You were wrong when you said auto attacks have nothing to do with vengeance, because they do.

I made a fleeting comment about how I liked auto attacks proccing vengeance and auto attacks doing a lot of ret damage. You're reading way too into what I said.

'yOu DoNt WaNt ThAt MuCh' No I really don't because I don't care that much to prove a mathematical point about its existence or return in retail, I just said that as weird as it sounds, I enjoyed it lol.

You really don't need to break down my own point when you didn't even understand it in the first place. Stop digging your hole deeper.

[Neldarie]

Divine Intervention

This. /10char

[Mukind]

No thanks. Classic paladin was absolute garbage design based on going afk while attacking.

It does not fit within fast paced modern mmo combat design.

If you like pala in classic, go play it in classic.

wut lol vanilla paladins were top tier hollistic healers, and that has never happened in other expansions is my understanding

what the fuck are you smoking? hahahah

God tier buffs that stack on top of other palas, god tier auras that don't cost mana to swap, bubble with no counter, blessing of sacrifice. The only one who can wipe* obscene amount of physical effects as a support. Mana back on crit?

While I have never played other expansions I have looked into playing a lot of them on p servers...And as a healer meta whore....Only time I would ever consider rolling paladin as a healer is for Vanila......So yea

[threads]

Nothing at all. Vanilla Paladin was atrocious.

Why would you want seals back? It will just mean a nerf to the attacks we have and for it to go into passive damage. How can you people forget already?

Auras were useless. I would like auras if they were useful utility, but we know they can't be. Holy's mastery is kind of an aura and can be modified by talents.

So, as i say, it needs nothing from classic. Please try to reach in your memories why we reached this point. No nostalgia goggles pls.

people like you are the reason so many classes are basic af builder/spenders now and all feel the same. just go play another game.

[Swnem]

people like you are the reason so many classes are basic af builder/spenders now and all feel the same. just go play another game.

Given that in fact that is the game we have, maybe you should go play another game.

Not that what you say is true.

[Cofic]

-Blessing/s, so palas have buffs like warr/pri have now. Maybe 1 same blessing for all specs and 1 unique for each spec. Why? Because they do different roles.
-Aura for all specs(some unique group/raid wide cd) think would be most practical in modern wow.
-Pursuit of Justice
-Instant cast Repentance on a cd.
-Turn Undead/Evil baseline for all.
-Seals, but would have to be implemented differently. Similar to the wod ones.
-Hammer of Wrath baseline for all.
-Divine Favor available in pve for holy(currently its honor talent).