Covenant Abilities... this looks BAD...

[Dungo]

How do they intend to balance this? The abilities have such HUGE differences that will result in one being far better than the other three. Did Ion not see this coming?

After the disaster of BfA class design, this has got me worried. Will Shadowlands also have massive issues with class design now?

[Stickiler]

How do they intend to balance this? The abilities have such HUGE differences that will result in one being far better than the other three. Did Ion not see this coming?

After the disaster of BfA class design, this has got me worried. Will Shadowlands also have massive issues with class design now?

lmao what, "why is this early, not-balance-tweaked version of the abilities so out of whack?" <- This is you.

[Tinykong]

lmao what, "why is this early, not-balance-tweaked version of the abilities so out of whack?" <- This is you.

People said this about Azerite gear for months without any response from the devs.

Expect these to be just as bad.

[MrLachyG]

How do they intend to balance this? The abilities have such HUGE differences that will result in one being far better than the other three. Did Ion not see this coming?

After the disaster of BfA class design, this has got me worried. Will Shadowlands also have massive issues with class design now?

well there is this thing called "testing" which will be done over the next few months before the expansion is released. I mean we don't even have them all yet. I am guessing Blizz will try to make them attractive to the type of content that you enjoy doing, whether that be M+ or Raiding or PvP

[Terahertz]

I really don't understand why blizzard is so keen on implementing these kind of abilities that are bound to dictate how some players play the game and are bound to give these players the feel that they either have made a mistake picking a certain ability or worse; feel the need to have multiple alts of the same class to cover all bases should they be necessary.

This might be the killer of this expansion for me. BFA had multiple layers of RNG in combination wtih gear being massively relevant in PvP again (+ the whole ambiguous PvP scaling bullshit) and this expansion has choices that will have permanent and relevant implications for the expansion's duration which you seemingly can't change other than re-rolling and gearing a new character of the same class.

[Beefkow]

INB4 comments saying, "Got to wait for fine tuning and testing".

Look where that got us in BFA, nothing has changed since beta, we were given shitty azerite armor and horrible class design.

Don't get your hopes up, expect these "rental" abilities to be absolute shit. There will always be a bis ability and a go to for pvp.

[Pandragon]

They are fine, if they can ONLY be used in world content. No raids, no dungeons, no battlegrounds.

[Beefkow]

They are fine, if they can ONLY be used in world content. No raids, no dungeons, no battlegrounds.

Pvp talents 2.0? I think i'll pass.

[arkanon]

INB4 comments saying, "Got to wait for fine tuning and testing".

Look where that got us in BFA, nothing has changed since beta, we were given shitty azerite armor and horrible class design.

Don't get your hopes up, expect these "rental" abilities to be absolute shit. There will always be a bis ability and a go to for pvp.

All these threads are at least 50% clowns saying "its just alpha, its not balanced!" then, the same clowns will say "its just beta, relax!". Followed by "Its only the first tier, it will improve" until eventually saying "i hope they fix this shit for next expansion", and then pre ordering legion 4.0 and saying "dont worry guys, its only alpha"

[Spacewalrus2010]

What would you have them do....scrap the idea? I remember a time when people said "Oh this looks cool!"

I think it looks cool. I'll judge the balance of it all, during alpha testing and see if they attempt to do it.

[Raven]

All these threads are at least 50% clowns saying "its just alpha, its not balanced!" then, the same clowns will say "its just beta, relax!". Followed by "Its only the first tier, it will improve" until eventually saying "i hope they fix this shit for next expansion", and then pre ordering legion 4.0 and saying "dont worry guys, its only alpha"

And the rest 50% will cry and bitch over stuff in a alpha which isnt even live yet, so we have no clue about numbers, cooldowns or limitations.

[Armourboy]

What would you have them do....scrap the idea? I remember a time when people said "Oh this looks cool!"

I think it looks cool. I'll judge the balance of it all, during alpha testing and see if they attempt to do it.

At this point the best we can hope for is that they make them easy to swap between. The balance won't be there and the system won't be going anywhere either. After all of these years I know how this story goes.

[Raone]

And the rest 50% will cry and bitch over stuff in a alpha which isnt even live yet, so we have no clue about numbers, cooldowns or limitations.

Because past experiences has showed us Blizzard can't balance a wild variety of abilities that do different things over the course of a beta or PTR ....

- Legion relics were't balanced, you mostly stacked 1 or 2
- Legion Legendary's weren't balanced, you needed specific ones or class was gimped, I mean fire mages without fire bracers were terribad, it took them forever to balance them and even then they still weren't balanced. As a healer that healing trinket was just MILES better then everything else ...
- BFA Azerite system is broken, mostly stacking 1 or 2 traits. At first it was the passive ones (dagger in the back etc) till they got nerfed into the ground, then other traits till they get nerfed (rogues for example got nerfed hard in azerite traits)...
- BFA Corruption system is wildly all over the place in terms of balance ...

Numbers don't matter, it's been proven by 2 expansions that they can't balance X ability and Y ability if they do completely different things, one will always be superior. I mean look at most talent trees, people usually pick 1 build and rarely switch talents ...

[Beefkow]

And the rest 50% will cry and bitch over stuff in a alpha which isnt even live yet, so we have no clue about numbers, cooldowns or limitations.

Inb4 this comment as well.

Not surprised.

[Trollhammer]

Lol.. They gave Druids Symbiosis back AGAIN.

[MiseryIndex]

All these threads are at least 50% clowns saying "its just alpha, its not balanced!" then, the same clowns will say "its just beta, relax!". Followed by "Its only the first tier, it will improve" until eventually saying "i hope they fix this shit for next expansion", and then pre ordering legion 4.0 and saying "dont worry guys, its only alpha"

Sadly, you're absolutely correct. People will defend blizzard's shitty design decisions no matter what. It's just alpha guys!! > It's just beta guys!!!! >> It'll get better in the first tuning pass >> Why are you so negative, blizz do a great job guise!!!! >> Next expansion will fix it guys!!!!!!!!1!1

[this is caranthir]

And the rest 50% will cry and bitch over stuff in a alpha which isnt even live yet, so we have no clue about numbers, cooldowns or limitations.

It will be live shortly, I'd rather have honest feedback right away instead of wishful thinking throughout the testing.

[Shinrael]

How do they intend to balance this? The abilities have such HUGE differences that will result in one being far better than the other three. Did Ion not see this coming?

After the disaster of BfA class design, this has got me worried. Will Shadowlands also have massive issues with class design now?

lmao what, "why is this early, not-balance-tweaked version of the abilities so out of whack?" <- This is you.

And the rest 50% will cry and bitch over stuff in a alpha which isnt even live yet, so we have no clue about numbers, cooldowns or limitations.

This is wrong.

These abilities will NOT be balanced. Not because it is Alpha now and not because it will be Beta later. These are absolutely irrelevant. The abilities WILL NOT be balanced. They cannot be. There are 12 classes, 48 abilities. Each does a different thing and thus one will always be better for a specific situation. You cannot pick more than one. You pick one. If it is too good, it will be nerfed. If it is too bad, it will be buffed. But they will never be balanced. Forget about that. It is not possible.

Even if Paladin's Kyrian ability was:

1 min CD, 1 sec cast time, 40 yard range, deals 10 000 damage to 1 enemy.

And Mage's Venthyr ability was:

1 min CD, 1 sec cast time, 40 yard range, deals 10 000 damage to 1 enemy.

It would STILL NOT be balanced. Because of how differently those classes play and how well those abilities synergize with the rest of their kit. It is simply not a possible calculation. So stop crying about stuff being OP or unbalanced. That's not the issue here. The issue would be, being unable to switch between these abilities at will. Because that will piss people off. Not them being OP or weak. So stop giving the wrong feedback, stop crying about the wrong things. You're just creating NOISE.

[Volatilis]

Tale as old as time.....

Experienced WoW players know EXACTLY how this will go. Why do they never learn.

Gonna be a toss pot of overpowered ones getting nerfed and massively under powered ones getting buffed and everyone will regret their choice and they'll get it right for the last patch of the expansion where you can change between them easily once no one cares anymore....

[Hinastorm]

lmao what, "why is this early, not-balance-tweaked version of the abilities so out of whack?" <- This is you.

Bliz does not exactly have the best track record with balance in WoW.

Designing themselves into a corner like this, where they either have to perfectly balance the 4 covenant abilitys, or people won't be happy, is a weird design decision.

They'll end up just letting us switch between them semi-easily in the end. It's the only logical outcome of a system like this.