With BFA over, is it time to end the faction war for good?

[Eazy]

Yup, a war between four races. Not just the two factions you, and those like you, are obsessed with. And it was still a war whenever any of those races allied to take on a greater threat.

I'm no obsessed, lol. We could fight with each other, that's the WARcraft.

Just like there would still be war if the Alliance and Horde permanently allied, in order to take on the Old Gods, or the Void Lords, or whomever else Blizzard pulls out of their butt.

But that's not real war.

When I say war I mean each player can participate in each side. I don't care about some fantasy where we held hands together and fight with bigger threat(fucking WoD ending lmao). Warcraft was always a game where you could always CHOOSE the side.

War against old gods/scourge etc. is dumbass idea.

Sometimes making alliances between the factions to fight greater threat? Fine.
Having fused Horde+Alliance - rolf xD

[Minikin]

OBEY!!

The faction war will end... when we will stomp Horde scum flat into the dirt under our glorious Alliance boots.

Once more the Alliance will rule the Azeroth... and we shall have peace.

"Chorus of clapping"

So this is how liberty dies....with thunderous applause.

On topic:

Honestly? I'd be fine with the faction war IF AND ONLY IF they from the START give a clear sense of who is bad and crossing lines and who isn't. I do not want to chase their stupid version of morally grey for an entire expac, only for them to escape goat genocide and pin it on one individual when everyone else took part in said genocide.

I do not want to go through another two years of blogs on this forum how

the sylvanas isn't evil, https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...u-think-she-is, even though the woman is feeding both sides to a grinder so she can unlock her shadowlands talent tree.

how teldrassil was an inside job, https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...=Steampunkette

how South Shore was due to deathwing https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...4#post52103564

Essays on how it's not a genocide when Blizzard says it clearly is https://www.pcgamesn.com/world-of-wa...lvanas-garrosh

And let's not get into the "but why should I have my warchief replaced by a council?! It's not like 4 of them lead the horde on a murder spree?! Wait they did? Shit..."

Call them evil clear and simple.

If blizz cant do that and give a clear consequences then don't do the faction story. Cuz it's just stupid and aimless without that.

For me. After this fiasco I have absolutely zero trust in a good faction war story. And I would consider any dollar amount and time spent on it a total waste.

[Gaidax]

*snip*

Actually I think this whole obfuscation and controversy in BFA was really, really brilliantly pulled off by Blizz. It's really under-appreciated, they really had massive balls going on and destroying two capital cities to heat the whole pressure cooker of rage and confusion to make community actually agitated and factionist.

I really think it was nothing short of success, because despite BFA failings they really managed to hype up the community and make people emotionally invested into the whole thing on a level not seen in WoW for years now.

If anything, this is the giant plus for keeping factions, because when you pop yet another stock global existential threat it's usually a rather miffed reception, but when said existential threat is the opposing faction - sparks are flying.

That's also part of why BoD was such a great raid, IMO.

[Thestrawman]

ITT Lore obsessed (and it's really shitty Lore too) PvE carebears who don't understand that the faction conflict is central to the game

Factions should NEVER be removed from WoW

If you want a game without player factions where everyone holds hands and sings kumbaya go play a different MMO

Lol carebears. And when exactly was the last bg introduced? MoP? Ashran if you want to stretch the term. It's clear pvp is only in the game as a sufferance at this point. War mode should just make players hostile to everyone so they can live out their dreams of being a useless murderhobo.

[Gaidax]

Lol carebears. And when exactly was the last bg introduced? MoP? Ashran if you want to stretch the term. It's clear pvp is only in the game as a sufferance at this point. War mode should just make players hostile to everyone so they can live out their dreams of being a useless murderhobo.

Pfft, you have N'zoth PvP quest.

It's actually great fun if you don't cheese this shit, going full guerilla warfare on everyone's ass.

[Minikin]

Actually I think this whole obfuscation and controversy in BFA was really, really brilliantly pulled off by Blizz. It's really under-appreciated, they really had massive balls going on and destroying two capital cities to heat the whole pressure cooker of rage and confusion to make community actually agitated and factionist.

I really think it was nothing short of success, because despite BFA failings they really managed to hype up the community and make people emotionally invested into the whole thing on a level not seen in WoW for years now.

If anything, this is the giant plus for keeping factions, because when you pop yet another stock global existential threat it's usually a rather miffed reception, but when said existential threat is the opposing faction - sparks are flying.

That's also part of why BoD was such a great raid, IMO.

I disagree. Because at the end of it all there was no real conclusion.

No point in hyping up a story if the end isn't great.
At the end of this faction war:
All the land the horde gained is still theirs.

The consequence of their genocide is literally losing their warchief, heck we aren't even 100% sure they lost the war.

The whole goose chase of morally grey and now sylvanas is actually evil.

So what's the point of a war that has no real end result?

What's the point of being good or evil, if you can't be actively labelled that? Player confusion? I mean hell check the link I gave. This one guy thinks deathwing caused South Shore. Deathwing. Blighted. South Shore.

Or that even now after she's fully declared evil and that her motive was to feed both horde and alliance to some abyss for new powers, people still consider the side who supported saurfang to be traitors.

Heck if that isn't proof enough of a failed story line. Try this. The option to rat out zekhan was added due to community out cry. And as far as shadowlands is concerned Blizzard has given a clear directive that neither will a separate option be available to sylvanas loyalists, their bfa choice won't matter and nor will it be acknowledged.

So if a story doesn't proceed or worse loops back and is cut out. Then it's a failed story.

They can keep factions, I don't care. But wasting any resource on a faction war would be dumb.

[Hokuro]

BfA felt like on overtly long Dragon Ball Z filler episode galore.

Glad that shit is coming to an end so we can focus on some good stories.

The faction war was already old the moment it started. Everybody knew it served no real purpose outside of a filler story to begin with.

Not to mention it was boring as fuck.

[barcod3d]

I do think the faction war should end. But I also think that it should end by breaking the factions instead of uniting them, simply because most big threats weren’t defeated by both factions opposing it completely together (i.e. all races and all kinds of racial organizations).

Each race gets its own independent agenda and storylines, sometimes intersecting with each other’s agendas (e.g. against bigger threats or common goals) sometimes opposing with each other’s agendas (e.g. preserving nature vs. necessary resources), letting the player choose sides whom to support but also letting them play together globally.

It would also help with the drifting numbers of AvH, people can just play along in raids and dungeons independently on their favorite races.

I’ll give you an example:

Ashenvale – orcs vs night elves: The night elves want to preserve the forests, the orcs want to harvest the lumber. Let the player choose whom to help, because say a Tauren druid might rather help to preserve the forest instead of destroying it. But he can also choose to support his former allies whereas a gnome warlock might rather understand the need of resources.

Players who choose to side with the night elves can war mode the other side and vice versa and it could also tie in battlegrounds to the stories.


But these mini conflicts and agendas also lets multiple races get more development, especially those who do not have a lot of screen time due to not being human or orc.

[Minikin]

It needs to die as a central element of the story.

World of Warcraft is the absolute worst game to do a faction war, because NOBODY WANTS TO BE ON THE LOSING SIDE and since you have people playing both sides, none of them can really "win". Can you even imagine how upset for instance Horde players would be if BfA ended with Alliance straight up winning the war?

It would be a shitshow and that's why both times we got a "faction war expansion", it all went pretty much the same, i.e. one faction's leader was written to be a villain, so that his faction could rebel against him and thus everyone could theoretically win in the end.

And if they do another faction war then it's going to be the same thing.

100%

I've said it many times I'll say it again. It's a game of factions with both sides having paid subs.

There will never be a true winner and thus never a true loser.

There is no real effect. "Sorry night elf Hunter xlegolasx, you can't play cuz when sylvanas burnt down teldrassil you were pooping and couldn't get out. Sorry. Reroll, here is a blood Elf Paladin xsephirothx for you instead".

[KOUNTERPARTS]

The plot of a faction conflict should certainly not be revisited anytime soon, although, I'm sure Blizzard is a big proponent of the expression "third time's a charm"

[crusadernero]

What do you mean? The Horde lost overall in BfA and Alliance won. The faction war keeps going. In fact, this would be the perfect time for the Alliance to just end the Horde.

[TickTickTick]

Developers say it's core to the game.

They like to change what is "core" to the game when it suits them.

Adventurer archetype was also the core, but then we became most powerful heroes of the universe.
Azeroth was also the core, but then they decided it's a good idea to visit other planets, alternative universes and realms that have nothing to do with Azeroth, instead of discovering our planet further.

There's nothing core about this game, because Blizzard doesn't care about consistency of this universe. They will change any facts and twist any long forgotten plots to push their idea of an expansion, no matter if it makes sense in regards to the laws established within Warcraft universe.

[shoegazing]

Lol carebears. And when exactly was the last bg introduced? MoP? Ashran if you want to stretch the term. It's clear pvp is only in the game as a sufferance at this point. War mode should just make players hostile to everyone so they can live out their dreams of being a useless murderhobo.

Who cares? Do you see me asking for more BGs? All I need is Gulch, Basin, and Nagrand Arena and I'm set.

[Thestrawman]

Who cares? Do you see me asking for more BGs? All I need is Gulch, Basin, and Nagrand Arena and I'm set.

Just proving that pvp is an after thought at best for the game.

[McNeil]

We had very little Alliance vs Horde in WC3 and it was their best game lorewise. It was actually very interesting to see new factions getting the spotlight, like how the undead rose to power by destroying an entire continent and that the night elves were waking up with the Legion's return and having to act again. Alliance vs Horde got boring because it was all that WC1+2 was, moving away from this was one of their better decisions.

Then WoW starts to go back to AvH yet again and at this stage its just hurting the lore because there can never be a real outcome because of gameplay reasons. It worked fine if the conflict was just a side story of an expansion like in leveling zones or doing something like Wintergrasp and battlegrounds, but having it the main focus of an expansion you just know that they can never deliver a satisfying conclusion for anyone.

If it were up to me I would splinter the Alliance and Horde into smaller factions but still allow them to communicate to each other, because as of now the factions feel way to bloated with all the extra allied races. I'd love to see the Forsaken and night elves start their own faction and take some Horde factions with them, like blood elves and goblins join the Forsaken and worgen and draenei join the night elves. It also helps to add a lot of faction identity, because as of now the Alliance is just human potential while the night elves are a distant shadow of what they used to be.

[Tarba]

Faction war is not the problem. Writers are the problem.
Put non retarded writers in charge of the lore and a faction war will be neat. Until then, let's go help some soul eaters, mind erasers people for reasons.

[Dellis0991]

BFA is, for the most part universally agreed to be a pretty shallow, poorly done and heavily rushed expansion with some interesting story idea's and utterly abysmal executions of them.

In terms of gameplay, lore, and storytelling we have all but reached a point where besides the likes of Tyrande and Genn there are no faction specific characters who have some kinda grudge against the other.

With that in mind... is it time, to consider cross-faction and the removal of said factions, now that there is basically almost no reason at all for another war again?

Or would you truly feel that wow needs more faction divergance still?

What would your reasons be?

Or do you agree with the statement, that the time has come, for factions, to die.

The war is not over. Tyrande still out there on the warpath with Genn leaning towards throwing his lot in with her, You got Gallywix out there doing god know what and i'm damn sure he going to be putting some money on revenge. Talanji's people took a big ass hit and so did Kul'Tiras with Brennadam getting butchered.....all the seeds for more infighting and war is still there.

Also TIMESKIP is coming while we are in the shadowlands.....I'm betting we coming back to shit hitting the fan after we step back into the world of the living.

[Rustedsaint]

Having a war between the factions is fine if it makes sense.
This whole expansion was a shit show of lore being thrown in the fire and being replaced with hastily written crap.
Like the whole collecting Azerite thing was shit. One quest has us taking it to repair Azeroth while another has us giving it to our factions to weaponize it.
How killing a old god somehow “healed” Azeroth despite there still being a blade still stuck in it.
Most of the allied races don’t make sense considering most of them were helped by both factions.

[vertigo12]

Highly unlikely but the faction wars will be divided into four much like how faction wars between covenant will be a thing as the story progress.

[taishar68]

A little anecdote here, for what it’s worth. At Blizzcon last year, I was in the audience for the Q & A, and the question was brought up, would we see cross faction play, and there was a reasonable amount of applause. Ion stated that the core of WoW is HvA, and the factions would remain as they are, and there was an instant “For the Alliance” cheer, followed by a lusty “For the Horde” retort (I was bellowing rather loudly myself). The devs pointed that out with a wry chuckle, but based on crowd noise I think there is still a large base of fans that want the conflict to stay. Even if it is somewhat dated and silly for in game purposes.