Is Trump worse than Bush?

[Ivanstone]

Your problem is that you don't like facts since you had no clue about the EPA, Trump's actual policies like attacking the clean water act and the endangered species list. You can say you like Trump better than Bush because it's your taste but the only category which it is arguable that Trump might be better is foreign policy. Trump has taken what a regular republican does and dialed it up to an insane degree add the corruption, greed and complete disregard for the American people and the rule of law.

Trump was taken what a regular Republican does and fuck it up royally. He's done nothing that another Republican wouldn't have done in his place. Seriously Dubya's presidency was a clown car full of corruption and deregulation. The only real difference is that Bush and friends understood subtlety so some of their bullshit flew under the radar.

Its possible that Trump would be worse than Bush if he was competent but he isn't. The net result is that Bush was a worse president because he was more competent at being evil.

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Trump just fired the IG investigating him...

Nixon says hi.

And what did the GOP learn from that? We need more lawyers like Barr.

[Draco-Onis]

Trump was taken what a regular Republican does and fuck it up royally. He's done nothing that another Republican wouldn't have done in his place. Seriously Dubya's presidency was a clown car full of corruption and deregulation. The only real difference is that Bush and friends understood subtlety so some of their bullshit flew under the radar.

Its possible that Trump would be worse than Bush if he was competent but he isn't. The net result is that Bush was a worse president because he was more competent at being evil.

I have already listed several things that Bush never did but you can keep repeating that line until you believe it.

[Felya]

Nixon says hi.

And what did the GOP learn from that? We need more lawyers like Barr.

If Nixon reacted the same way as Trump to his investigation, he would have finished his term.

[Loga Almandar]

Judging the actual deeds of two presidents is something different than judging their character; i believe its more prudent to think about the latter (ie the future).
So, especially for the people arguing how bad Bush was, i would like you to imagine a perfect world according to Bush / Trump.

Still not convinced?

[Felya]

Judging the actual deeds of two presidents is something different than judging their character; i believe its more prudent to think about the latter (ie the future).
So, especially for the people arguing how bad Bush was, i would like you to imagine a perfect world according to Bush / Trump.

Still not convinced?

I would change that to those who think Bush was worse. Bush being bad is justified...

[JohnBrown1917]

Judging the actual deeds of two presidents is something different than judging their character; i believe its more prudent to think about the latter (ie the future).
So, especially for the people arguing how bad Bush was, i would like you to imagine a perfect world according to Bush / Trump.

Still not convinced?

A literal hellworld for anybody who is not straight, white, male and rich?

[Ivanstone]

I have already listed several things that Bush never did but you can keep repeating that line until you believe it.

No you listed a few small items and I countered with things that Bush did that weren't as egregious looking but were just as bad in practice. Trump's against the Clean Water Act, for example, but Bush's EPA would simply of done as little as possible while proclaiming they're doing work.

The entirety of the GOP is against the EPA. Other candidates have specifically ran on removing it entirely. Furthermore nothing gets done in congress without Mitch McConnell saying it gets done and he has quite happy to rubber stamp anything Trump's actions because it keeps the donors happy. Trump's not smart enough to have his own opinions on any subject.

Then there's starting two wars plus driving the economy over a cliff thing. There's more to the Presidency than just the EPA.

If it wasn't for James Buchanan, I would say Dubya is the worst US president.

[Draco-Onis]

No you listed a few small items and I countered with things that Bush did that weren't as egregious looking but were just as bad in practice. Trump's against the Clean Water Act, for example, but Bush's EPA would simply of done as little as possible while proclaiming they're doing work.

The entirety of the GOP is against the EPA. Other candidates have specifically ran on removing it entirely. Furthermore nothing gets done in congress without Mitch McConnell saying it gets done and he has quite happy to rubber stamp anything Trump's actions because it keeps the donors happy. Trump's not smart enough to have his own opinions on any subject.

Then there's starting two wars plus driving the economy over a cliff thing. There's more to the Presidency than just the EPA.

If it wasn't for James Buchanan, I would say Dubya is the worst US president.

You keep saying would and could but the fact is Trump is not in a better position than Bush especially after 9/11 when he was near untouchable. You keep talking hypothetical I am talking facts what you are imagining Bush did he didn't do when he had the power to do so. Last but not least the entire GOP is not against the EPA Nixon created it. The GOP old stance before Trump on environmental issues was not this you clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

As that other poster said imagine Trump's dream America vs Bush's, Trump's would look more like North Korea on steroids.

[Ivanstone]

You keep saying would and could but the fact is Trump is not in a better position than Bush especially after 9/11 when he was near untouchable. You keep talking hypothetical I am talking facts what you are imagining Bush did he didn't do when he had the power to do so. Last but not least the entire GOP is not against the EPA Nixon created it. The GOP old stance before Trump on environmental issues was not this you clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

Yeah, you need to do some reading. This is good start. The GOP has been against the EPA since Reagan.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5922215/

Not one thing I have said is hypothetical.

Did you know that Anne Gorsuch has a famous son??!?! She almost destroyed the EPA but at least her genepool helped gay people in the future.

[Draco-Onis]

Not one thing I have said is hypothetical.

Everything you have said is hypothetical because none of it was done, What does Trump have that Bush didn't to act that way? Bush had approval ratings that Trump never reached, right wing media, the entire country and congress behind him and none of what you said happened. You keep ranting about woulda coulda shoulda but Trump is the first to do these things.

[Ivanstone]

Everything you have said is hypothetical because none of it was done, What does Trump have that Bush didn't to act that way? Bush had approval ratings that Trump never reached, right wing media, the entire country and congress behind him and none of what you said happened. You keep ranting about woulda coulda shoulda but Trump is the first to do these things.

If you ignore Reagan, Bush1, Bush2 and State governments. Which you are. They all took actions against the EPA. Reagan was the worst but the GOP is not friendly to the EPA. Trump is immaterial.

Bush at his highest point waged two wars, cut taxes for the rich, cut funding for a variety of government bodies including the EPA, the IRS and the SEC. He did all of those things but because you're too fucking lazy to do any reading you don't fucking know. Seriously. Are you a fucking goldfish?

Did you at least complete the one homework assignment that I did give you?

[Draco-Onis]

If you ignore Reagan, Bush1, Bush2 and State governments. Which you are. They all took actions against the EPA. Reagan was the worst but the GOP is not friendly to the EPA. Trump is immaterial.

Bush at his highest point waged two wars, cut taxes for the rich, cut funding for a variety of government bodies including the EPA, the IRS and the SEC. He did all of those things but because you're too fucking lazy to do any reading you don't fucking know. Seriously. Are you a fucking goldfish?

Did you at least complete the one homework assignment that I did give you?

Again none of them did anything to the level Trump did so let me know when you can provide evidence of that instead of hypotheticals. After 9/11 Bush could have easily turned this country into a nationalist hellhole he didn't. Trump is currently in the process of gutting immigration to this country none of these president ever went that far, there are levels to this you are basically saying a paper cut is the same as a stabbing.

Let me know when you join reality.

[caervek]

Trump isn't a war criminal I guess?

The assassination of Soleimani was a war crime, however Trump just like Bush will never face justice due to being the president of the USA.

[Jastall]

As a person Trump's a good deal worse. Bush was mostly incompetent.

As a President, well, Bush started two pointless wars and his economic legacy- whenever earned or not- was a dire crisis. Trump's about as complete an asshole as assholes get, but as a President he's not as bad as Bush, much like I think Carter is a much better person than Clinton but a worse President.

[apeiron1234]

Bush is probably the worst president in history followed by his daddy.

[Ivanstone]

Again none of them did anything to the level Trump did so let me know when you can provide evidence of that instead of hypotheticals. After 9/11 Bush could have easily turned this country into a nationalist hellhole he didn't. Trump is currently in the process of gutting immigration to this country none of these president ever went that far, there are levels to this you are basically saying a paper cut is the same as a stabbing.

Let me know when you join reality.

I linked one thing and you ignored it. I could link more like all of the State AG's constant lawsuits because Trump is some mythical boogeyman you won't care. I could link Anne Gorsuch's actions but you'll ignore those because it doesn't suit your beliefs. I could link every GOP think tank's opinions. Or Fox News. Or Jim Inhofe's snowball. Or just about anything.

Having a high approval rating isn't omnipotence and an incompetent goof like Dubya can only get so much crime done while fucking up two wars and deregulating everything else.

Ill leave this but you'll ignore it anyways.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ics-georgebush

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Bush is probably the worst president in history followed by his daddy.

James Buchanan is worse. Alot of the Dems from the 1800s are really bad. Harding and Hoover are also shitheads.

[Draco-Onis]

I linked one thing and you ignored it. I could link more like all of the State AG's constant lawsuits because Trump is some mythical boogeyman you won't care. I could link Anne Gorsuch's actions but you'll ignore those because it doesn't suit your beliefs. I could link every GOP think tank's opinions. Or Fox News. Or Jim Inhofe's snowball. Or just about anything.

Having a high approval rating isn't omnipotence and an incompetent goof like Dubya can only get so much crime done while fucking up two wars and deregulating everything else.

Ill leave this but you'll ignore it anyways.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ics-georgebush

Because you haven't answered the most important question what special circumstance do you think Trump has that Bush didn't? because simply 9/11 Bush had more political capital than any president in modern history. You keep saying would could and bunch of non sense answer this simple question what makes you think the president who has no bipartisan support, approval rating, international support is more powerful?

[Deletedaccount1]

I strongly refute the idea that Iraq would have happened under Gore. The war in Afghanistan, sure. There was literally no connection to Iraq, and Bush pushed it into existence.

Gore's administration would have been stuffed full of neocons, don't kid yourself. McCain almost put Lieberman on his ticket until the RNC stopped him.

[Felya]

Gore's administration would have been stuffed full of neocons, don't kid yourself. McCain almost put Lieberman on his ticket until the RNC stopped him.

That’s great... a tree huger like Gore wouldn’t have gone to war.

[Ivanstone]

Because you haven't answered the most important question what special circumstance do you think Trump has that Bush didn't? because simply 9/11 Bush had more political capital than any president in modern history. You keep saying would could and bunch of non sense answer this simple question what makes you think the president who has no bipartisan support, approval rating, international support is more powerful?

I keep on saying they actually did shit. Which you ignore. There is no would or could. They actually did shit. Bush had a high approval rating which he used to start two wars and deregulate or underfund a bunch of stuff including the EPA. WHY CAN'T YOU GRASP THIS?

Trump has no special circumstances besides controlling both houses. He had the power and accomplished very little. Executive orders only get you so far. Most of his accomplishments were either overturned by the courts or will be overturned by the next Dem president. Trump is not powerful and I have never claimed that he is.