There's plenty of things I don't like about the game, which is why I don't play it often. Playing it very casually now to play with friends. I appreciate 'most' of the things I do not about it as things others certainly would enjoy.
The biggest thing I don't like is the MSQ grind. Too much much is gated behind the MSQ, which is a massive grind. Keep it in, give players incentives to do it, but don't lock them into it. You basically cannot play the game until you get most of the MSQ stuff done. If not for the unlimited free trial I would argue it's to milk subs. The $25 skip would actually be cheaper if you paid from ARR to ShB. Even skipping all the cutscenes. Which leads to another thing. There account services are very limited and outdated. Returning players unable to use the trial feature is dumb and due to the backend of account services. How they process subs/MTX/account rewards, etc is all very outdated.
I want to add onto the MSQ point. It's good that the story is preserved in game, but bad almost decade old content is mandatory to do anything.
Resident Cosplay Progressive
A veteran trial system that lets people who bought the game in the past still access the ARR and Heavensward content, why complete the trial when I still need to do it on my main account.
A Authentication system that separates logging into the launcher from logging into the game. That lets players keep FF 14 keep the game patched without needing a sub.
Um... it has one.
WoWs is better, but FF14 has one.
- - - Updated - - -
Im not sure what you mean.
This isn't about the game. This is about Blizzard service level.A Authentication system that separates logging into the launcher from logging into the game. That lets players keep FF 14 keep the game patched without needing a sub.
"stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
-ynnady
I essentially said that Yoshi said the engine sucked and that's why glamour is completely screwed. In the Q&A literally 2-3 days ago he was basically crying on Twitch.tv when he got asked about it. Not verbatim "it's a scam" or anything like that.
"because they are limiting the amount of storage to save their backend (Char file size or something) and only dedicated payers get extra. Yoshi P said it all so."
lol, that's what I put. I didn't say he said it was a scam.
Content drought is a combination of catchup mechanics and no new content.
"Crying"? He admitted it was a system limitation right now. He's had to deal with the spaghetti code from 1.0 for years now and has been pretty open about things he'd like to do but can't.
I'm not denying it sucks that we can't get a better glamour system (it kinda sucks right now) but the way you phrase it comes across as...pretty aggressive and anti-FF14.
“The rains have ceased, and we have been graced with another beautiful day. But you are not here to see it.”
My latest pet peeve is getting trials in the leveling duty finder. Queue times are a lot worse now that I'm pushing 50, they went from about 5 minutes as DPS to now 15+ minutes. Then to only get one boss, sometimes consecutively, really sucks. I queued up last night because I was one dungeon run away from level and couldn't pick up the next MSQ until I did (seems like once you get to 40 there's no longer enough MSQ EXP to level more than one job anymore), it took me over an hour because I got Bowl of Embers twice.
I ended up spoiling the story for myself because I was not getting into ARR at all. It does get a lot better, but not for awhile (IMO) and, frankly, I feel that ARR is heavily oversold as being important other than character introductions. I personally feel that if I'd used a story skip I would not have missed much, certainly not anything I couldn't look up later if interested.
Speaking of which, I found a great channel on YouTube, Ethys Asher, that has FFXIV lore videos and some MSQ/job quest recaps.
"We must now recognize that the greatest threat of freedom for us all is if we go back to eating ourselves out from within." - John Anderson
Not in any particular order.
1) janky/clunky combat and animations
2)end game needs more challenge
3) MSQ are probably the single worst leveling experience ever imaginable. Basically forced to buy the boost.
If FF just control c + control v those elements from WoW I could see FF easily being the omega mmo in terms of pleasing everyone.
Outside of the leveling the end game is lacking for (combat and difficulty) me and others that enjoy progression/challenge. I just can't get into past playing a week or two a patch clearing everything then dropping it.
Here's a thing that's super important and should be acknowledged by SE.
The first two zones in stormblood: The peaks and the fringes CANNOT be unlocked for flight until very late (and once youve completed the other three zones) in the 4.0 campaign. This is garbage. One, yes. Two, no. Given that the sea of clouds followed this pattern in heavensward? am i expected to come back to three zones (with two freebies?) in shb?
I just wanna grind out the arthyrite currents and fly, dudes. i will happily run all the way across the map and do whatever jumping puzzle you think i need to do a million times. But i want to fly if i do this. Breaking this up (and triggered by the msq) is garbage.
Last edited by ippollite; 2021-07-16 at 01:16 PM.
I didn't really enjoy much of the game til Bozja and Zadnor. Being able to run around and just do stuff that helps you progress freely is great. they need to streamline the game before that point. I just managed to get an astrologian to 76 and it's been a boring snoozefest. leveling a healer sucks.
As I stated in the original response I do not. I fully supported your point on this topic.
If you're not going to battle examples than you shouldn't have made that one of your points in your initial rebuttal. I will drop it, but that is your admission that you were unable to come up with a single example of a non CE content mechanic that required mods to be easily understood.I'm not going to battle examples, it is pointless. You can keep insisting that 800 stun/interrupt mods exist for no reason and that nearly everyone doing rated pvp uses them for luls rather than necessity. The three guilds I've been in that required them for tracking during fights were apparently all idiots and just did it for no reason.
sidebar though, what fucking toxic shit guilds were you in that policed your mods? I raided top 20 US, and no one did that with us, you either did your job well or got sat?
Aside from polish, I fail to see what FF14 could possibly take from WoW that would make it a better game without losing significant aspects of what makes the game good. Homogenization of classes by making them all coked out damage cannons? Specs and talents that cause constant imbalance? Obtuse gearing? Temporary power systems? Scrapping all content three months after it comes out?
- Glamour Log (yes I know spaghetti code, but it's not a valid excuse, fix the fucking code)
- Better netcode (stop developing a global game based on JP geography)
- More synergy/depth inside job kits (I don't need 12 buttons that do absolutely no function but deal flat damage, or 4 tank cooldowns that do the exact same thing)
- Better designed Healer/Tank paradigms (Give tanks more agency over their damage and mitigation)
- Scalable content (They spend all these resources making content so insular; design it so that it can be successfully used for multiple player types instead of just 1 and expand on it, don't just abandon it)
- More bosses in raids (FF14 raids always have weird difficulty curves, 1-2 usually too easy, 3 a minor wall, and then 4 is like lolwut). Ideally I'd like to see maybe 6 bosses in total to flesh out the curve a bit better.
- I'd personally like to see more fatigue based mechanics in encounters rather than hard fails (I do think hard fails are important, but you don't need a full swing in either direction)
- A proper macro system
- Better Tank swap mechanics and more randomly based ones.
I kept the points fairly simple, because going in depth would get long, but if any feel worthy of elaborating on, let me know; but yes, a lot of this is just polish, but polish is super important. There are however 2 points I wanted to separate out as I think they're a bit more important.
1) You say that WoW is all homogenized coked out glass cannons. Regardless of that statements validity (I don't have the experience in every class to make that call), I can tell you that healing and tanking (a huge pain point in FF14 for me personally) is so offensively homogenized that it boils my blood. It's why half the points above talk about making things different/better for them. I actually think DPS classes are in great shape in FF14 (except SMN).
2) Materia is an absolute crime and should be way more interesting. (This would be the "talent" system you are afraid of). My vision for this system would exist where tanks/healers are NOT homogenized and are very unique and that you could use different materia combinations to get functions/features that you wanted from other jobs or retool existing abilities to new functions.
The idea would be something like different tiers of gear would have different socket choices (color/# to make gearing slightly more interesting, but STILL be simple enough that generally ilvl is king like today since people DO like that). You could supplement this with the existing flat boring stat materia too, so that it's a mix of both.
So the reason those zones are set up that way is because the top half of both of those early Gyr Abania zones is tunneling you over to Rhalgr's Reach and the area around it for the early game. You only ever see half the zone so it makes sense to not unlock flying yet until you come back through the bottom halves of the zones and finish them up. I could see the argument to perhaps split the zones up smaller in that case but honestly I still like the idea of once you are done questing through the zone THEN you unlock the flight. At least we aren't waiting 8 months to get it (I had to take the WoW jab - sorry...I hate the Pathfinder system).
I tend to do roulettes on all my Healers/Tanks while using other systems like FATEs, Beast Tribes, Palace of the Dead/HoH for my DPS classes. Unless I have a Healer/Tank friend online and in that case its dungeon queues.
- I agree and disagree at the same time. Spaghetti Code is REALLY hard to get over. Remember when they added 4 slots to the backpack in WoW and we had crashes for a month? As someone who codes every day I get that it can be a real pain to get things right trying to fix 8 year old code and make sure it still works as intended. Don't mistake me on this, I agree. I really want them to fix it and get a system similar to WoW's collection system. It would make the Glamour system SO much better.
- Better netcode sounds like a great thing.
- I rather like the kits as is. The damage portions of the tanks are all fairly different except for some obvious crossover (Warrior and Dark Knight having a CD into 5 big hits is my first thought) and I like that they have fairly consistent defensive kits. Each of them has some quick mitigation on a 24 second CD and some bigger CDs you rotate so that you can keep your mitigation going as needed. A lot of the damage classes have in-depth rotations to lead into the bigger parts of the kit such as Machinist pushing towards their robot while using their mini-burst windows with Wildfire or Heat Blast.
- As a tank I very often feel like I have a pretty good amount of agency over the amount of damage I'm taking. I'm actually curious what you would prefer or what you feel currently so I can understand where you are coming from on this one.
- I like the idea of Scalable Content. Honestly they could throw 100 more floors on HoH and PotD and add 10 more levels in for people and that would help to give more variety in leveling. Heck make Eureka or some of these other "random" content areas more leveling or smaller rewards rather than the bigger rewards to keep people going through those areas.
- Yeah more bosses would be great. I've never been a pure progression Savage or Ultimate raider but I know they can get bored pretty quick. Having 5-6 bosses instead each tier would be nice especially if the difficulty went up like you said. I do approve of the way there are noticeable differences between bosses but having more would never be a bad thing.
- I'd argue the fact that you can rez people and push through the fight with the weakness effect leads to a bit more of a loss due to fatigue rather than anything that's like a "oh you missed the mechanic? Everyone is dead now." Once again I haven't done Ultimate so I could be unqualified for this answer.
- I'm fine with better macros.
- I find Provoke and Shirk work pretty well? Is there something that you find clunky about it? In my time in ES9-ES11 I've not had any issues coming from tank swaps.
I do like the idea of Materia mattering a bit more. Even in FF7 Materia giving you stat boosts is the secondary benefit. Giving you extra abilities or spells is the main idea. I do see them playing with the idea obviously in Eureka and Bozja for letting you customize a loadout. I wonder if they're testing the ideas before committing it into the main game.
Regardless I'd like to see that...I'd hope it wouldn't become an RNG loot system though. We all know how Warforging and such went in WoW. If making that special materia was something you worked for in specific raids or crafting I'd be ok with it.
Last edited by Ragnarocket; 2021-07-16 at 02:12 PM.
“The rains have ceased, and we have been graced with another beautiful day. But you are not here to see it.”
Lord of the Rings Online, SWToR, Elder Scrolls Online and several others also have one that I would say are improvements over the current system, either in parts or as a whole.
The FFXIV glamour system is certainly functional, but it's pretty terrible in comparison to many of the others that are out there.
I still don't quite feel this the way you guys say...you say there are no differences between tanks and healers but just immediately my first thought is that my Astro plays completely different than my Scholar just as a quick healer example.
That said I'm more familiar with tanking and while yes there are common elements (Some AoE threat, some Single Target rotations) I still feel very different when I play on my PLD than when I do on my DRK. To be frank on my PLD I care very little for my Oath Gauge (I pop Sheltron when I'm at max Oath and when a TB is heading my way) and generally focus on finding the good points for Requiescat/Magic Combos while looping my FoF and physical combos. Meanwhile DRK I'm constantly looking for my breakpoints for Darkness Within and keeping an eye on my mana to keep a TDN in my back pocket while still trying to pump out some oGCD hits to keep my damage increase up and making sure I'm using my Blood Gauge for some big hits here and there when Darkness Within is on CD.
Don't get me wrong in both cases I'm looking for Arm's Length and Bulwark moments with big pulls and for DRK I'll throw up TDN pretty often and with PLD I'm usually rotating Sentinel and Bulwark. But personally I like that there are some common elements that tie the tanks together but enough that differentiates them.
“The rains have ceased, and we have been graced with another beautiful day. But you are not here to see it.”
Because it's subjective. Whenever we say anything is "required" in a game, we mean "Required to have fun", so there is going to be a subjective element to it as what is fun is subjective. "Easily understood" is also subjective. That's why this is pointless. I can point to dozens of mechanics and you can say "Well I can do that without a mod" and it really becomes totally pointless. You don't care about stun/interrupt addons, for example, and I've been in guilds that required them because of the difference they make, and nearly everyone seriously doing pvp uses them. Can you TECHNICALLY do everything without them? Sure, but it is dishonest to pretend that the game is not designed around the level of information and reaction time that addons enable, even if using them is not TECHNICALLY required in fringe cases where people want to make the game significantly harder for themselves.
Welcome to WoW? These problems are more prevalent in mid-range guilds. That's where the toxicity problem is in general. At high levels, there's an assumption that since you can do your job you don't need to be managed.sidebar though, what fucking toxic shit guilds were you in that policed your mods? I raided top 20 US, and no one did that with us, you either did your job well or got sat?
[*]Glamour Log (yes I know spaghetti code, but it's not a valid excuse, fix the fucking code)[*]Better netcode (stop developing a global game based on JP geography)
I think that "The game should run better" isn't really a valid thing to say we should take from WoW. That's not a WoW feature.
Game design isn't modular. You can't just say you want more synergy and depth (like WoW) and pretend the rest of WoWs class design doesn't exist. WoW's class design paradigm also causes terrible balance, a reliance on RNG elements, homogenization, etc.. If those problems could be easily sliced off the WoW design paradigm, the WoW team would have fixed it years ago.[*]More synergy/depth inside job kits (I don't need 12 buttons that do absolutely no function but deal flat damage, or 4 tank cooldowns that do the exact same thing)
Not a WoW feature. "Make things better" isn't a feature from another game.[*]Better designed Healer/Tank paradigms (Give tanks more agency over their damage and mitigation)
I don't really know what this means.[*]Scalable content (They spend all these resources making content so insular; design it so that it can be successfully used for multiple player types instead of just 1 and expand on it, don't just abandon it)
This also is not really a WoW feature, because you aren't asking for the WoW raid model.[*]More bosses in raids (FF14 raids always have weird difficulty curves, 1-2 usually too easy, 3 a minor wall, and then 4 is like lolwut). Ideally I'd like to see maybe 6 bosses in total to flesh out the curve a bit better.
Not a WoW feature.[*]I'd personally like to see more fatigue based mechanics in encounters rather than hard fails (I do think hard fails are important, but you don't need a full swing in either direction)
If you mean a better way to tie announcements to abilities without handicapping them, sure. If you mean more ability to automate combat, god no.[*]A proper macro system
Not interested in RNG.[*]Better Tank swap mechanics and more randomly based ones.
I don't disagree that FF14 has homogenization issues with tanks and healers, but borrowing from an even more homogenized game doesn't solve that.I kept the points fairly simple, because going in depth would get long, but if any feel worthy of elaborating on, let me know; but yes, a lot of this is just polish, but polish is super important. There are however 2 points I wanted to separate out as I think they're a bit more important.
1) You say that WoW is all homogenized coked out glass cannons. Regardless of that statements validity (I don't have the experience in every class to make that call), I can tell you that healing and tanking (a huge pain point in FF14 for me personally) is so offensively homogenized that it boils my blood. It's why half the points above talk about making things different/better for them. I actually think DPS classes are in great shape in FF14 (except SMN).
Customization like this is bad, bad news for a game like this. It causes nothing but trouble, as we can see in WoW where it is a constant source of pain and contention. It's a classic "good idea on paper".2) Materia is an absolute crime and should be way more interesting. (This would be the "talent" system you are afraid of). My vision for this system would exist where tanks/healers are NOT homogenized and are very unique and that you could use different materia combinations to get functions/features that you wanted from other jobs or retool existing abilities to new functions.
It won't make the game better. It will sound good and then it will make the game obnoxious and imbalanced and nearly everyone will just copy from a guide anyway. It's a waste of resources.The idea would be something like different tiers of gear would have different socket choices (color/# to make gearing slightly more interesting, but STILL be simple enough that generally ilvl is king like today since people DO like that). You could supplement this with the existing flat boring stat materia too, so that it's a mix of both.
"stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
-ynnady
The problem is an enormous portion of my abilities either have an incredibly boring or binary function with almost no synergy or depth. Fast Blade, Fight or Flight, Total Eclipse, Shield Lob, Shield Oath, Royal Authority/Rage of Halone, Sentinel/Rampart, Holy Spirit, Holy Circle.
Then you have these fake depth abilities like Circle of Scorn, Goring Blade, where it just is a maintenance DoT. You make sure one is up all the time and the other you just make sure you press it on CD or use on adds if you can delay without losing a cast. Then there's the other fake depth "restores MP" abilities like Riot Blade, Atonement, Prominence, Spirits Within, etc. These restore MP abilities don't actually matter because there's no clever usage that allows you to use this resource differently than any other player because they're passively generated and the rotation is designed with it in mind. So even though these 6 other abilities have some additional feature to it, they are no better than the first 10 I gave as examples.
Then there's the Oath gauge which is pretty much useless because you only have 3 spenders where one is near useless now, but the other 2 are decent. I think this ties in with point #2.
To add from above, sure I can use my CDs effectively, but it's a binary decision. Use it at this time, or else. Ideally I'd like to see more oGCDs that influence resource generation, and in turn have that resource be used to further mitigate damage, or increase outgoing damage. In summary I think a more volatile resource and more oGCD choices that offer different tools for more varied situations would be better for giving tanks more choice and depth.As a tank I very often feel like I have a pretty good amount of agency over the amount of damage I'm taking. I'm actually curious what you would prefer or what you feel currently so I can understand where you are coming from on this one.
Even with brute forcing learning a savage encounter by repeatedly ressing you still rarely fail from fatigue. It's still almost always for X mechanic you have to have 8 people or you wipe so that's the breaking point. I'm talking about failing because healers are actually OOM and not at 97.9% MP despite not missing a single GCD. I'm talking about shit we ran out of space because we didn't do enough DPS. Stuff like that.I'd argue the fact that you can rez people and push through the fight with the weakness effect leads to a bit more of a loss due to fatigue rather than anything that's like a "oh you missed the mechanic? Everyone is dead now." Once again I haven't done Ultimate so I could be unqualified for this answer.
Firstly Shirk sucks and doesn't need to exist and is especially annoying with the macro system. Just make Provoke generate 1000% threat for 9s after casting or something. Problem solved. Also helps rid of the button bloat. That's not the issue though, I'm speaking about tank swap mechanics just being boring as fuck and not interesting. It's always just taunt at X stack, or swap to invuln. I want stuff like:I find Provoke and Shirk work pretty well? Is there something that you find clunky about it? In my time in ES9-ES11 I've not had any issues coming from tank swaps.
- Boss hits hard and frequently. You would alternate based on the inability for a healer to stabilize a tank's health pool, this would give time to let the other tank recover slowly over time.
- Boss hits a tank with a debuff that enables them to do XYZ mechanic. I.e. Clear void zones, kill certain adds, survive XYZ. Maybe the debuff causes a rapid HP drain on the tank, thus having them tank and soak the debuff simultaneously, would be incredibly difficult to deal with.
- Periodic add spawns during boss fight (not intermission style that is commonly used) that give a reason to swap tanks or pull a tank off normal duty.
- Boss hits MT and then puts a very heavy DoT on them that heals the boss for every % of health drained (so lower player HP less boss gets healed). If the tank gets healed above 66% while debuff is active, the debuff spreads to the target who healed them above that threshold, hitting them incredibly hard and putting the same DoT on them.
- Let's say that every time the boss auto-attacks it gains a stacking damage buff and attack speed buff, but it also takes x% more damage the higher its stacks. It resets his stacks on aggro switch.
I'm tired of tankbusters being so scripted and so easily planned for. I'd like to see more dynamic play and pressure and tanking kits updated to reflect that.
Certainly possible. I'd support it obviously.I do like the idea of Materia mattering a bit more. Even in FF7 Materia giving you stat boosts is the secondary benefit. Giving you extra abilities or spells is the main idea. I do see them playing with the idea obviously in Eureka and Bozja for letting you customize a loadout. I wonder if they're testing the ideas before committing it into the main game.
This is my main complaint. I don't even mind that the story requires going through linearly, but I hate that it gates stuff. When I stopped playing, I was near the end of ARR, but my main jobs were all mid-50's and all the crafting stuff that I loved doing required mats that I literally couldn't access because the zones didn't unlock.