Activision's Diversity Space tool...

[arkanon]

Arguing the numbers, when the point was those are the groups targeted by "trans" BS. Yes, teenage girls, middle aged men, and those particularly with autism-spectrum disorders seemed to be pulled into it. Again, that's published information. Not controversial, and your gotchas are moot.

Interesting that I provided medical institute links, and you just go with "trust me bro, im right" while ignoring all the other points. Provide a link, from a reputable source, that confirms your assertion that "trans people target those with autism, and adjustment disorder".

Your argument was NOT that they target those groups, it was that they target those groups because teenagers and middle age men suffer from mental illness - you then specifically mentioned adjustment disorder. Just remember - you put them in the exact same catagory as those suffering from autism, without any distinction at all - literally a list - "teenagers, autistic people, and middle aged men".

[loras]

the problem with diversity check lists is that it is a very poor representation of life. they go above and beyond to have an equal amount of everything, when the world has 10% or less that are letter people. yet media and the entertainment industry has it pushing to look like 60%+ are letter people.
its hard not to think gnarly agendas are working with such eschewed, hypocritical casting priorities.

In practice it is even fewer, especially if you go beyond the first "b" of the lgbtwtfbbq you'll not find more than one in a thousand, especially if you consider the mistaken bandwagon types that detransition.

But really the worst part of it is trying to stratify people's thought processes.
I do not condone that shit for religious purposed, i don't condone it fot ideological purposes, and i won't condone it for whatever the "purpose" of this particular attempt is supposed to be.

[Super Dickmann]

the problem with diversity check lists is that it is a very poor representation of life. they go above and beyond to have an equal amount of everything, when the world has 10% or less that are letter people. yet media and the entertainment industry has it pushing to look like 60%+ are letter people.
its hard not to think gnarly agendas are working with such eschewed, hypocritical casting priorities.

10% is a massive overstatement. The absolute highest projection, based on self-identification would put the US rate at 3.5% gay and 0.3% trans and even that is likely overstated. Projecting the demographics of an office building and consequently a TV show in a downtown metropolitan area to a whole country would have you thinking that 50% of the UK is black and a quarter is gay.

[Orby]

So they want to break stereotype roles by creating a stereotype role machine? Or at least force in roles where you never wanted. As a Bi/pan guy I am all for diversity, but this isn't it, or maybe I read the post wrong but I have read it through twice, and it looks creepy. Imagine having my own sexual orientation used in such a ham fisted way. I think Blizzard mean well but this just sounds very dystopian. Let characters breath naturally. have an idea for them and if they are gay, black, or whatever, then let them be that, this machine is just all shades of eww.

although if you can make a machine like this, make a machine that builds character or creates better stories, Blizzards biggest issue isn't their lack of diversity its their lack of character :P

[Linkedblade]

Interesting that I provided medical institute links, and you just go with "trust me bro, im right" while ignoring all the other points. Provide a link, from a reputable source, that confirms your assertion that "trans people target those with autism, and adjustment disorder".

Your argument was NOT that they target those groups, it was that they target those groups because teenagers and middle age men suffer from mental illness - you then specifically mentioned adjustment disorder.

These two link transgenderism and autism:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32770077/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30062396/

Teenagers:
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0202330

[arkanon]

These two link transgenderism and autism:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32770077/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30062396/

Teenagers:
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0202330

Bro, you MUST read the things you link, AND ensure they actually relate to your claim. Your claim was NOT that transgender people are more likely to SUFFER from autism, and yet thats specifically what your first link is about, and EVEN THEN this is what they have to say about it:

"It is unclear whether transgender and gender-diverse individuals have elevated rates of autism diagnosis or traits related to autism compared to cisgender individuals in large non-clinic-based cohorts"

This has NOTHING to do with them "targeting" people who suffer from autism, but being more likely to themselves suffer from it, and even then it is inconclusive.

Your second link is the same - it has NOTHING to do with being "targeted" by trans people, and makes this EXTREMELY clear in the first sentence: "Prior research has shown an elevation in autism traits and diagnoses in individuals seen for gender related consultation and in participants self-identifying as transgender."

The third link is YET AGAIN the same thing - nothing to do with targeting anyone, but rather an investigation into whether autism is more common in trans people.

You could not be further off base if you tried.

Unless you are claiming that there is some otherworldly entity PREYING on people with mental illness, as it IS widely accepted that those suffering from one mental illness do seem more likely to suffer from additional mental illnesses.

[Super Dickmann]

The third link is YET AGAIN the same thing - nothing to do with targeting anyone, but rather an investigation into whether autism is more common in trans people.

You could not be further off base if you tried.

If you bothered to read further down than the first sentence, you'd realize that what you're quoting is the premise, whereas this is the summary of the conclusion:

Compared to cisgender individuals, transgender and gender-diverse individuals have, on average, higher rates of autism, other neurodevelopmental and psychiatric diagnoses. For both autistic and non-autistic individuals, transgender and gender-diverse individuals score, on average, higher on self-report measures of autistic traits, systemizing, and sensory sensitivity, and, on average, lower on self-report measures of empathy.

Transsexuality is comorbid with autism, and the second one even begins with that as the premise and confirms it:

Prior research has shown an elevation in autism traits and diagnoses in individuals seen for gender related consultation and in participants self-identifying as transgender. To investigate this relationship between autism and gender identity from a new angle, we compared the self-reported autism traits and sensory differences between participants with autism who did or did not identify with their assigned sex (i.e. cisgender or trans and non-binary, respectively). We found broad elevation of most cognitive autism traits in the trans and non-binary group (those who identified with a gender other than their assigned gender), and lower visual and auditory hypersensitivity.

As for a scientific study showing that the main ones being advertised to are autists, you'll quite obviously not find something peer reviewed on that thread as that would require starting out from the premise that transsexuality is in large part a social contagion and you'd hardly even be able to get a word in edge-wise before you're not only denied funding but fed to the twitterati.

[arkanon]

If you bothered to read further down than the first sentence, you'd realize that what you're quoting is the premise, whereas this is the summary of the conclusion:



Transsexuality is comorbid with autism, and the second one even begins with that as the premise and confirms it:

ok, so you ARE claiming that there is some otherworldly entity PREYING on people with mental illness, and "infecting" them with being gay/trans, as it IS widely accepted that those suffering from one mental illness do seem more likely to suffer from additional mental illnesses.

[Super Dickmann]

ok, so you ARE claiming that there is some otherworldly entity PREYING on people with mental illness, and "infecting" them with being gay/trans, as it IS widely accepted that those suffering from one mental illness do seem more likely to suffer from additional mental illnesses.

I'm saying that autists are easier to convince that they're trans. What the studies are saying is that transsexuals are more likely than other groups to be autistic.

[exochaft]

I think there's a big misconception here: it's not a a demand and/or outcry from the fans for more diversity... it's the developers. Even the article starts off with the survey that has nothing to do with what players want, it's purely the developers' desires at companies. From the links provided in the article, the big takeaway is that it comes off as a highly suspect survey with the main intent to find a certain outcome. Now what does that mean exactly?

Well, let's look at this in a similar manner as how political polls and surveys are done. Most people think the results are just someone calling up X number of people, asking them questions, then giving you the results... but that's not what happens. To narrow down to where this is important with respect to the survey upon which this thread is based, we'll focus on determining if your sample is actually representative of the populace (or in this case, the gaming dev community) and whether the answers you get mean what you think they mean.

While this survey shows a breakdown of who responded, it's questionable whether it means anything or actually represents reality. From the source, about 30% of the respondents were management, 20% were devs, and the rest were other various jobs or unemployed. Now, to give you the political equivalent in the US, let's just say a survey had 30% Democrats respond, 20% Republicans respond, and 50% as Independent/other respond. Just by itself, that means nothing. For example, people that tend to respond to surveys don't necessarily represent their broad constituency (and often don't). When it comes to party breakdown, Dems tend to be more receptive to answering random surveys than Republicans do, so it's usually a struggle to find more Republican responses (general idea is that Republican/Independent-leaning people tend to not want to talk about politics to others). To tie this into the survey, it mentions waaaaay at the end that a considerable amount of people asked don't even respond to this survey, or start but fail to finish. Basically, that means that the responses received probably only represent the most outgoing or vocal people, and probably doesn't represent people who don't like surveys, think the survey is stupid and just didn't finish it, it could be any number of reasons. However, what separates good pollsters and surveys from those are bad are the ones who can use their imperfect data and model it to represent reality as best as possible. From reading their report, it's obvious there's no mention of even attempting something of this nature. They don't even provide breakdowns of certain factors that may heavily impact their responses, such as political affiliation.

Furthermore, there wasn't any list of the specific questions asked, only a generalized statement for their subsections. That's very misleading, because what questions are asked and how they are phrased means EVERYTHING. There were signs in the survey that suggested some twisting of narratives towards something favorable for the report (as it clearly has a goal in mind that it strives to prove via the survey), and a lack of specific verbiage in terms of what was asked just supports this idea even more. Again, this is something that political pollsters and surveys use (and a trick a lot of mainstream media pulls to push a narrative) to get the results you're looking for. Sure, you can over-sample people, but you could also try to phrase a question to get a favorable result... or in the case of a good pollster/survey, get a more refined answer to better reflect reality. As an example in politics, sometimes you will get radically different responses about a candidate when you ask a person if you have a favorable opinion of them versus how they view the candidates performance on a specific topic(s), or compared to another candidate. If you're a bit on the shady side, you'll keep your questions vague or nebulous so that you may get a response that you want as a pollster/survey but it may not represent reality.

So anyways, that was a bit of a rabbit hole, but what was the point? The point is that the premise of the entire article itself is likely flawed and not representative of reality. They even had to go back and issue an edit to clarify some points, because I guess people were taking it out of context or not responding well to the article... however, that kind of reveals their motivations. Basically, the edits stress that this is just one tool of many to determine changes necessary, and not an official "tool" yet. One can read between the lines on this one, and that would be the people who are reading and responding to this publication are not happy and probably don't necessarily agree with the direction the industry may be going.

However, I have the perfect solution for the gaming industry: stop focusing on stuff that doesn't matter, and focus on making the games fun, the stories coherent, and so forth. Focusing on identity politics may score you points on social media, but that's not what drives your average person to buy a game. The idea that you cannot relate to a game/character/etc. unless they represent you is just foolish nonsense that was spouted by white and black supremacists a half a century ago in the US... basically it's a view of people who only see people by the color of their skin, not the content of their character.

[arkanon]

I'm saying that autists are easier to convince that they're trans. What the studies are saying is that transsexuals are more likely than other groups to be autistic.

Provide a SINGLE link that says those who are autistic are "more easily convinced they are trans". Just ONE link. Not one drawing a correlation, but one proving CAUSATION.

As it stands, this is your argument - "all trans people drink water - therefore water is PREYING on people and CONVINCING them they are trans".

[Orby]

Also this system could work for something like Overwatch (as pictured) which is generally about people from every part of the world, so using it for something like this could work, I see this as something good for something like that.

But if I created a group of adventures from one place of 4 dudes, 3 women, this system would then run over this and mix them into a hodge podge of cultural and sexual pick n mix?

[uuuhname]

If you bothered to read further down than the first sentence, you'd realize that what you're quoting is the premise, whereas this is the summary of the conclusion:



Transsexuality is comorbid with autism, and the second one even begins with that as the premise and confirms it:

quick question; who the fuck cares.

not a whole lot of commenting on this being an easily thrown around headline Blizzard is using to farm for some semblance of sympathy, all while doing.... what? to fix the problems of the company. and just a whole bunch of the same talking points I hear from all the wrong people, all the time.

[Goatfish]

so that makes it okay? I legit do not understand any of the thought process going on here, because it seems like there isn't any.

imagine it's 2006 and instead of talking about how icky and gross Trans people are you're talking about how straight people think gay people are gross, and that's completely valid. you then try to tell me how these situations are different in any meaningful way.

It does make it ok. It doesn't make it desirable, but it definitely validates those feelings that even you are displaying right now. Your attitude here is bigoted, and that's ok because that's just how people work. It doesn't magically turn you into something evil that we need to dispel from society, it's just something we have to learn to live alongside.

I never said trans people were icky or gross. I'm not sure who you are talking to. If I did, which I don't, it would also be valid even if you don't find it desirable. You don't get to control how I feel about something. This coming from someone who was getting called slurs for being gay in 2006, I don't have to imagine it.

there is literaly no reason why a normal person that doesnt hate gay people would complain about the existance of a gay person in media,by making bs statement like ''they are forced on them''

cmon...atleast try not to seem dishonest

and yes i know some people in the lgbtq dislike trans people,but those people arent trying to hide it wile being blatantly against them

also the comunist comparison isnt a good one,comunism has a demonstrable negative impact on people or society,i wouldnt be friends with a serial killer,its a common bigoted trope to compare gay people with something thats actualy bad,nice try

There is plenty of reason. Dumbledore being gay has nothing to do with the story. You aren't arguing with bigots, you're talking down to nerds who don't like seeing the franchises they enjoy focus on a part of the story that is only put in place for vocal fanfiction writers and DEI cultists. These people don't care about your social interaction bullshit, they just want to kill pixels, see cool fantasy, compete with others and hang out with friends.

I think the thing you misunderstand is that all of these people you are pretending is against them, actually instead wants to help them. The social activism around trans makes them look like freaks and groomers. A big part of this is because the internet pushes things to the most radical edges for clicks and shock value. Online trans activism is an absolute insane shit show full of a lot of bad actors that end up getting protected by people like you who don't seem to understand why other people feel how they do.

I thought it was a good comparison. I find communism dangerous and potentially evil and an awful lot of people would argue with me about that. Some people find the LGBT propaganda dangerous and potentially evil, and here you are arguing with them. I don't think they are necessarily doing evil on purpose, but they definitely have a reckless disregard for the effects of social influence and a consistent misrepresentation of the dangers of transitioning.

[uuuhname]

I'm saying that autists are easier to convince that they're trans. What the studies are saying is that transsexuals are more likely than other groups to be autistic.

another quick question, when has anyone else influenced your sexuality?

[arkanon]

another quick question, when has anyone else influenced your sexuality?

No, apparently its not other people PREYING on those individuals, its "trans" itself - like, its an entity........

[Super Dickmann]

Provide a SINGLE link that says those who are autistic are "more easily convinced they are trans". Just ONE link. Not one drawing a correlation, but one proving CAUSATION.

As it stands, this is your argument - "all trans people drink water - therefore water is PREYING on people and CONVINCING them they are trans".

I'm not playing gotcha with you and already addressed this. A study on predominantly autistic men won't be made until well after the autopsy is being done on this social craze.

As for a scientific study showing that the main ones being advertised to are autists, you'll quite obviously not find something peer reviewed on that thread as that would require starting out from the premise that transsexuality is in large part a social contagion and you'd hardly even be able to get a word in edge-wise before you're not only denied funding but fed to the twitterati.

You can see for yourself that autism cohabits with transsexuality. You can also read about ROGD as it affects another group pliable to this kind of social pressure, namely teenage girls. You'll have to do the math for yourself on why people with a disorder that hampers them socially would be easier to sway into seeing transsexuality as the way out.

[uuuhname]

It does make it ok. It doesn't make it desirable, but it definitely validates those feelings that even you are displaying right now. Your attitude here is bigoted

do you know what words mean?

point to what I have said and done so far to be "bigoted" beyond asking you totally valid questions, what's with the victim complex?

no, you're arguing that treating groups of people like shit is a valid stance to have. I don't accept that, no one should.

- - - Updated - - -

No, apparently its not other people PREYING on those individuals, its "trans" itself - like, its an entity........

a literal boogieman... shocker.

[arkanon]

I'm not playing gotcha with you and already addressed this. A study on predominantly autistic men won't be made until well after the autopsy is being done on this social craze.



You can see for yourself that autism cohabits with transsexuality. You can also read about ROGD as it affects another group pliable to this kind of social pressure, namely teenage girls. You'll have to do the math for yourself on why people with a disorder that hampers them socially would be easier to sway into seeing transsexuality as the way out.

So does drinking water, having two hands, having a name, the ability to speak. Correlation does NOT equal CAUSATION. You cant link anything because it simply doesn't exist. You are wrong. Move on.

[Super Dickmann]

quick question; who the fuck cares.

not a whole lot of commenting on this being an easily thrown around headline Blizzard is using to farm for some semblance of sympathy, all while doing.... what? to fix the problems of the company. and just a whole bunch of the same talking points I hear from all the wrong people, all the time.

It's fuck all to do with the actual Blizzard diversity-o-meter, but I'm bored and the topic had long since moved about arguing about autism, which is still slightly less embarrassing than Blizzard trying to advertise this thing as a bold step forward.

another quick question, when has anyone else influenced your sexuality?

Transsexuality, contrary to the name, isn't a sexuality and paraphilias are partly social. You won't know if you don't enjoy some things until you try them, and to try them you have to be exposed to them.