New spec type could increase chances for future 4th specs?

[krazzix20]

Augmentation, currently labeled just as "Damage", I think this role may end up with specific 4th role specification. Role "Damage" is the closest so far as it will cover Damage slot in Dungeon Finder + his goal is to achieve team's higher damage dealt output, but gameplaywise it seems more similar to Healer role.

If this concept will be successful and popular, then there will be a need to add more specs of this role, even if it won't be mandatory. Then being locked only to one class (and race) won't be enough for a longer timeframe. That's why I think that 4th spec thing that people like to speculate are now more possible then ever. Previously I wasn't fan of it as "third damage" or giving tank for everybody who don't have it would make class fantasy less unique (which is happening a bit due to race restrictions changes) and dilute them even more. Currently I may welcome this idea if potential 4th specs would be this new "Offensive Support" role. As a shaman main I think I could welcome 4th earth-themed spec as such support more then a tank.

What do you think about it? Which classes could receive such a role. How much we would need them? Surely less then any other, but I think future could give us more then just Augmentation.

Time mage fits the support role perfectly and would give blizz an excuse to give mages real heals/defensives

I'd love to see a warrior spec use ranged weapons and focus on powering up morale of allies etc, could fit a support niche

Shaman tank while we're adding specs..

[Thirtyrock]

I do not think it will add a change for it.

But it does give a opening for new classes. But also it gives less options if to many classes have them. 10 buff classes and you run out of buffs pretty fast.

classses who will not get:
- Druid: already have 4. and most of them under perform half the time
- warlocks, rogues, mages, hunters: they can barely make all 3 of those function to be different enough. ( side note, mages and hunters could get 1 of their specs re rolled into this).
- warrior, can not see the theme for them.

Very unlikely classes:
- priest. 2 healers and 1 dps and 1 buff class. to much i think.

more likely:
- paladin
- monk
- shaman
- dk


most likely:
- DH....a 2 class, class . Who might need more classy movies.

Some of these are ones I've seen bandied around, some of these are my ideas/preferences -
Warlocks - Demonology tank spec has been a LONG time ask. I think you could differentiate it enough from DHs to make it worthwhile. Imagine you change into different types of demon forms for different abilities and/or you resummon your pets as part of your active mitigation
Warriors - Sword and Board dps
Paladins - Sword and Board dps, DPS support spec
Mages - Arcane type support spec, time maniuplation based healer spec
DH - Ranged dps (hunter type as opposed to a caster) is the only thing I can see here. I'd like a 3rd spec, as it's my main right now, but I don't know what fits.

[Triceron]

I really dont care what other people would or wouldn't.
I like tanking but a lot of currently available tank specs are boring for me - either gameplay mechanics or general theme.

Having a shaman, rogue, warlock and hunter tank spec would be great for my queue times, while also allowing me to continue playing the DPS specs i like when its convenient.

Yes but their tank specs would become equally boring, because tanking spec would be designed around boring gameplay. It's not the specs that are the problem as much as the role itself.

They're not gonna go out of their way and have Rogues stealth while tanking and employ combat rotations that are engaging and fun. You're gonna be given the same tank survival cooldowns, spamming threat generators with no real rotation to adhere to. Tanking is a very well defined system they're not going to veer heavily from.

It isn't going to somehow become more fun just because it's on your preferred class. It's not like Prot Paladin is more fun than Prot Warrior because someone happens to enjoy Ret gameplay over any of the Warrior specs. Any tank spec can be considered boring when compared to ANY DPS spec.

[Thirtyrock]

Not sure how damage meters would parse it out, it would have to estimate if it wanted to provide something bsck to the Evoker.

It could always just be lumped in to the player who receives the buff, like PI probably gets calculated to the player rather than the Priest. I guess it would be a case by case scenario

I think it will have to be some combination of the two for the logs to be useful. You see added damage on the player as a separate category on their dps and you see "value added" on the Evoker.

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Yes but their tank specs would become equally boring, because tanking spec would be designed around boring gameplay. It's not the specs that are the problem as much as the role itself.

It isn't going to somehow become more fun just because it's on your preferred class. Tank spec is completely different from DPS specs, and that's already true for all existing Tank viable classes. It's not like Prot Paladin is more fun than Prot Warrior because someone happens to enjoy Ret gameplay over any of the Warrior specs. Prot Paladin can be equally as boring as Prot Warrior when compared to ANY DPS spec.

Hey, you take that back, tanking is awesome!

But for real, it's just such a different mindset. You're paying attention to different things at different times. I've played both at relatively high levels and I don't really feel one is harder than the other. Keeping up with my DPS rotation was very difficult at first, compared to my tanking rotation, but I don't have to worry about the position of the entire raid/group. I don't have to worry about tons of things as a DPS that I had to worry about as a tank, but I have a more complicated rotation and have to know better when to use abilities so as not to waste burn windows.

I 100% agree that people who don't like ANY of the 6 tank specs are unlikely to like a tank spec (or healing spec) added to their pure dps class.

[Triceron]

Hey, you take that back, tanking is awesome!

Don't get me wrong, I love tanking and have been a main tank through all the time I've played WoW. Been a 'Guardian' Druid since Vanilla, tanking whenever I had the chance to. The response was just being tailored to someone who thinks the existing tank specs are boring, and somehow believes giving them to other classes will somehow change that perception.

I 100% agree that people who don't like ANY of the 6 tank specs are unlikely to like a tank spec (or healing spec) added to their pure dps class.

This is how I feel.

If people really want to tank, they can. The idea that 'I can't tank because my class doesn't allow it' is nothing more than an excuse of inconvenience. No different to me than 'I don't tank because I don't have the gear'.

[Thirtyrock]

Don't get me wrong, I love tanking and have been a main tank through all the time I've played WoW. Been a 'Guardian' Druid since Vanilla, tanking whenever I had the chance to. The response was just being tailored to someone who thinks the existing tank specs are boring, and somehow believes giving them to other classes will somehow change that perception.

This is how I feel.

If people really want to tank, they can. The idea that 'I can't tank because my class doesn't allow it' is nothing more than an excuse of inconvenience. No different to me than 'I don't tank because I don't have the gear'.

Well, OK then. So long as we agree that tanking is awesome.

[huth]

I'm not going to hold my breath for any new specs on existing classes. If anything they will retool existing specs into support roles, probably the least played and/or most annoying specs to balance.

Most likely from classes that have 3 DPS specs already. Mages, Rogues, Warlocks. Maybe a Bard class.

[Ielenia]

Augmentation, currently labeled just as "Damage", I think this role may end up with specific 4th role specification. Role "Damage" is the closest so far as it will cover Damage slot in Dungeon Finder + his goal is to achieve team's higher damage dealt output, but gameplaywise it seems more similar to Healer role.

If this concept will be successful and popular, then there will be a need to add more specs of this role, even if it won't be mandatory. Then being locked only to one class (and race) won't be enough for a longer timeframe. That's why I think that 4th spec thing that people like to speculate are now more possible then ever. Previously I wasn't fan of it as "third damage" or giving tank for everybody who don't have it would make class fantasy less unique (which is happening a bit due to race restrictions changes) and dilute them even more. Currently I may welcome this idea if potential 4th specs would be this new "Offensive Support" role. As a shaman main I think I could welcome 4th earth-themed spec as such support more then a tank.

What do you think about it? Which classes could receive such a role. How much we would need them? Surely less then any other, but I think future could give us more then just Augmentation.

"Increase the likelihood"? I suppose. But we don't know by how much, though. Also, "need them"? We don't "need" anything. It could be fun getting a Gladiator-- i.e. sword and board DPS-- for the fighter. I like the idea of being offensive with a shield instead of always defensive.

And this is off-topic, but a support (or pseudo-support) spec for the evokers could also make a class concept always wrongly maligned for "always being support" such as the bard more likely as well.

[Teriz]

No, I don’t think we’re getting 4th specs. However if successful, Augmentation could offer an interesting form of DPS for future classes.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Which classes could receive such a role.

The usual requests.

Ranged spec for warrior that uses throwing spears/axes or bows/crossbows/guns. A warrior support spec would focus on the banners and shouts and use of instruments like drums or horns to give "orders" to allies (ie mark a target for death, target receives 20% extra damage for 20 seconds).

Blood Mage spec for Mages that allows them to siphon blood from enemies and give it to their allies to heal them. Could do health redistribution shennagains like the Shaman's spirit link totem. Could transfer diseases from team to enemies.

Rogue: could use shadow magic to heal or tank like the Specter elite spec for Thief in GW2 or the Ninja job in FF11.

More tank & healer specs would be so awesome, especially on the pure DPS classes who feel shafted by long queue timers unless you guild.

Pet tanking spec for Hunters and Warlocks seems pretty obvious. Control solutions for the pet have been discussed indepth before.

There are six tank specs in the game, and still a tank shortage. The problem is not a lack of specs, the problem is people don't want the responsibility / pressure of being the "leader" of the group.

Tanking is unpopular not solely because of the tanking role. It's unpopular because tanks also have to deal with complex boss mechanics that DPS don't, which is then compounded by the role. If Blizzard didn't overdesign their fights and make it so that you need a degree to understand what is going on and execute the fight, then there would be more people inclined to tank. Certain mechanics such as Aggramar's tankbuster/raid AoE combo are ununtuitive and not learned on the first try, but PUGs have a mercenary mentality where everyone is a cog in a machine to be replaced at the drop of a hat and you get kicked before you learn the mechanic. This past week I was in a group where the tanks where having difficulty figuring out how to do the seemingly simple task of surviving Neltharion's tank swap since they took instant 600,000 damage upon taunt before they could press their mitigation abilities.

I think you'd see players who already like tanking or healing shifting to those classes depending on playstyle and strengths/weaknesses in that role.

People are invested in their mains and don't want to abandon their main. GW2 learned that people were more likely to play a new playstyle if a new spec was added to the class they were already playing (ie, healing spec for thieves) than to drop the main they are invested in and roll a different class. That's why GW2 stopped adding new classes and went all in on adding a new spec for every class every expansion.

There are probably many rogue players out there who would be interested in healing, but they can't try out that playstyle on their Rogue and they're not going to walk away from their Rogue to grind up and gear another character they aren't invested in just to find out whether or not they like the playstyle.

Let's look at the popularity of the various thief elite specializations. 2015's HoT expansion introduced the Daredevil, a DPS elite spec in which the player jumps around. 2017's PoF expansion introduced the Deadeye, a ranged sniper specialization. 2022's End of Dragon expansion introduced the Specter, a single-target healing role.



Fractals: (Blizzard copy-pasted Fractals and renamed them Mythic+)
Specter: 3.67%
Deadeye: 0.37%
Daredevil: 0.45%

Strikes (single boss fight, like trials from FF14):
Specter: 2.28%
Deadeye: 0.75%
Daredevil: 0.93%

Raids:
Specter: 1.73%
Deadeye: 1.54%
Daredevil: 1.91%

In the case of Fractals and Strikes, Specter (heal role) is now more used than the other two specs combined, and in raids is still the most common Thief elite spec. So yes, a lot of people who might have initially picked a DPS only class would be interested in trying out other roles, provided that the character they are invested in can perform them.

There's a great deal of variety among the 6 tank specs and how they each play.

6 doesn't cover all aesthetics that a player might be into. Does the fantasy of tanking a boss alongside your beast or your demon appeal to you? The game does not provide that. Does the fantasy of using shadow magic to disappear as a giant Pitlord's blade slices down through your body and then reemerge unharmed sound cool? The game does not provide that. Do you want to be a Shaman or a Black Dragon that uses earth elemental magic to protect his allies? The game does not provide that. Do you want to be a Gnome piloting a sturdy mech holding the enemy's attention to protect his allies? The game does not provide that.

Being a vanilla sword and board warrior, a yellow paladin, a bear, a Death Knight who wields a two handed weapon, a monk who twirls around and fights with his fists, or a Demon Hunter wielding glaives and uses green abilities does not appeal to everyone.

[Thirtyrock]

snip

I hear you, but color me skeptical.

[baskev]

Some of these are ones I've seen bandied around, some of these are my ideas/preferences -
Warlocks - Demonology tank spec has been a LONG time ask. I think you could differentiate it enough from DHs to make it worthwhile. Imagine you change into different types of demon forms for different abilities and/or you resummon your pets as part of your active mitigation
Warriors - Sword and Board dps
Paladins - Sword and Board dps, DPS support spec
Mages - Arcane type support spec, time maniuplation based healer spec
DH - Ranged dps (hunter type as opposed to a caster) is the only thing I can see here. I'd like a 3rd spec, as it's my main right now, but I don't know what fits.

Think your ideas sound good but:
Warlock tank: most likely to close to Demon hunter tank
Warrior sword and board dps: you mean a tank dps. think with 2 dps specs and already a tank spec its nothing new
paladins S&B dps and support: first one same warrior, 2nd one...if they do it correctly could be a nice option.
Mages: NO, thats pretty much a evoker and a combo of its healer spec and its new spec.
DH RDPS: nope, to much like a warlock i think.

[Brazenclaw]

There are a lot of possibilities at least (Blood mages, Dark Shamans, Shadowhunters, Druids of the Flame/Fang, Warden Rogues, Holy Monks etc.), but a challange to make new things for all of these and make them distinct (if they don't massively prune again and take stuff from current specs). I think these should be more like skins of your spells and so on that can be achieved through quests/achievements/trading post, so one can get the fantasy of the character they want.

[Cosmic Janitor]

I kinda welcome them adding new specs to exiting classes, doing so with a hybrid role that will be super awkward to balance around though I do not.

[Unlimited Power]

Augmentation Evoker isn't a new spec type though.

Blizzard clearly doesn't see it that way either as they're adding new ways for combat logs to properly track the effects of Augmentation Evoker's buffs so the DPS can be properly attributed.

If anything, this is more likely to make the effects of things like PI and Windfury Totem be properly attributed to the caster of these buffs rather than their targets.

This isn't the end of the core trinity some are heralding it to be.

[SynDethroc]

Would absolutely LOVE a Bard support spec for rogue

[Gimlix]

It feels like we play two different games.

They already have a hard time as it is with balancing the specs / classes the game currently has. Not to mention creating anything new for the classes / specs. No way in hell they add MORE.

If anything, I could see everything converting into a hero class and only having 2 specs, i.e Warrior: Blademaster / Gladiator or what Demon Hunter is right now.

People make the balancing of specs much worse then it actually is. And once a spec is way overpowered or underpowered they pretty much nerf or boost it quickly to normal.

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(Blizzard copy-pasted Fractals and renamed them Mythic+).

Yeah let's totally ignore Challenge Mode which was the first form of M+ which was added in 2012.

[huth]

Yeah let's totally ignore Challenge Mode which was the first form of M+ which was added in 2012.

Not that anybody sensible ever thought of M+ as a groundbreaking innovation to begin with. Scaling difficulty levels are hardly an idea people only came up with in the last decade and neither are extra mods to increase difficulty.

[Zantos]

No, this wont increase chances. They already tried a 4th spec. Gladiator warriors were a 4th sub spec for warriors. It was a pure dps spec and it was toggled via a stance that you could get from a talent. I adored it. It was really fun and had an entirely new playstyle since it was the only dps in game to use a sword and a shield.. However, they ran into serious issues.

Balancing was the biggest problem they had. The talent changed everything for how the stats interact with prot warriors so that it would function in the dps capacity. Problem they ran into was that it wasn't scaling well. They never could figure out how to get it to scale properly.

The other issue was the community itself. People would constantly push back against gladiator warriors. They saw a warrior with a shield who was selected as dps and just assumed they were no good. Maybe someone hit dps/tank and didnt realize they were put in as a dps was a common thought.

That is why this wont increase those odds. They literally already tried in Warlords of Draenor and it flopped.

[Therougetitan]

Yes this likely means we are getting fourth specs in the sense that they will be adding support classes. They won't be adding tank/healer/pure dps to existing classes. But support-dps is a new thing that they can play around with. Depends on the class but there's some room for fantasy there. Evokers are a mid-ranged support so having a melee support seems natural not to mention just having a lot of options for it. Something like demon hunters inspiring those around them or a commanding those around them type of spec or maybe a red crane spec for Monk like Cranedancer. Could make up a lot of stuff for a support fantasy. Mage/priest/druid/paladin too all could have something created with support in mind.