SWTOR is an evolution, not a revolution

[Deleted]

I honestly thin the game is quite different from wow, sure alot of things might be done in a similar way, but hey, why invent the wheel again? From the little i played i like it, i believe tough that star wars might be the more casual game of them both, it's kind of a multiplayer game but it still feels a bit like a singleplayer game because of how they did quests and storyline.

I think i will at least give it a try and get a char to max level and then decide if i want to keep playing or not. I'ts nice with other options on the table than just wow!

[Sargerus]

I don't understand why people get so dramatic over a game ~_~ lol.

Didn't you heard? Games are serious business!

[Dylamoo]

I actually do have to agree with OP on this one. I will definitely be quitting WoW to play SW:ToR because the universe in WoW is changing in a way i don't like. However at the same time i'm leaving acknowledging that this game will be a WoW clone. All the idiots who disagree about it not being a WoW clone are just shifted into a horrible denial phase. The reason i choose to play SW:ToR again is because i just want to play a game with different lore, when MoP comes out i will probably try it out to see if i get a different feeling for the warcraft universe, i have no grudges on panda's being a playable race. I believe that panda's are less of a joke than people think and just because their was a movie about a kunfu panda doesn't mean they'll be anywhere near the same.

[Deleted]

It baffles me somewhat that SW:TOR heritage are Star Wars Galaxies and KOTOR. Both of these titles released in the previous year to World of Warcraft.

Its like for some idiots pea brains the gaming industry as a whole did not start until WoW.

[Eurhetemec]

How does stripping your talent system almost to nothingness make WoW's MoP system more advanced? Not saying that it's a bad thing, but they are getting rid of a lot of things, that's doesn't sound like advancement to me.

I think you misunderstand the new talent system in WoW. It's a huge advancement - all the stuff that you had to take in the old talent trees? You still get it, just automatically at a certain level. So there's no tedious fake-decisions and really pointless stuff with having to slowly put points in to get something up to 100% chance (when it really only works properly at 100%), and so on. If you go to the official MoP talent calc and look at the abilities you get for being spec'd X, all the stuff is still there, it's just automatic.

Instead you get really serious choices every 15 levels. Each of those choices, certainly for most classes, is between three AWESOME abilities. It's real "Butbutbut!" choice. Taking one is a REAL decision in most cases. Some are a bit more PvPish or PvEish, or a bit more Tankish or DPSish, but even then, there's pretty much a reason for all three specs (four for Druids) to look seriously at all three options.

I will not be playing MoP, as I am completely burned out on WoW, I think, but seriously is a LOT more advanced, because it's less pointless busywork and fake choices, and instead real, distinctive, character-defining choices that will make people go "Oh you chose that ability, that's awesome!", and so on.

[vizzle]

Didn't you heard? Games are serious business!
**

Yeah seriously.

I mean like, I'm going to pay 60 bucks for this game. The class stories will be worth it, leveling a few characters to 50 will be worth the 60 bucks. If I don't like the endgame, then I'll stop paying the 15 dollar subscription. It's that simple. It's not a full-on commitment, jeez. I really don't care if SW:TOR is cloning something or doesn't offer anything new to the MMO world. I don't care. The game is fun, and that's all that matters. If it stops being fun at max level, then so be it. I still have my life.

People are acting so serious about changing MMOs, like it's a marriage or something.

[Deleted]

We knew this from the start.

You were dissapointed because you expected something the game was never meant to be.

[JustintimeSS]

All the idiots who disagree about it not being a WoW clone are just shifted into a horrible denial phase.

Why am I an idiot because I don't think it's a clone? WoW didn't come first. It didn't invent hotkeys and it didn't invent MMO's. It's not a clone of WoW. It's a hotkey MMO that has similarities. Yet I'M the idiot for understanding that eh?

Ha, who knew. The SW junkies react exactly the same to someone expressing an opinion about SWTOR as the WoW fanboys do when someone expresses their opinion of WoW. Even down to the "We don't wan't you in X game community because what you say is annoying." Why is it so wrong to have an opinion? Why do people feel the need to jump all over someone who sees things differently? I guess I'm just glad its done equally.

Why don't you white knight for the people who disagree with his opinion and have their own opinion? Why is it so wrong to disagree and have your own opinion? Furthermore, don't generalize. Not everyone is an eccentric fanboy junkie nut. And just because someone disagrees with an opinion doesn't make them one.

[jayremy]

Action RPG is what I want, hitboxes and not targeting based gameplay.

I don't care for the trinity role system I want it gone entirely and smarter AI that assesses threat on players in a more advanced manner. People as always we be tanks or healers, but all as much as they choose to be and as much as they can help to.

Look to vindictus for reference of great syle of gameplay and controls I liked and expect to see in the future.

I am pretty sure what the OP is referring to is the combat system, combat wise SWTOR is very much indeed like WoW structured nearly the exact same WoW, similar features and abilities. The combat/gameplay experience will be the same and comparable. But beyond that I wouldn't try so hard to compare the two, but I do agree with the OP, however I will be playing it. There really is no innovation in their combat and player design/roles.


Expect those games to be GW2, TSW, Firefall(I think), Tera(I don't look forward too as of now) and KoA: Reckoning franchise(project "Capernicus"). These games I anticipate more than SWTOR.

[Scripts]

so that means blizzard is doing the right thing with MoP, because they are taking some huge risks there... complete talent revamp, pokemon-style petfights(even tho its optional), no big mainvillain from the start and so on.

Talent Revamp - This was their "big risk" with Cataclyscm. They found they didn't like how it turned out in Cata. They've decided that they need to spend more effort changing it again.

No Main Villian - they are going back to the Warcraft 1 and 2 days and are going to try and refocus players on the past wars between the Alliance and the Horde. I don't know how well that will work for those of us at max level in WoW. If they focused the old world rebuild on that, instead of "oh hey, look at all the bad things that happened when Deathwing showed up", I would have likely found that concept pretty engaging on my alts, which would have translated into interest on my main.

Pokemon battle system: I think they finally realized "Oh, wow, tons of people collect pets. Maybe we should do something with them, beside make them look cool".

Cata didn't grab me the way LK did. Maybe its because LK was the first expansion I was around. Maybe its because I was interested in the Arthas story from playing WC3. Maybe the story was just, idk, better than Deathwing's story.

If SWTOR doesn't grab me by the throat and keep me interested, maybe I'll go back to WoW with MoP. Maybe I'll find something else to play. Playing the beta was a breath of fresh air to me. Maybe that's just what some of us need right now, a breath of fresh air

[Roxinius]

I think you misunderstand the new talent system in WoW. It's a huge advancement - all the stuff that you had to take in the old talent trees? You still get it, just automatically at a certain level. So there's no tedious fake-decisions and really pointless stuff with having to slowly put points in to get something up to 100% chance (when it really only works properly at 100%), and so on. If you go to the official MoP talent calc and look at the abilities you get for being spec'd X, all the stuff is still there, it's just automatic.

Instead you get really serious choices every 15 levels. Each of those choices, certainly for most classes, is between three AWESOME abilities. It's real "Butbutbut!" choice. Taking one is a REAL decision in most cases. Some are a bit more PvPish or PvEish, or a bit more Tankish or DPSish, but even then, there's pretty much a reason for all three specs (four for Druids) to look seriously at all three options.

I will not be playing MoP, as I am completely burned out on WoW, I think, but seriously is a LOT more advanced, because it's less pointless busywork and fake choices, and instead real, distinctive, character-defining choices that will make people go "Oh you chose that ability, that's awesome!", and so on.

im sorry but calling dumbing it down a huge advancement is just lulz lets go from making it 41 point where people actually have to shape their characters to something less so any idiot can not feel confused

[Shamanberry]

All you have to do if you want to know how much this game is "WoW with lightsabers" is check the Sorcerer Lightning tree, and compare it with the Shaman Elemental tree. They basically turned it upside down, renamed some of the talents, and replaced Earthquake (Force Storm) with Thundering Blast (Lava Burst).

I'm not saying WoW with Lightsabers is a bad thing, don't get me wrong. But I do feel that once the newness of TOR wears off, people are going to find themselves with a choice, since you can't really commit to 2 MMOs at once: keep playing TOR, or go back to WoW, and there's no significant difference between the two, so that choice comes down to who does a better job.

So, I do see the OP's point - the choice of keep playing TOR vs go back to WoW, for a lot of people, will be decided by how well Bioware manages to challenge Blizzard at their own game, on what (by their design decision to basically make the same game in a lot of ways) will be even terms. Who makes better encounters, better end-game storylines, better set of "stuff" to do for casual players (which remember are the silent majority), and so on, will determine how much of the market TOR will capture - not the game system itself.

[Deleted]

You don't get what I'm saying: SWTOR is two games..

One, while leveling, rather excellent and much, much better than wow.
Other, at max level, the same as wow.

This is where I expected some advancement. At least public quests from War / Rift. Maybe even something new.

Oh look, operations/flashpoints have a story, so do wow raids and dungeons but they don't present it in cinematics..

Btw I meant those quality of loot based lights for looting but nvm.

[Legion]

All the idiots who disagree about it not being a WoW clone are just shifted into a horrible denial phase.

LOL, just lol.

I'm going to be an idiot, and disagree. I've played wow since mid BC. SWTOR is not wow's clone, by a longshot (trust me brah, I got this). Unless you're thinking "well, yeah, but wow's a video game and an mmorpg. So is swtor, therefore ->clone". No, not really.
On a more serious note, sure there are similarities, and I honestly wouldn't have it any other way. As I mentioned in another thread, I don't really like revolutionary. GW2 seems rather revolutionary, it just isn't my style.

[vizzle]

All you have to do if you want to know how much this game is "WoW with lightsabers" is check the Sorcerer Lightning tree, and compare it with the Shaman Elemental tree. They basically turned it upside down, renamed some of the talents, and replaced Earthquake (Force Storm) with Thundering Blast (Lava Burst).

I'm not saying WoW with Lightsabers is a bad thing, don't get me wrong. But I do feel that once the newness of TOR wears off, people are going to find themselves with a choice, since you can't really commit to 2 MMOs at once: keep playing TOR, or go back to WoW, and there's no significant difference between the two, so that choice comes down to who does a better job.

So, I do see the OP's point - the choice of keep playing TOR vs go back to WoW, for a lot of people, will be decided by how well Bioware manages to challenge Blizzard at their own game, on what (by their design decision to basically make the same game in a lot of ways) will be even terms. Who makes better encounters, better end-game storylines, better set of "stuff" to do for casual players (which remember are the silent majority), and so on, will determine how much of the market TOR will capture - not the game system itself.

If I stop playing TOR, there is no way in hell I would waste my life in WoW again

[Eurhetemec]

im sorry but calling dumbing it down a huge advancement is just lulz lets go from making it 41 point where people actually have to shape their characters to something less so any idiot can not feel confused

No, that's nonsense. It's not "dumbing down". Calling it that shows you genuinely don't get it. Right now, you're choosing when 3-9 points go per tree. Seriously. And they barely affect your character.

Making 6 big decisions is far less "dumb" than that. It has nothing to do with "idiots feeling confused", but if you think you have to be clever to deal with the current system, well, I'd laugh in your face. A monkey can follow a cookiecutter template.

[Gladiator2009]

Yeah it plays like WoW....and about 15 other MMO I've played over the years. That's why they're grouped together in the MMO genre, because inherently they're similar. Ironic how when WoW was in this phase of development people were making this exact same argument.

SW:ToR does some things better than WoW, and vice versa. You find what is important to you as a gamer and spend your time/money accordingly. It's not that hard.

[Thornstar]

while I think your overreacting allot I do not think we really know how raids will really go. The game is a big unknown at end game right now. Enjoy the leveling experience and story it offers and then worry about if your still having fun with the game. Dunno why everyone is so eager to cry wolf before the games even released.

[Roxinius]

No, that's nonsense. It's not "dumbing down". Calling it that shows you genuinely don't get it. Right now, you're choosing when 3-9 points go per tree. Seriously. And they barely affect your character.

Making 6 big decisions is far less "dumb" than that. It has nothing to do with "idiots feeling confused", but if you think you have to be clever to deal with the current system, well, I'd laugh in your face. A monkey can follow a cookiecutter template.

id much rather have to choose then have a company say of those arent important enugh for you to need to decide on so we will just give them too you im sorry but wow caters entirely too much to casuals anymore

[vizzle]

while I think your overreacting allot I do not think we really know how raids will really go. The game is a big unknown at end game right now. Enjoy the leveling experience and story it offers and then worry about if your still having fun with the game. Dunno why everyone is so eager to cry wolf before the games even released.

Because WoW has taught people that the game is a lifestyle, and choosing it means living and breathing the game. People have forgotten that games are just to have fun, and they don't have to be the best or the most innovative. They just need to be right for you.