There's a Difference Between Haters and Debaters.

[Cuchulainn]

Yes, it's this thread again, but this time with a twist! Huzzah!
I see so many Hate threads and threads questioning peoples hate. I even see stupid threads where people REALLY try to disprove a hater/lovers opinion. Wowee, you gotta love that crap, eh? I think the problem is no one here really knows the difference between what a hater and a debater is. Maybe I'm not getting the picture here. Do you guys think they're the same because both the words rhyme or something? I'm taking a leap here by trying to understand the minds of "WoW: Generation X". Anyway, here's the difference, guys. Get enlightened.

Debater:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3754796023

Hater:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3430803517

The more you know...

[Cuchulainn]

Having a Mass Hate just about makes sense if you really despise something, but i find a Mass Debate makes everything better.

(I feel sorry for you if all you heard was a *WHOOSH* noise)

Indeed, Mass Effect.
Even though I point out the difference between the two, I still think debating doesn't do much good at all. Especially in a community that's digressed to a irredeemable level of madness. You hate on something, you get happy people wishing you farewell. You debate something, you get butthurt fan boys missing the point and trying to sound clever. Don't forget the trolls, too.

C'est la vie.

[rawfulz]

regardless of all this "hate" game will still be boss

[Cuchulainn]

regardless of all this "hate" game will still be boss

To those who play it, yes. That's as far as your statement goes.

[Caiada]

When you reference any personal characteristics of those you are disagreeing with, you are a hater. I don't care how reasonable any other points are.

This thread is unnecessary and unhelpful.

[Doombringer]

There's definitely a difference between the "omg pandas are stupid" and "this could have been so much better if.." crowds.

Personally I think they could have had badass Pandaren and wise Pandaren, and let either choose whatever faction they wished. People would play both -- some like the "wizened warrior" type and some like the "savage warmonger" type, when it comes to characters.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

The debater is a debater, but a very jaded one. He borders the line of hate, only clinging to debater because he is willing to take dissent.

[Deleted]

Yes, it's this thread again, but this time with a twist! Huzzah!
I see so many Hate threads and threads questioning peoples hate. I even see stupid threads where people REALLY try to disprove a hater/lovers opinion. Wowee, you gotta love that crap, eh? I think the problem is no one here really knows the difference between what a hater and a debater is. Maybe I'm not getting the picture here. Do you guys think they're the same because both the words rhyme or something? I'm taking a leap here by trying to understand the minds of "WoW: Generation X". Anyway, here's the difference, guys. Get enlightened.

Debater:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3754796023

Hater:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3430803517

The more you know...

Both of those examples shown classic hater bias. Being skeptical is fine, but people on forums aren't being skeptical, they are completely hating on half of a concept (becuase we only no so much), and they dont know how this is practically going to turn out. I really hope those players that say they wont buy MOP dont buy it, because i know for a fact that the intelligence level of wow's player base will increase, making my enjoyment of wow 100x higher.

[Flaks]

The debater is a debater, but a very jaded one. He borders the line of hate, only clinging to debater because he is willing to take dissent.

The debater is a debater because he's willing to articulate his reasons for not disliking the game. Albeit the reasons aren't very sound and entirely opinionated. If he were to, say, mention that the expansion doesn't seem to follow any set archetype as per previous expansions in presenting a villain as the main focus of the expansion, he might have had a greater following.

But then again, the dislike of the game can be due to many differing reasons and his is as right as anyone else's. On the same token, anyone's preference for the game is just as right as someone else's dislike. Its basically just arguing two entirely different points from two entirely different perspectives.

[Mad_Murdock]

Indeed, Mass Effect.
Even though I point out the difference between the two, I still think debating doesn't do much good at all. Especially in a community that's digressed to a irredeemable level of madness.
C'est la vie.

The seeds of a good debate can often take time to grow. In my younger days, I was like most WoW (internet) folks and had really rigid, my answer is the only right answer attitude. Good debates that brought out multiple aspects on the subject, helped me grow and think in larger terms and see both sides of the coin, even if I don't agree with the other side. In some cases over the years, I've changed my view on certain things, because debates I had that challenged me enough to reconsider my position. That is where debates are at their best.

Hating serves little to no purpose, other then someone venting out their anger at whatever they are angry about. It's less about presenting an ideal or argument and more about expressing one's opinion in the least constructive way possible.

Maturity of the participants will have the greatest impact on debater vs hater threads

[Deleted]

One thing is for sure :
Debaters gonna debate.

[Deleted]

Oh, so because it's being called a debate it means we need to be super serious about it, and the people taking part are all grown ups... It's the same bullshit with "thats my opinion". I don't have to accept your opinion nor do I care for it.

QQIHATEPANDAZ is not a debate, it's childish whining over a computer game.

[Falarson]

It's cool they're talking their opinions, but I still think they did the right thing with the Pandaren. They're a very unique race, they have their ways set, and it wouldn't have worked out otherwise.
Their stablished imagery is well reflected ingame (as of MoP, and all we know). Any change to that would suffer from player's base bad opinions too (like the WC3 -> WoW Night Elves).

Ethereals, to take OP's example, are good option, but they wouldn't fit in this particular expansion. I say that his view of 'countering' a race with another is kinda flawed, because we already have that in MoP, is just a Class instead of a race. Don't want to play with Pandaren? Well, there's monks for tons of races, so you should try those out

Don't like any? Well, too bad. You may not like Worgen AND Goblins, so Cataclysm was bad for you too. There's no way to please everyone, but at least they're giving enough options to the playerbase.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Debate is like something I brought up in another thread about why we will not see features dropped. A point, and solid, provable facts (whether you like them or not) to support it.

Hating and Ranting is when you use invalid sources to claim a simple "this sucks".

[Senathor]

Haters: THIS FUCKING SHIT SUCKS ASS.

Debaters: I don't like this becuase etc

[Papalenin]

Indeed, Mass Effect.
Even though I point out the difference between the two, I still think debating doesn't do much good at all. Especially in a community that's digressed to a irredeemable level of madness. You hate on something, you get happy people wishing you farewell. You debate something, you get butthurt fan boys missing the point and trying to sound clever. Don't forget the trolls, too.

C'est la vie.

*Whoooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh!*

Am I doing it right, Synthaxx?

I agree, that mass debating has a much needed climax that is therapeutic when there is so much angst in the community over particular topics.

[Dacia Ultan]

The main difference I see there? The first guy is a lot more long-winded and claims to be a pro (because everyone's a pro on the Interwebs).

But he says the following:

Now I got my gf to take a look at the in game stuff of the pandas (she is animu/mango hardcore: yuck) and scoffed at it and said it was silly in a derogatory sense.

Classic dismissal tactic; and right after asking for something "edgy" to "balance the cute pandas," no less. Yeah, I can't take him seriously, either.

Compare this thread. Would you call it "hate" or "debate" if you didn't know exact context? By the way: the OP of that thread has been complaining nonstop about the very idea of pandaren, and about how the male model looks, all over that board.

[Cuchulainn]

When you reference any personal characteristics of those you are disagreeing with, you are a hater. I don't care how reasonable any other points are.

This thread is unnecessary and unhelpful.

Well, that's like, um, your opinion, man.
Go cry to a mod.

The debater is a debater, but a very jaded one. He borders the line of hate, only clinging to debater because he is willing to take dissent.

He disagrees with something, brings up a point based either on a subjective or objective view that's engaging to intellectuals, but still may or may not play the game. He clearly must be mad!
Pretty much what you said.

Both of those examples shown classic hater bias. Being skeptical is fine, but people on forums aren't being skeptical, they are completely hating on half of a concept (becuase we only no so much), and they dont know how this is practically going to turn out. I really hope those players that say they wont buy MOP dont buy it, because i know for a fact that the intelligence level of wow's player base will increase, making my enjoyment of wow 100x higher.

Are you seriously implying that everyone who won't play MoP are stupid? Can't wait to see what you have to say on the forums about stupid people in WoW after MoP releases. You'll probably make a rage thread about dumbasses in LFR, or something along those lines. Good luck!

One thing is for sure :
Debaters gonna debate.

I concur.

Oh, so because it's being called a debate it means we need to be super serious about it, and the people taking part are all grown ups... It's the same bullshit with "thats my opinion". I don't have to accept your opinion nor do I care for it.

QQIHATEPANDAZ is not a debate, it's childish whining over a computer game.

Ok, good for you. I never claimed that debates about WoW are taken seriously. It's also pretty obvious not everyone is going to agree with everyone's opinions. If you don't care, then...that's alright. Carry on.

The main difference I see there? The first guy is a lot more long-winded and claims to be a pro (because everyone's a pro on the Interwebs).

But he says the following:
Classic dismissal tactic; and right after asking for something "edgy" to "balance the cute pandas," no less. Yeah, I can't take him seriously, either.

Compare -snip-. Would you call it "hate" or "debate" if you didn't know exact context? By the way: the OP of that thread has been complaining nonstop about the very idea of pandaren, and about how the male model looks, all over that board.

Spoiler revealed, lol, fail. You must have skipped this thread I made somewhere along your conquest: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...Memory-Thread.. It got ignored for only a number of reasons I can guess: post was too long for a vast majority of impatient posters to read. The thread involved WoW general love, thus being untrollable (I guess?). WoW didn't improve the quality of anyone elses life? Hmmm, no one learns lessons I guess. Oh well, I thought I'd share it.

haters gonna hate haters hating. Classic forum stuff, yah know? Are you a pro too!?
Anyway, If you want to dissect the dudes post, then do it in the linked thread. That is, unless you've unsubbed and have some crazy love/hate relationship with WoW, but continue to cry on these forums about everything even though your points always conflict each other. I see that a lot with the fans.

[Dacia Ultan]

Spoiler revealed, lol, fail.

For being apparently unaware of the purpose of spoilers: fail yourself.

You must have skipped this thread I made somewhere along your conquest[snip]

What conquest?

Are you a pro too!?

Did you miss the part where I never claimed to be one?

Anyway, If you want to dissect the dudes post, then do it in the linked thread. That is, unless you've unsubbed and have some crazy love/hate relationship with WoW, but continue to cry on these forums about everything even though your points always conflict each other. I see that a lot with the fans.

...wait, what?

All I see here is you linking two different complaint threads, proclaiming one of them "debate" despite evidence to the contrary, and then calling everyone who disagrees with you a crybaby while complaining about how we supposedly can't handle anyone disagreeing with us.

[Caiada]

Aaaaand when all else fails, quote pop culture and say go cry elsewhere. I completely trust your definition of 'debate'.