GW2: good bye static rotation, welcome active battles!

[melodramocracy]

This is gonna turn out like the "how could you not be hyped about gw2" thread disaster.

It's amazing how folks will defend just about anything to reinforce their decisions, or feel that another poster's excitement about a new title instantly means that their own choices are being attacked. The arguments gets even more ludicrous when it comes to video games, a medium of entertainment that can easily be enjoyed several at a time.

[omlech]

Just to clear some things up. If any footage you see has text in Korean or is labled G-Star that was a build that ANet SPECIFICALLY tailored for Korea with more asian models, Korean voice work, etc. They have nothing to do with the NA/EU releases.

[Malthurius]

Like I've said before I will definitely be giving GW2 a shot ... Mainly because the B2P model make it extremely enticing .. If it was a subscription based MMO I would NOT be buying since I'm already got my hands full with SWTOR/WoW and will more then likely still be playing those by the time GW2 gets released.

However I hope I'm wrong when I say this .. And it's one thing that's always given me a strange vibe from GW2 and that is the combat looks EXTREMELY "Asian Style" ... I'm sure it's a system that I could get into once I give it a try .. But I just don't really like the look of these Asian Style combat systems; Tera and Aion are probably the biggest examples I can think of off the top of my head ... The combat doesn't interest me in the slightest because of this whole BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM Numbers flying everywhere type Asian Style combat that they have.

I'm more interested in the Adventure that GW2 looks like it's going to have attached to it with Dynamic events and lots of World Events ect .. And whilst this whole "Skill required to Dodge Attacks/Spells" Interests me a whole lot, the crazy hyper-active Asian Style combat is still a little unnerving, and I do hope it either works in a way that I can get into over time and enjoy or is completely not what I'm expecting and ends up being awesome off the bat.

I'm glad I've had the chance to link this thread I made.

No, numbers flying around doesn't make it Asian, I don't understand that point at all... at... all....

A good example of how this is ludicrous is Blznmri's video right below your post. I think the right term you should be using is "Overly Stylized Combat". There is nothing Asian/Eastern about it.

[Razeo]

THAT is what everyone is super-hyped about? LOL, it looks horrible. Character animations don't match up with the ground underneath, just like GW1. Game just looks bad.

Prepare to be disappointed again. At least this one has no monthly fee.

Please post constructively. -Edge

I'm pretty sure more people like my buddy here will start popping up on these sub-forums the closer we get to release.

As for the asian mmo topic, i can understand why some people would think that since alot of asian mmo's seem to be hack n' slash. GW2 however is being made by a U.S. company who is taking MMo gameplay to the next step.

[Deleted]

I can agree Maarius can be sometimes "over-optimistic" but, his topics have a real purpose. It's really good to provoke this type of discussion, even if it is a little heated up ;].

Every time, he creates a topic, he provokes us to think. Yes, we do have this uber-big-sticky-of-ancestral-knowledge topic, but let's be honest, not many here have read that and even less people who come here reads it. So he focuses our attention at one thing at a time pointing out features which then enables to shape our opinion of it. Sure, he does sprinkle it with "fanboy" flavour, but for god's sake - this is not TIMES, he doesn't have to be 100% objective :P. I mean even stone-cold-sceptical Fencer had her "hype-moments" ;>.

Back on the topic.

I also think that dynamism of the combat is shifted to the user, especially since combat has such different mechanics than WoW. First, in WoW you are obligated to take damage, no amount of jumping around can change the fact that if mob (or player) shot a fireball at you then you are going to get hit by it - you can't even out run it o_O. Sure, you have defensive cooldowns, but it's just one button and you can continue to stand in one spot.

GW2 is like a good music - it makes you move your feet ;]. People very quickly will learn that standing in one spot performing "best possible rotation" will get them killed. First, AI of GW2 mobs is leap and bounds beyond what WoW has to offer. Of course in low level areas we can encounter mostly "stupid" mobs (like in every other MMO), but with every level/area you will experience rising curve of difficulty. I'm not talking about occasional "interrupt", I'm talking about a mob which:
- pulls out a ranged weapon if you try to kite him
- if you're trying to melee him, he will attempt to kite you (throwing slows, stoping getting few shots of and then slowing you again etc)
- interrupts casts
and this is just a simple example. Of course depending on the level of the mob, his status (boss/elite/trash) his AI will be tuned accordingly so a spider in starting zone will not give you the fight of your life, but in high level areas, you will be lucky if you'll perform your "perfect rotation" even once - and that will be most likely possible only as opener.

[Fencers]

I'm not very skeptical about GW2. Fairly excited for the game. The only serious concerns I have are in UI and dress options. ;D

Being an unreleased game though, prob. a good idea to be cautious in some declarations. As with any game, natch.

[Deleted]

I don't see what's so different? It seems like any mmo with Asian style.

G*Star was in Korea, that's why they made the characters a little more asian looking. GW2 is however very much a western MMO.

Eric Flannum:
“The G-Star demo does indeed feature some new things. Some things are for this demo only, for example the armor you see is high level armor which will indeed appear as an option in the western version of the game but for the korean demo we start out players wearing it. We’ll explain things in a series of blog posts this week so sit tight, more info is on the way.”

I think this looks pretty western, not asian.

[Ynna]

I agree with Fencers (and Lucky_). I'm super-thrilled for the game, and while the posts Maarius makes are very informative, the way he structures them could be handled better. More neutral thread-titles would be a good starting point. And I'm not saying that to attack anyone. There are currently 2 problems this sub-forum has, and that's 1)WoW-fanboys who'll exclaim this game sucks and 2)GW2-fanboys who attack anyone who even looks dirty at the game, and marketing-style thread-titles aren't helping with either side. I definitely encourage making threads that provide information, but try to do it in a more neutral style, like Fencers said, more: "This is how Guild Wars 2 handles dungeons and progression." and less "Guild Wars 2 has the most hardcore dungeons of any MMO."

Now, as for the actual topic of this thread: I don't think GW2 is doing something as revolutionary as people think, but the combat still makes me excited. They're basically using action-RPG combat in an MMO, which can only be encouraged, since it leads to more player -agency. By making the combat highly based on positioning and skill it becomes more fluid and FPS-like.

[Mif]

More neutral thread-titles would be a good starting point

Yeah, they tend to attract the attention of opposing fanboys every time they make the front page.

[Fencers]

as for the actual topic of this thread: I don't think GW2 is doing something as revolutionary as people think, but the combat still makes me excited. They're basically using action-RPG combat in an MMO, which can only be encouraged, since it leads to more player -agency. By making the combat highly based on positioning and skill it becomes more fluid and FPS-like.

I do think some times we misplace the term revolutionary when what we should be expressing is how evolutionary GW2 concepts are.

Since we are on about combat here; it is widely regard that the feel and pace of Warcraft's combat was a watershed for the genre. So much so that players of other MMOs not called World of Warcraft still to this day remark how combat in Rift, TOR, Aion or Age of Conan don't "feel right" or stiff.

This might be a dubious claim in some cases, as some MMOs aforementioned have shorter ability delays than Warcraft. What is overlooked casually is the nature of Warcraft's animation that translates; I hit Heroic Strike. My Character performed Heroic Strike. as visual and tactile feedback. Something we see few games actually nail spot on.

So we can say credibly the pace of Warcraft's combat was/is a pretty big deal in attracting a broader base of players to the genre. Esp. in contrast to the nature of combat in say, Everquest or Runescape.

We can also say that broadening of genre from EQ->WoW sees more players from other genres and gaming systems (i.e. consoles) cross over into MMOs than before. Where in times past we didn't often see players leave their Turn-Based Strategy or FPS shooter ghettos.

Combat in the style of Warcraft is more uncommon outside of MMOs though. By moving to a fluid & mobile combat system in GW2 we do have a style of combat more like what we might get out of Darksiders or Devil May Cry. Perhaps not to the same degree of flamboyance, natch.

I personally think that is an important step in going away from click-action-click drinking bird gameplay of EQ era MMOs. Even beyond what we saw in WoW at it's inception in fluidity. Would be very surprised if we see MMO combat remain tied to click-action-click formula post-GW2. Even if GW2 is a massive failure by some twist of fate. MMOs just don't have to play like it's 2001 anymore.

In that context. I do believe action-y orientated MMO combat [lVindictus, Tera, Guild Wars 2] is an evolutionary step for the genre. Just as we went from MUDs (yes, you had to type commands in old MMOs) to EQ to Warcraft to this next upcoming generation.

[Deleted]

It's amazing how folks will defend just about anything to reinforce their decisions, or feel that another poster's excitement about a new title instantly means that their own choices are being attacked. The arguments gets even more ludicrous when it comes to video games, a medium of entertainment that can easily be enjoyed several at a time.

The ego and personal insecurity is behind most forum posts these days.

[Deleted]

The combat reminds me more of DOTA than WoW. What do you guys think?

[Knileci]

The combat seems weird, in the first video, isn't the guardian hitting people with his mace/sword/ whatever from a thousand yards away?

[Maarius]

The combat seems weird, in the first video, isn't the guardian hitting people with his mace/sword/ whatever from a thousand yards away?

that attack is intended to be ranged:

Zealot's Defense

Animation

Zealot's Defense
15


Weapon Main-hand sword

Block enemy ranged attacks while sending out magical projectiles

[Knileci]

that attack is intended to be ranged:

ah that makes sense :P thanks a lot!

[Deleted]

If I remember correctly, someone already posted a link to Team Quitter's analysis a couple of months ago.
Teamquitter sort of had a fanclub here on MMO-Champion.

[Merendel]

If I remember correctly, someone already posted a link to Team Quitter's analysis a couple of months ago.
Teamquitter sort of had a fanclub here on MMO-Champion.

meh they've been a bit of a mixed bag. their individual class reviews were stellar even if they leaned heavy on the pvp it was all good info. I rather thought the 10 best and 10 worst things articles were long winded drivel however. the worst things list in particular seemed like the guy was reaching to find something wrong and several of them were "Duh thats the point" moments.

[Maarius]

meh they've been a bit of a mixed bag. their individual class reviews were stellar even if they leaned heavy on the pvp it was all good info. I rather thought the 10 best and 10 worst things articles were long winded drivel however. the worst things list in particular seemed like the guy was reaching to find something wrong and several of them were "Duh thats the point" moments.

^ agreed

[Mylith]

But I'm going to miss 1242223622235222352223622235 etc....

Just kidding... lol

[mikencarly]

Please dont make fun of people for likeing wow ok? i like gw2 as well but there no need for it thanks.