Elementalist Discussion

[Lucky_]

It sounds negative because it is negative. Elementalist is currently not viable outside its staff support role, neither for tourney or single play with a couple of really niche applications that don't really work outside the very small niche.

Notably, for all the demagogy, no one even tried to refute this claim. Instead I get "well why you so negative about it dawg" kind of replies. Should I take it that I can't state the negative parts about the class without sugar coating the hell out of it?


Fine. Elementalist is a better burst class then necromancer, and non-staff elementalist is more viable then dagger necromancer.

[rhandric]

I haven't played Elementalist since BWE3, since I've been trying other professions...so I can't affirm or refute your claims. But you haven't given any data to support your claims. For all I know (and anyone else), it could be a simple matter of rebalancing of traits and weapons, and maybe utilities, that you haven't adapted to. It could be that in the earlier BWEs they were balanced too high, not that they're balanced too low now. You can't look at where the game was previously balanced when the game is still in beta, you have to look at how the game is currently balanced.

[Lucky_]

I haven't played Elementalist since BWE3, since I've been trying other professions...so I can't affirm or refute your claims. But you haven't given any data to support your claims. For all I know (and anyone else), it could be a simple matter of rebalancing of traits and weapons, and maybe utilities, that you haven't adapted to. It could be that in the earlier BWEs they were balanced too high, not that they're balanced too low now. You can't look at where the game was previously balanced when the game is still in beta, you have to look at how the game is currently balanced.

"I'm too lazy to look this stuff up, so I will just make vague accusations while shielding myself from the obvious critique by stating that I don't know jack shit about the subject anyway".

If you think this low of my (and several others' in this thread) evaluation of current state of elementalist, you are free to use countless sources on the internet to research it. That is, if your goal is to understand the situation.

I know things about the situation, as I played elementalist to >40 in last BWE3. You yourself stated you did not since BWE1. If you want to try refuting my claims, calling "for data" is an obvious red herring. Data is out there. If you wanted it, you'd have it. Treating others like your errand boys with obvious "fetch boy, FETCH" posts shows that your goal is highly unlikely to have anything to do with finding out about state of the class.

[Cyclone Jack]

Is Elementalist in that good of a spot that everyone is pretty happy with it, or is it just not as popular a profession as the other 7?

While I haven't *really* played since BWE3, I will say that I have enjoyed the Elementalist during all 3 BWEs. I will say, however, that while I have enjoyed the profession, I have found it quite difficult to find a build that suits my play style. I do think that their DPA is a bit low, seeing that an Ele needs to use numerous abilities to match that of another profession (generally speaking). However, at the same time, that is also some of the appeal of the profession to me, as I really enjoy the stance dance, mobility and how active they are. Again, their lack of DPA could also be due to the builds I have been using, attempting to tailor the Traits to the Utility that I enjoy.

[DrakeWurrum]

"I'm too lazy to look this stuff up, so I will just make vague accusations while shielding myself from the obvious critique by stating that I don't know jack shit about the subject anyway".

If you think this low of my (and several others' in this thread) evaluation of current state of elementalist, you are free to use countless sources on the internet to research it. That is, if your goal is to understand the situation.

I know things about the situation, as I played elementalist to >40 in last BWE3. You yourself stated you did not since BWE1. If you want to try refuting my claims, calling "for data" is an obvious red herring. Data is out there. If you wanted it, you'd have it. Treating others like your errand boys with obvious "fetch boy, FETCH" posts shows that your goal is highly unlikely to have anything to do with finding out about state of the class.

When you make claims claiming unviability of a profession, it's usually on the person making the claims to actually back up their claim with evidence. Otherwise, yes, it is perfectly valid to just shrug off your claim as nonsense.

[rhandric]

"I'm too lazy to look this stuff up, so I will just make vague accusations while shielding myself from the obvious critique by stating that I don't know jack shit about the subject anyway".

If you think this low of my (and several others' in this thread) evaluation of current state of elementalist, you are free to use countless sources on the internet to research it. That is, if your goal is to understand the situation.

I know things about the situation, as I played elementalist to >40 in last BWE3. You yourself stated you did not since BWE1. If you want to try refuting my claims, calling "for data" is an obvious red herring. Data is out there. If you wanted it, you'd have it. Treating others like your errand boys with obvious "fetch boy, FETCH" posts shows that your goal is highly unlikely to have anything to do with finding out about state of the class.

I don't realize why you're getting so defensive. This is a discussion thread about Elementalists. I figured, since I haven't recently played (and I have played since BWE1, read what I wrote ffs), maybe someone who has played would actually give me data, rather than meaningless garbage saying "it's not viable" and not backing it up. What's not viable? What traits/weapons/stats are you using? The kind of stuff that actually makes a difference in the game. Instead I get useless posts calling me lazy because I don't spend every waking moment hunting down data, when the person I'm responding to is making claims without providing support. The burden of proof is on you, the one calling out the Elementalist (or at least several builds) as being non-viable.

[DrakeWurrum]

What's not viable? What traits/weapons/stats are you using?

And more importantly, what about those traits/weapons/stats/etc are causing you to claim it's not viable. What do you mean with that word? Linking the textbook definition doesn't say anything about what you're talking about. "Not viable" is just a random buzz word that translates to you saying "This class is underpowered."
Do you mean it you can't defeat enemies? Can't possibly win an sPvP match? Can't even contribute to a WvW match? Can't win 1v1? Can't keep team mates from dying? Do you mean that another profession does it better?
WTF does it mean in the context of GW2 pvp?

[Luko]

So now that it's been out for a while and people have been a little more dedicated to their characters, which weapon/trait/attunement combos are you guys finding most helpful out in the world?

1v1 Vet/Champ encounters, huge group events, etc.

[neepz]

I've been seeing lots of people saying element is not a valid option for PvE, is that true?

[Deleted]

I've been playing my Ele since headstart and currently at level 40. I've dabbled into between questing and WvsWvsW only, so my experience in sPvP is unknown. But I've found/prefered that a Scepter/Dagger is really good whilst questing because it offers a good opening burst damage and helps to sustain some decent dmg whilst kiting mulitple foes. Although Ele's feel bit squishy, either this is down to a gear issue/more trait points in Water and Earth I'm not to issue I haven't gone that far yet. Personally prefer using a staff in WvsW for its aoe attacks and longer ranger, which offers some good support for your team around you.

One thing with Ele's is the dmg output isn't as great compared to other ranged classes, maybe its because Ele's are a support class? Who knows, but until I've got better gear and traits are in place its still just uncertain until later levels.

Me personally I've been running a Fire attunement with a Fire and Air trait heavy build for more offensive dmg, with a string of crits it really helps, just downfall is I'm very squishy atm.

But all in all, I'm enjoying my Ele currently until I've got all my trait points and level 80 the picture is still unclear.

[Systam]

idk im 50 atm enjoying it. With fire traits earth and some arcana i can use tooth+phoenix possibly a Fire grab and they're dead with good defense for when my health drops.

im just playing for fun though not going to get all "Hardcore" into classes viability and stuff i just enjoy playing gw2 for fun thats all it'll ever be for me just a game on the side to play so any class i enjoy would be fine

[ddsad2212]

I've been seeing lots of people saying element is not a valid option for PvE, is that true?

If its people saying there not viable in story modes, then the fact is that player is not a valid option for a party in PvE, in explorable mode however it is a bit unknown. There damage is decent for the most part. They have some nice healing and combo fields. And they have some of the best kiting (if you can play them right, dagger has insane kiting, as in you should never ever be touched by melee level kiting). There perfectly valid, using mine i have gone through the first 3 dungeons dieing maybe 3 times (wont count the 4th dungeon run as i went full retard, enter with little to know money and semi broken gear, which was damn near all broken on my first death).

[Lucky_]

Depends. I'm heading to 60 now with elementalist, it has serious problems but is playable. First of all, get a staff. Other weapons are absolutely crippled for PvE. Second, understand that you will need both elementals in utility and elite slots asap. Your survivability is junk so you need tanks. Your damage with staff is also junk unless you can stand still and cast every once in a while, so in later events you can expect to take forever to win personal story events, and some will borderline require grouping (like the priory destroyer queen). Remember to stack might asap in every fight (earth #2 into fire #2 asap).

In dungeons, people will suck your genitalia to get you in as a healer. Literally. Staff elementalist is absolutely incredibly overpowered in support/healer role with massive amount of both heals and control, especially if you're sylvari. You also have good AoE, which is needed in dungeons. But your single target damage output is still crap and you should focus on support in most cases.

[Eggoman]

So now that it's been out for a while and people have been a little more dedicated to their characters, which weapon/trait/attunement combos are you guys finding most helpful out in the world?

1v1 Vet/Champ encounters, huge group events, etc.

Scepter/Dagger with Power focus, some toughness and Arcane focus. This seems to be the default mode when I'm doing difficult encounters. I'll go dagger/dagger for max single target dps and I use the minor fire pet and fiery sword elite every time it is up.

When I'm in a group I'll switch to Staff and nuke/aoe from the rear while supporting a bit with fields.

Generally I'll grab as much as I can and I go like this:
Pull->Ring of fire -> Arcane blast to get the mightx3 and aoe fire dmg in. Then I'll toss a burning speed out to help line up the mobs and finish with a fire grab. Usually mobs are dead before fire grab due to auto attacks but my next move after that is to circle around the targets with Drake Breath.

Same sequence for tougher mobs(vets/champs) but they don't go down with the initial sequence of burst so I'll swap to earth stance after my fire sequence and have the temporary -33% to inc dmg buff (trait from the Arcane tree when swapping attunements) then cast earthquake for knock down, ring of earth for some bleed and I use my Arcane Shield while I channel churnning earth.

Then I'll swap to lightning, blind and blink back, switch to water and cast heal/cleansing wave if needed then repeat the sequence but before I go in again I cast frost aura.

Now if its a champ I'll pop my elite fiery sword and face roll with that and then go through the above sequence.

Depending on whats going on I vary it a bunch but generally that is how it goes if I'm on autopilot.

[rhandric]

Scepter/Dagger with Power focus, some toughness and Arcane focus. This seems to be the default mode when I'm doing difficult encounters. I'll go dagger/dagger for max single target dps and I use the minor fire pet and fiery sword elite every time it is up.

When I'm in a group I'll switch to Staff and nuke/aoe from the rear while supporting a bit with fields.

Generally I'll grab as much as I can and I go like this:
Pull->Ring of fire -> Arcane blast to get the mightx3 and aoe fire dmg in. Then I'll toss a burning speed out to help line up the mobs and finish with a fire grab. Usually mobs are dead before fire grab due to auto attacks but my next move after that is to circle around the targets with Drake Breath.

Same sequence for tougher mobs(vets/champs) but they don't go down with the initial sequence of burst so I'll swap to earth stance after my fire sequence and have the temporary -33% to inc dmg buff (trait from the Arcane tree when swapping attunements) then cast earthquake for knock down, ring of earth for some bleed and I use my Arcane Shield while I channel churnning earth.

Then I'll swap to lightning, blind and blink back, switch to water and cast heal/cleansing wave if needed then repeat the sequence but before I go in again I cast frost aura.

Now if its a champ I'll pop my elite fiery sword and face roll with that and then go through the above sequence.

Depending on whats going on I vary it a bunch but generally that is how it goes if I'm on autopilot.

Huh. I do the exact same thing.

[DrakeWurrum]

I would take any "this profession is not viable" statements, let alone any statements about something being under/overpowered, with the usual "They just might not know what they're doing" grain of salt for now.

Game's still fresh, and nobody is a pro at it, as much as they may claim otherwise.

[Ashnazg]

Depends. I'm heading to 60 now with elementalist, it has serious problems but is playable. First of all, get a staff. Other weapons are absolutely crippled for PvE. Second, understand that you will need both elementals in utility and elite slots asap. Your survivability is junk so you need tanks. Your damage with staff is also junk unless you can stand still and cast every once in a while, so in later events you can expect to take forever to win personal story events, and some will borderline require grouping (like the priory destroyer queen). Remember to stack might asap in every fight (earth #2 into fire #2 asap).

Hm. I can't say I agree on point #1. I've leveled primarily as a staff ele, but I've also dabbled with dual dagger, and for PvE either is workable. Staff might be better because its safer, but eh, dagger looks more stylish. I also don't know if eles have it that much tougher than anyone else. Between decently damaging skills in fire, stuns (and, more importantly, blinds) in lightning and an assortment of other skills (knockbacks, snares, shields) I think we do ok. Granted, I am only 49 right now, but still, most PvE stuff dies a horrible death just from #2 and #3 on my staff. With a blind signet and air's #2, I don't even have to kite that much.

Dual dagger just involves l-rushing in, then running circles while you burn them with dragon's breath / ring of fire / fire charge / fire's #5. If getting zerged, earth -- > #4 for KD, arcane shield -- > #5 for massive aoe damage.

[Lucky_]

It's not that dagger doesn't work on principle, it's that it's great damage but you're kamikaze most of the time. In story mode around 50ish, mobs start to two shot you, so earth 5 will simply not happen, not even with stun. Or it will, but you will die right afterwards. It's even worse in dungeons.

[papajohn4]

At first I was using staff..it is nice on DEs where there are 20+ people around and you just drop AOE to the ground to tag mobs..but when it comes to solo play and personal story is really weak..the most damage abilities are ground aoe abilities and mobs are very clever and immediately move out of fire and sometimes you end up doing 0 damage..
I used Dagger/Dagger and it is much better for solo..good mobility, high burst damge. The weakness is that it has short range...

Generally my impression so far...

1) Elementalist are 2 times harder than warrior/guardian to play, have the lowest armor/health of all classes and they do less damage than warrior/guardian/thiefs
2) Staff is awesome for DEs when there are many people around. Lot of fields to create combos for allies, great support and great aoe damage/AOE tagging
3) Dagger off hand has the best and coolest abilities by far Ring of Fire, Ride the lighting, Updraft
4)I didn't liked Scepter abilities...staff and dagger are feel better for me, both mechanic and aesthetic
5) I wish we could swap weapons too
6) Melee mobs are very easy, you just kite them to death. Range mobs are pain in the ass! If there is only one range mob you burn it down quickly while kiting melees. But if there is more than one ranged mobs you probably going to die..you simple can't burned them down both before they kill you..you can dodge 1-2 of their attacks but after that...if you are lucky and there are objects nearby and can play with line of sight maybe you will make it

Elementalist are glass cannons and usually in MMOs glass cannon classes have high dps to balance their weakness, but in GW2 that isn't happening. Although they are fun enough to reward you the hard play.

that's my opinion so far

[Luko]

Like pretty much everyone else, I've been rolling Dual daggers. I normally hate dual weilding spec/classes but this has a certain appeal I just can't get away from. Throughout the leveling experience, I've unlocked all of my abilities on everything but focus (Mostly because I didn't want to give up off hand dagger ) and outside of a DE, they're all extremely underwhelming.

The raw damage in Fire daggers and utility of the other attunements is too incredible to pass up. Earth is by far my favorite, but less desirable in quick burn situations.

I love the class to death, however I agree with most of what papajohn above me said. Even in stand-and-turret situations, the damage is just way too low to be considered a glass cannon. The glass part however is perfectly accurate