[Manga] (Spoilers!) Bleach Final arc/ending!-----OPINIONS-----

[StayTuned]

Everyone is excited about Grimmjow and I'm just sitting here happy that Kon is back :P

Also, I really like the dialogue between Aizen and Kyoraku

Totally. My first thought was "fuck yea, Kon is back"

I thought he was going to be forever lost

[Blueobelisk]

Yeah but if Kon is there who is watching Ichigo's human body in the real world?

[4KhazModan]

Yeah but if Kon is there who is watching Ichigo's human body in the real world?

His friends? His dad? He doesn't have to keep it a secret anymore. Maybe his body is just lying in bed in his room?

Speaking of Ishiin, where the hell is he!? Considering they are 1) protecting the soul society and 2) fighting the man who was responsible for the death of his wife/mother of his children......you would think he would have a vested interest in this battle

[Deleted]

His friends? His dad? He doesn't have to keep it a secret anymore. Maybe his body is just lying in bed in his room?

Speaking of Ishiin, where the hell is he!? Considering they are 1) protecting the soul society and 2) fighting the man who was responsible for the death of his wife/mother of his children......you would think he would have a vested interest in this battle

Weren't his powers sacrificed to create that sword, which was later filled with Captains reiatsu and used to give Ichigo power back?

[Kickbuttmario]

So 2 years later, he finally brings back Grimmjaw back into the damn story. Fucking A. This god damn Manga.

[Mawnix]

Power levels in Bleach are wildly inconsistent. It's happened countless times in this manga, and will continue to. Ichigo is prime example - he should be one of the strongest people in existence at this point, with Shinigami, hollow, quincy, fullbringer mega powers, who beat Aizen with the ultimate getsuga, and was subsequently repowered up using the reiatsu of all the Captains and vice-captains, trained under zero squad, received a true Zanpakutō straight from the forge of the creator of all Zanpakutō... and what does he do? Gets knocked off the side of the Soul King's palace and knocked out cause he bumped his head.

And yet the guy continues to make everythinf about Power Levels.

Can't even have a rational conversation about manga/anime without someone being that asshole who has to make it all about Power Levels..

[Traveler Voltin]

Grimmjow has a nice scar

[Blueobelisk]

And yet the guy continues to make everythinf about Power Levels.

Can't even have a rational conversation about manga/anime without someone being that asshole who has to make it all about Power Levels..

Dude are you serious? You were the one who brought up power levels when you said Grimmjow one shot a Sternritter and that he was gonna "obliterate" opponents now. You know those opponents: A, A, B, and Juha's personal Sternritter squad that defeated Squad Zero. And I'm the "asshole" for pointing out that Grimmjow shouldn't be as strong as you're saying? You either have a personal problem with me or you're looking through Grimmjow fanboy glasses.

Second, how do you not bring up power levels in a manga that is about fighting? If the random afro deputy shinigami walks up to Aizen for a fight, should I be like "well according to Destil logic I shouldn't worry about power levels, I don't know who is gonna come out the victor. This is gonna be a nail biter!" Of course not. This whole manga is about who can match up against whom.

Third, lol. I said it before, I'll say it again. Grimmjow shouldn't be able to fight any of these guys in a fair fight. It's just the limitations of being a non-vasto-lorde Arcannar. If Kubo decides that Grimmjow can suddenly fight toe to toe with a full powered Sternritter, then that's just broken.

And lastly, since you think Grimmjow "one shot" Kirge, I'd like to remind you that Grimmjow got one shot by Nnoitra a while ago. Totally fair for me to say that, right?




Not gonna link the rest and sorry for embedding big images guys, but just FYI I think that's where he gets his scar guys lol. His scar actually seems a bit longer than what's cut in the pic but it's that same area.

[Mawnix]

Whelp, since you decided to be extra rude, now I have to actually just lay this to rest. Ahem:

First off, i did not mention anything about Power Levels. I made an observation about Grimmjow because I was excited he was back. Apparently, by making an observation about something that factually happened, that he one shot Kirge, that's doscussing power levels.

Secondly, don't mock me because I approach this differently than you and every other "anime enthusiast" who only cares about who can hit X harder in the "cooler way". Do you know how fucking boring that gets just focusing on fighting? When I was in high school I cared about shit like that. I actually give a shit about depth, story, and how the fighting plays into those. Even moreso, I enjoy a fight guided by a solid narrative, and by solid narrative I mean one that guides the fight, affects how the characters in the fight interact, and actually has interesting development on the story.

The other reason I don't give a shit about power levels, and this is specifically to Bleach, is because of what I've come to label as "Naruto Syndrome".

This is when the author throws most forms of depth and meaning in their storytelling out the window to simply create a massive battle that will appease "the fans". People who legitimately appreciate the chapters they read never find satisfaction in this because it's sacrificing what makes the manga good, IE the fighting, story, AND character development, to become eye candy.

I loved the ending of Naruto, especially the fight between Sasuke and Naruto, but the Kaguya and Madara fights? All of a sudden both of them come out of a coma with Godlike powers. It became even more absurd when the villain who we had emotional attachment and interest in was thrown out for, again, "Naruto Syndrome" (Kaguya suddenly coming in out of fucking nowhere).

Bleach has done this since the Aizen arcs started. Focusing on increasing X character's power level again, and again, and again. Remember when Byakuya and Kenpachi engaged Yammy and everyone said they'd get whooped, by the way? Well I seem to remember that conflict playing out quite differently than them losing.

Kubo does what Naruto did all the fucking time for cheap power level bullshit and bad, lazy storytelling. It only works when the narrative for the fight occurring makes sense. Example: Mask vs Renji was a cop out that threw Kensei and Rose under the bus because they revealed their Bankais and had no other abilities to display. Characters get killed off every time they run out of abilities. Name one time it hasn't occured to any major character. Why do you think, for instance, Grimmjow is back?

Furthermore, the reason I don't understand your thinking and call it out is because all you focus on is what's been displayed and NOTHING more. You base it on the power levels you've witnessed and JUST that; not how the story has developed and could affect characters' development, not how other variables factor into an actual fight.. Nothing.

The only thing, LITERALLY, the only point you have against anytjing I've said is Grimmjow's last fight which took place, what, two years ago??? Three now????

You genuinely dont think a prideful person like Grimmjow would train their ass off for feeling weak? For being embarassed? For becoming everything he couldn't stand and hated?

Also, explain to me why characters such as Yoruichi and Urahara, two extremely smart and EXTREMELY SELF AWARE characters, would allow Grimmjow to support Ichigo's team unless they thought he was capable enough to handle it? The Quincies in the Spirit King's tower are, if I really had to guess, the only forces left within the Sternritter. They are leagues more powerful than Kirge, who struggled against an incomplete Zanpaktou wielding Ichigo. Please. Explain that one to me, because I'm all ears.

Ffs dude. The whole reason I said I'll let Kubo's writing talk for me is because I am willing to make anfreaking money bet on Grimmjow acfually being much stronger than we think. No, there is no way he stronger than Ichigo obviously.

You say it's broken without letting Kubo introduce any explanation before hand. You only base your thinking on this off of data that is now too old to have ANY merit on how strong X Y and Z characters are now.

Is Ichigo the same power level? Nope.
Is Chad? Nope.
Is Uryu? Nope, and if I remember right he struggled against Grimmjow and other Arrancar, especially Szayel, a rank lower than Grimmjow.
Is Orihime? Nope. Even ORHIME isn't the same power level.

Are you getting what I'm saying? We don't know the means an Arrancar can boost their strength, especially if they don't become one as a Vasto Lorde, but if I can place any bet on a single person who would surpass that limit based on their character, their development, and the story itself, by paying attention to THAT and not letting my ENTIRE opinion be swayed by bullshit power levels, Id place it on Grimmjow.

If my point still somehow doesn't register to you, after every time I have now made the same exact argument, then I will just wait for the next few chapters to blow your mind. Really, I genuinely hope it happens so I can just sit her and say, like I did today when Grimmjow was revealed, "Toldja so".

And I think we both remember who told me there was no chance of Grimmjow coming back.

I don't mean for this to sound too rude, but stop jumping on me just because I prefer logic and practical reasoning in my opinions, especially with Shounen and manga, instead of focusing on pure power levels and events that took place leagues ago when the story was in a completely different era and scenario.

Sorry I enjoy employing the only marginal depth a slowly-becoming-shallow series displays in my reasoning instead of focusing on pure fighting ability from 6 freaking years ago.

[4KhazModan]

Sorry I enjoy employing the only marginal depth a slowly-becoming-shallow series displays in my reasoning instead of focusing on pure fighting ability from 6 freaking years ago.

Was the Arrancar arc really that long ago? Well damn :/

[StayTuned]

Wtf destil who cares? Go get some fresh air

[Gallahadd]

Was the Arrancar arc really that long ago? Well damn :/

Yeah... You forget just how long this arc has been, mostly because the pacing has been glacial over the past few months.

[Mawnix]

Wtf destil who cares? Go get some fresh air

So hold up. Because I get called out, don't even get on this forum that much anymore, and I want to defend myself, I'm the bad guy?

I'm a writer. I give a shit about anime/manga because it's a big creative influence on how I write. Don't be an ass just because I'm defending what I give a shit about. Ffs, you can never win on this website.

[Blueobelisk]

I couldddddd respond but I think people in this thread would rather talk about Bleach. I mean, it's not like the arguing is particularly fun but if someone finds it entertaining and wants us to continue or if you wanted me to respond in PMs...

Reread chapter since Stream version came out. Lol just noticed Yoroichi's arm got completely taken off...or at least she cut it off...pretty intense for her to shrug off like it was nothing (even if Orohime fixed it). One of the toughest characters for sure.

I wonder how long Grimmjow has been following Yoroichi around. Because he can't just open a Garganta from Hueco Mundo all the way to Soul Palace. Otherwise the captains/quincy charging up w.e. it is they're doing would be pointless, since Urahara can open a garganta himself. Or Aizen could have done it so long ago.

[StayTuned]

So hold up. Because I get called out, don't even get on this forum that much anymore, and I want to defend myself, I'm the bad guy?

I'm a writer. I give a shit about anime/manga because it's a big creative influence on how I write. Don't be an ass just because I'm defending what I give a shit about. Ffs, you can never win on this website.

You called him an asshole, what do you expect?

[Mawnix]

You called him an asshole, what do you expect?

Because he was rude. What did you expect my response to be?

Let's just move on. Apologies for calling you out to such an extent, Blue. If you wanna talk just PM me.

[Hishiro]

I don't know why people are posting huge walls of text arguing about power levels in Bleach. This isn't DBZ and power levels have always been inconsistent in Bleach since pretty much the beginning. Someone who one day was able to easily one shot a strong opponent might struggle the next day against a weaker opponent.

Also, specifically in regards to Grimmjow, I'm not sure how much stronger he really is able to become anyways. I'm not sure exactly how it works with Arrancar, so it could be a moot point, but when we got the flashback of Grimmjow's history, we learned a couple of important points - Before becoming an arrancar he was an Adjuchas class Menos. In order to become stronger, they had to devour other hollows. At some point though, devouring hollows no longer has any effect and that is as strong as they will ever become. He never made it to Vasto Lorde class. The only thing I am unsure of is if that changes at all with the development of Arrancar powers. But in any case - as an example of how this is all a pointless discussion of power levels - Tier Harribel was a Vasto Lorde class Arrancar and she was easily defeated by the Quincy.

[Mawnix]

I don't know why people are posting huge walls of text arguing about power levels in Bleach. This isn't DBZ and power levels have always been inconsistent in Bleach since pretty much the beginning. Someone who one day was able to easily one shot a strong opponent might struggle the next day against a weaker opponent.

Also, specifically in regards to Grimmjow, I'm not sure how much stronger he really is able to become anyways. I'm not sure exactly how it works with Arrancar, so it could be a moot point, but when we got the flashback of Grimmjow's history, we learned a couple of important points - Before becoming an arrancar he was an Adjuchas class Menos. In order to become stronger, they had to devour other hollows. At some point though, devouring hollows no longer has any effect and that is as strong as they will ever become. He never made it to Vasto Lorde class. The only thing I am unsure of is if that changes at all with the development of Arrancar powers. But in any case - as an example of how this is all a pointless discussion of power levels - Tier Harribel was a Vasto Lorde class Arrancar and she was easily defeated by the Quincy.

That's the thing. If it wasn't for Grimmjow's character, I would doubt any possibility of him growing.

This is why I'm so excited I see what happens with him in the next few chapters. Also, I think it's worth noting Harribel went up against Yhwach. No ones gonna win that fight unless they're Ichigo.

I never meant for this to become a discussion about Power Levels. I meant it as debate for how Grimmjow may have grown and what could've happened to him since they all last saw him.

The whole issue with how Hollows evolve is the main issue I see, and totally agree myself. If I had to guess, Kubo is probably going to introduce a new way that Arrancar can sort of develop their skills. No clue how this could be, but I genuinely wouldn't be surprised.

I'm just really excited Grimmjow is back. It's a wild card presently, and it's about to make this story much more interesting.

Ughhhhh Aizen and Grimmjow being back. This has been the first time I've been excited about Bleach in ages. Has anyone else felt certain parts of this Arc have felt dragged out WAYYYYY too much?

[Hishiro]

Ughhhhh Aizen and Grimmjow being back.

Here's what I predict.

:Ichigo and his team get ready to face off against Yhwach and his Sternritter:

Aizen and Grimmjow show up onto the battlefield...

Ichigo: "Ah! What the hell are you two doing here! I'm trying to stop the Quincy and save Soul Society, the Human World, and Hueco Mundo, and now I have do deal with you two enemies from my past!"

Aizen slowly pushes back his hair, and while still holding his head, lets out a slow, deep laugh.

Aizen: "You have nothing to worry about now Ichigo. Just as I planned 100 years ago, Naruto has taught us the power of friendship. We are here to lend you our help."

Ichigo: "....."

Orihime: "Naruto? I really like that Hinata girl."

Yoruichi: "Come on guys, focus! Now's not the time to be having pointless conversations for 10 chapters. We have a fight to do."

[StayTuned]

I have a little theory that Grimmjow is not the only Arrancar we will meet. I think most, if not all, Hueco Mundo citizens will join. They know what's up, and if Yhwach keeps on doing as he currently is, Hueco Mundo is going to shit, too.

Nelliel should get involved, too. She's funny