[Megathread] DotA 2

[Deleted]

First off, I never see dual lanes so that's that. And whether 1/10 buy sentries or not doesn't matter as my argument was that if you play the lane properly, you will have sentries with you. Watch any pro game and tell me how many times they don't carry sentries at the start.

So pub games are relevant.
But you should play like pros.
So pub games aren't relevant.
Right.

Sure, but my first post was that KotL/PL is harder to beat than most support+carry lineups.

Only if you let them really.

[Longview]

Only if you let them really.

scarier than am+cm
scarier than void+cm
scarier than pa+cm
scarier than above carries+sd
scarier than above carries+lina
scarier than above carries+aa
scarier than above carries+thrall
scarier than above carries+lich
scarier than above carries+rubick
scarier than above carries+lion
scarier than above carries+bane

but i do not really lane with people so my views may be skewed

[Lysah]

SD/SA is 10x harder to beat than PL/kotl, because they have actual heavy presence. Or try a CM/DK lane. Throw in a batch of fresh gyro/ogre on top and you have tons of lanes that are a lot stronger than phantom garbage/keeper of the awful.

And did you just say pa/cm is less scary than pl/kotl? I'm disappointed. Maybe I need to learn you people how to play PA.

[Deleted]

scarier than am+cm
scarier than void+cm
scarier than pa+cm
scarier than above carries+sd
scarier than above carries+lina
scarier than above carries+aa
scarier than above carries+thrall
scarier than above carries+lich
scarier than above carries+rubick
scarier than above carries+lion
scarier than above carries+bane

but i do not really lane with people so my views may be skewed

I'd be a lot more scared of AM CM/Lion than KotL PL.
And PA Lina
But maybe that's just me.

[Deleted]

So pub games are relevant.
But you should play like pros.
So pub games aren't relevant.
Right.

So what the majority do in a public game affects whether you buy sentry on KotL or not? No, it doesn't.
So what the majority do in a public game affect your chances of facing an Enchantress offensive jungling? Very much so.

I am talking from the standpoint where you have control of KotL/PL and the opposing team only has control of picking their dual lane. The other heroes are dictated by what is most common in a public game, right? When you decide to go dual lane offensively in a public game, the chances that the enemy has a jungler in their woods is much much more likely than you having an offensive jungler. That was my point.

Only if you let them really.

I'm up for trying it.

[Deleted]

I am talking from the standpoint where you have control of KotL/PL and the opposing team only has control of picking their dual lane.

Nothing really says they have to go with something 100% perfect. I can just as easily jungle myself and have some pubbie support the offlane *shrug*

The other heroes are dictated by what is most common in a public game, right? When you decide to go dual lane offensively in a public game, the chances that the enemy has a jungler in their woods is much much more likely than you having an offensive jungler. That was my point.

idk I mostly do 3-or-more-stacks but maybe that's just me. Even so you could just pick something ridiculous like SD potm and win every fight you start and run from every fight you can't win.

Wait.
I just realized Doppelwalk rapes this strat.
Fuck.

I'm up for trying it.

Are you challenging me to Fistful of Ring of Health.

[Deleted]

Is CM viable yet

[Nelavar]

Define viable.
The way I see it you can make any hero work

[Deleted]

Nothing really says they have to go with something 100% perfect. I can just as easily jungle myself and have some pubbie support the offlane *shrug*

99% of my solo queues are 2-1-1. As I said, you have no control over the other pubbies. Getting a guy to dual lane off lane with you is very unlikely.

Are you challenging me to Fistful of Ring of Health.

Not a challenge, a test to confirm our theories.

Also, didn't someone talk about a 1v1 tourny?

[Lysah]

CM is viable for the first 9 minutes of the game.

[Charge me Doctor]

SD/SA is 10x harder to beat than PL/kotl, because they have actual heavy presence. Or try a CM/DK lane. Throw in a batch of fresh gyro/ogre on top and you have tons of lanes that are a lot stronger than phantom garbage/keeper of the awful.

And did you just say pa/cm is less scary than pl/kotl? I'm disappointed. Maybe I need to learn you people how to play PA.

I like gyro bane. It's like, attack enemy to pull creeps on bane, nightmare on enemy, pull creeps from enemy, gyro turns on his yatatatata skill and enemy is dead

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Is CM viable yet

since i got eul common item yes she is

[potis]

Meh, i like MOBA's so much since i played Dota for so long and since forever, even when it was just in the first beta phases in 2003..

But Dota 2 is pushing me away so much..This matchmaking...3-5 faceroll stomp wins, 3-5 faceroll stomp loses, there isnt any middle ground at all, like ever.

The games are always some form of stomping..At least add a surrender button already, wasting so much time on each game, and i cant even sit AFK since it gives you an abandonment the last couple of months.

Like my last game..4 man premade on my side, 0-3-0/0-0-0/0-5-0/0-5-0 IN 8 MINUTES,the only reason the dude has 0-0-0, was because it was Prophet jungling and i had 1-0-0 in suicide lane versus Tinker/Nyx with Windrunner..

Oh not to mention the 0-5/0-5 was Sven/Sand King losing to a CM/Bristle, apparently 1 shotting crystal maiden at level 3 is hard business.

[Lysah]

I like gyro bane. It's like, attack enemy to pull creeps on bane, nightmare on enemy, pull creeps from enemy, gyro turns on his yatatatata skill and enemy is dead

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since i got eul common item yes she is

I was going to say Bane at first for that lane as well, you can also missile > nightmare > yatatatata but Bane is too fragile to protect Gyro from enemy aggressive lanes imo.

[Kjalar]

This matchmaking...3-5 faceroll stomp wins, 3-5 faceroll stomp loses, there isnt any middle ground at all, like ever.

Most of the time it's not because of MM, it's because lots of people go "ff plz, i'll afk" after being ganked 3-4 times or seeing their team is slightly behind on kills at the 20 min mark.

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Also, lots of pub players don't seem to understand that heroes reach their maximum at different periods of time. I had so many matches when it looked like we're totally fucked, but we turtled for 40 minutes and eventually won when our carry heroes became big enough to kill the entire team, because the opponent's lineup was caster-heavy, hence useless in late game, where everyone and their dog has BKB. Since most pub players give up really fast, they rarely see such things happening.

[Charge me Doctor]

most of the time it's not because of mm, it's because lots of people go "ff plz, i'll afk" after being ganked 3-4 times or seeing their team is slightly behind on kills at the 20 min mark.

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also, lots of pub players don't seem to understand that heroes reach their maximum at different periods of time. I had so many matches when it looked like we're totally fucked, but we turtled for 40 minutes and eventually won when our carry heroes became big enough to kill the entire team, because the opponent's lineup was caster-heavy, hence useless in late game, where everyone and their dog has bkb. Since most pub players give up really fast, they rarely see such things happening.

"omg who fed nix so hard noobs ltp ff"

[Scummer]

Also, lots of pub players don't seem to understand that heroes reach their maximum at different periods of time. I had so many matches when it looked like we're totally fucked, but we turtled for 40 minutes and eventually won when our carry heroes became big enough to kill the entire team, because the opponent's lineup was caster-heavy, hence useless in late game, where everyone and their dog has BKB. Since most pub players give up really fast, they rarely see such things happening.

Well I had a game somewhat like that the other day.
Our hard carry was an Alchemist who was behind on farm, but had a midas so his levels weren't bad. But he was still behind the enemy team. I was also playing BH that game. Our Alch had a somewhat negative outlook on the match while the rest of the team were flat out "ff end it".
Actually convincing them that if Alch got steady farm and we got some good track kill pick offs then he would be up to snuff quite quickly. They kinda listened which was good. We won the next team fight.
Then we lost the rest and the game. But it didn't exactly end without a good fight either. I think we could've won if everybody else had actually stayed positive throughout the game.

If I could count the games where we've stomped a team with an AM and not done it fast enough, only for it to reach late game and AM demolish us.

On a somewhat similar note I get really annoyed by people who tell me to FF only for them to continue fighting. If they want it to end fast then don't defend, it strikes me as hypocritical. As if my team wasn't already trying to win in the first place, we have to be told to.

[Drunkenvalley]

Here's something I've seen a few times: I play AM, I get free farm, my GPM , KDA, XP min, etc, it's all going better than anyone else. But when I tried to join into the fighting again, there was just... nowhere to go. We never got any good opportunity to initiate, and the rest of my team were too easily picked off for us to assemble a teamfight.

[Rucati]

Also, lots of pub players don't seem to understand that heroes reach their maximum at different periods of time. I had so many matches when it looked like we're totally fucked, but we turtled for 40 minutes and eventually won when our carry heroes became big enough to kill the entire team, because the opponent's lineup was caster-heavy, hence useless in late game, where everyone and their dog has BKB. Since most pub players give up really fast, they rarely see such things happening.

While this is true, there are also a lot of games that are over in the first 20 minutes.

Played one earlier, we had Prophet (me), Bounty Hunter, Bloodseeker, Obsidian Destroy and.. One other person, don't remember, my friend was playing him though. The enemy team had a Tinker, that's about all that mattered. Our OD had absolutely no clue how to play, he would imprison everybody we opened on, and didn't know he could auto cast his Q skill. Bounty Hunter solo'd long lang , so even though he had decent levels he had no gold to do damage. Tinker completely took away my ability to push anything, since if I tried pushing he'd just teleport to the tower with Boots of Travel, use his AoE skill twice and then leave, which would kill all the creeps and any treants I had summoned. And Bloodseeker had something like 250gpm, which wasn't bad considering we couldn't leave our base after about the fifteen minute mark.

And yet, the game continued. For like 30 more minutes. There was no way we could come back, at all, wasn't even remotely possible. When the only person with more than 350gpm is a Nature's Prophet and the enemy team has three people over 400gpm, it's just bad. There's no point in trying, you can't come back from that, it's completely impossible.

Of course there are some games where turtling can win you the game, but in the vast majority it's just a waste of time. Your carry player has to know how to farm while being stuck in a small area, because the enemy team will have map control and so the enemy carry will get more farm than yours unless your carry knows how to farm. Which is pretty rare in pub games.

[Charge me Doctor]

I think im done supporting in pubs, theres no point. Ide rather lose as 5 carries than be blamed for everything.

Im always the only support, and people constantly whine when I either dont have money for wards, smokes, items.

Or they whine when I forget to use one of my 9 fucking spells. Must be so hard right clicking to win.

I remember being yelled at for "not warding runes". Had wards on both runes 'till ~14 minute, our mid liner haven't got any rune for all this time. Now i see no point in warding pre late game at all

[Deleted]

People tend to give up quicker on mid-high MMR and then it drastically changes when you get to very high MMR. It's funny because people think they are so good at that level and they can quickly see if game is lost or not.