The Brewmaster Tanking Guide [5.4]

[DesireKT]

I dont think you understand how rune works;

You have:
4k haste
3k mastery
7k crit

Rune procs:
0 haste
0 mastery
14k crit

if it works the opther way around, it's a godly OP ability, but that seems quite farfetched

I'm pretty sure it works the other way around...

It takes your highest stat and turns all of your other stats into that number for 20 seconds.

9000 haste 1700 Mastery 6000 Crit turns everything into 9000 for 20 seconds. More than likely it has an extremely large cooldown. But is very OP.

[Deleted]

It states it would convert the stats into the highest of them, which leads me to believe that it works the way Zonex described it. And thats why I will pass on it for our Agility DPS, even though the passive agility seems nice. I just don't want to have 0 mastery and 0 haste while the proc is going on, leaving me with more EB-stacks then I could possibly use, or without EB-stacks but enough haste to constantly energy cap.

[krykiett]

I'm pretty sure it works the other way around...

It takes your highest stat and turns all of your other stats into that number for 20 seconds.

9000 haste 1700 Mastery 6000 Crit turns everything into 9000 for 20 seconds. More than likely it has an extremely large cooldown. But is very OP.

That's how I am reading it to function, but do we have any concrete information on that yet? Or is this datamined material?

[Kisho]

It says it 'converts' all of your secondary stats into 1 of the 3, whichever is highest. That leads me to believe 2 of your 3 stats will become 0 whilst the proc is active, with the third being stupidly high. So this is what would happen for me:

According to the armory, I have 6161 haste, 6998 crit, and 1398 mastery. I'm not going to bother with raid buffs to keep the example simple.

So crit is my highest stat, which means when the Rune procs I will have 6998 + 6161 + 1398 = 14,557 crit rating, but 0 haste and 0 mastery. 0 mastery is negligible, who cares, but 0 haste means my Chi generation slows right down. That would be annoying at best, and potentially self-destructive at worst. You'd gain a lot of crit which could mean you'd have as good as 100% uptime on EB when it procs, but is that really necessary?

The alternative is if haste is your highest stat, you'd lose all your crit so get no EB procs at all during the proc, then gain an absolute ton of haste, more than you'd ever need. That alternative isn't quite so bad in my mind, but you're not really gaining all that much during the proc either.

It all rests on whether 2 of the 3 stats are actually zero'd out, or if the highest stat just gains the values of the other 2 without losing them. If you don't lose them, Rune is probably going to be BiS (and make sure crit is your highest stat). If you do, it sounds far too problematic. Give it to a DPSer.

[imoom]

I dont think Rune of Re-Origination is that good, I do however belive it redistributes stats instead of making all stats as high as your highest. and as a "reditribute trinket" it isnt very good.

I think i am going to aim for: (more or less in order)
Talisman of Bloodlust (seems very good, depends on uptime ofc)
Renataki's Soul Charm (depends on ICD, and a little on if expertise is hard or easy to get)
Ji-Kun's Rising Winds
Delicate Vial of the Sanguinaire (We do dodge alot, depending on ICD (low proc chance usually means there is no icd, means this can be one of the best)
and last
Steadfast Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault
Vicious Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault

the rest i will probably not even bother picking up. maybe the stamina trinket just to have one for gimmick fights.

[Kisho]

I don't think anyone can deny that Talisman of Bloodlust will be one of our BiS. As said before, it's pretty much all of our haste in a single trinket, assumimg it's a 100% uptime (and trinkets like that usually are). I'll definitely go for that, then entirely reforge/regem away from haste. I may even value it lower than mastery when we get our 4 piece bonus, but that one is subject to actual testing/mathing.

The second slot is the tricky one. Since Rune is the only other one with passive agility (but the proc is questionable), we have a bit of choice in regards to it. Personally I'm thinking Renataki's, since the proc seems rather nice and the expertise will be nice to hit hard cap, which I'll probably go for in 5.2. Ji-kun's seems nice, but we have Expel Harm to handle that emergency heal, so the proc is slightly devalued there. Delicate Vial... Dodge is a bit meh as a passive effect, and mastery as a proc is our worst stat (even if the uptime is solid). Not sure on that one. The Vicious Talisman looks like a nice trinket too.

The Steadfast talisman could be interesting. That + EB = funtimes? I wonder how much avoidance we could have with both of those active. Sure, that crazy avoidance won't last long, but perhaps there'll be a very slow hitting boss that we can time EB for, similar to Sha of Fear? Seems like the sort of thing you have in your bags, to pull out for the specific bosses.

So yeah: Bloodlust/Renataki's for me I'd say.

[Vasilisa]

Your shuffle uptime could be a bit better (maybe need more haste?) and you really don't seem to be using your CD's as much as you can. The hardest hitting part of the fight is the pull and each time the reinforcements respawn. I usually make sure I have Fort Brew up for those stages and call for a good external, mostly use DH near CD and around Whirling Blades to keep damage smooth from the adds.

Clearing stagger is a tricky part of the fight you will probably have to accept being at moderate/heavy stagger more than normal unless you have a ton of haste to fuel your Chi. I've sort of gotten in a rythm of using KS and SCK to fuel Stagger+Guard and use the Chi from EH to PB (so about 4x a minute) since the EH will heal the stagger tick anyways and then gets cleared.

If your two tanking it you can probably afford to use SKC a lot more it was my most damaging ability with Keg Smash coming in close 2nd. This will result in a lot less EB stacks but a huge amount of GotO orbs to feed yourself health endlessly. Also I use Xuen instead of RJW, my last kill he did 35mil damage and my total DPS ended up at 570k.

This is all 25m HC but I think the advise would be the same either way.

Thanks for the tips, I'll try using xuen instead of jw and perhaps try to cleanse the dot on higher amount. Hope to see the kill in the incoming week.

[imoom]

I also recommend Xuen, use it smart (aka at the boss with 600% damage taken increase, and it will do more damage then some players)
additional tip from me is to try and use guard when at high vengeance, but no other (including elusive brew) CD is up. Also to try and purify just before or after you cast guard so the stagger dont eat the guard for you.

external CD's can help alot when all adds are up, use them

and for dps. Max AoE, then single target nuke boss (still KS ofc) + xuen and agi pot during recklesness.
That is my tip, and I am currrently ranked #1 on windlord DPS of brewmaster in 10hc at 1.1million dps.

[Deldavala]

I don't think anyone can deny that Talisman of Bloodlust will be one of our BiS. As said before, it's pretty much all of our haste in a single trinket, assumimg it's a 100% uptime (and trinkets like that usually are). I'll definitely go for that, then entirely reforge/regem away from haste. I may even value it lower than mastery when we get our 4 piece bonus, but that one is subject to actual testing/mathing.

The second slot is the tricky one. Since Rune is the only other one with passive agility (but the proc is questionable), we have a bit of choice in regards to it. Personally I'm thinking Renataki's, since the proc seems rather nice and the expertise will be nice to hit hard cap, which I'll probably go for in 5.2. Ji-kun's seems nice, but we have Expel Harm to handle that emergency heal, so the proc is slightly devalued there. Delicate Vial... Dodge is a bit meh as a passive effect, and mastery as a proc is our worst stat (even if the uptime is solid). Not sure on that one. The Vicious Talisman looks like a nice trinket too.

The Steadfast talisman could be interesting. That + EB = funtimes? I wonder how much avoidance we could have with both of those active. Sure, that crazy avoidance won't last long, but perhaps there'll be a very slow hitting boss that we can time EB for, similar to Sha of Fear? Seems like the sort of thing you have in your bags, to pull out for the specific bosses.

So yeah: Bloodlust/Renataki's for me I'd say.

I guess I will take a number of trinkets based on fights. But as you concluded with(assuming 100% uptime) the trinkets for most fights will be Talisman of bloodlust and Renatakis soul charm. My biggest problem is if I should pass the trinkets to DPS before I take them for myself and the fact that I might end up as DPS in 5.2 and the excess Expertise can be to hard to get rid of.

[Deix-EU]

It says it 'converts' all of your secondary stats into 1 of the 3, whichever is highest. That leads me to believe 2 of your 3 stats will become 0 whilst the proc is active, with the third being stupidly high. So this is what would happen for me:

According to the armory, I have 6161 haste, 6998 crit, and 1398 mastery. I'm not going to bother with raid buffs to keep the example simple.

So crit is my highest stat, which means when the Rune procs I will have 6998 + 6161 + 1398 = 14,557 crit rating, but 0 haste and 0 mastery. 0 mastery is negligible, who cares, but 0 haste means my Chi generation slows right down. That would be annoying at best, and potentially self-destructive at worst. You'd gain a lot of crit which could mean you'd have as good as 100% uptime on EB when it procs, but is that really necessary?

The alternative is if haste is your highest stat, you'd lose all your crit so get no EB procs at all during the proc, then gain an absolute ton of haste, more than you'd ever need. That alternative isn't quite so bad in my mind, but you're not really gaining all that much during the proc either.

It all rests on whether 2 of the 3 stats are actually zero'd out, or if the highest stat just gains the values of the other 2 without losing them. If you don't lose them, Rune is probably going to be BiS (and make sure crit is your highest stat). If you do, it sounds far too problematic. Give it to a DPSer.

This is semantically impossible. "Converts into" means "transformed in <what_follows>", doesn't mean "transfer".
Mathematically with predicate :

highestOf (X, Y, Z) = Z && converts(X, highestOf(X, Y, Z)) -> X = Z && Y = Z && Z = Z

If it would have been the other meaning, the trinket would have said "transfered", somehow.

[Kisho]

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/convert?s=t

to change (something) into a different form or properties; transmute; transform.

To change. As in, changing from one form into another.

At any rate, it's confusing at best and needs clarification. If you go to 0 in 2 of your 3 stats, it's not worth taking: if you keep those stats the same while boosting the third, it's BiS. We can only wait and see what it'll actually be like.

[Deix-EU]

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/convert?s=t



To change. As in, changing from one form into another.

At any rate, it's confusing at best and needs clarification. If you go to 0 in 2 of your 3 stats, it's not worth taking: if you keep those stats the same while boosting the third, it's BiS. We can only wait and see what it'll actually be like.

That. Yes, transform as I said it.
When frog transforms / converts into charming prince, that doesn't mean that frog becomes "void" and prince becomes a "frog prince" ;D.

This trinket is BiS and scales with the rating delta between your stats, encouraging you to choose one mostly crit with the T15 bonus.
If this trinket drops on last bosses, I wouldn't be surprised.

[Kisho]

That. Yes, transform as I said it.
When frog transforms / converts into charming prince, that doesn't mean that frog becomes "void" and prince becomes a "frog prince" ;D.

Exact same thing is happening in my theory: the stats aren't disappearing, they're being 'converted' into the highest stat. What you seem to be suggesting, using your own example, is the frog transforming into a prince while also leaving a perfect copy of itself as a frog behind.

Arguing semantics is pointless at any rate. We'll get clarification once someone is able to test the trinket in practice.

[Deix-EU]

Exact same thing is happening in my theory: the stats aren't disappearing, they're being 'converted' into the highest stat. What you seem to be suggesting, using your own example, is the frog transforming into a prince while also leaving a perfect copy of itself as a frog behind.

Arguing semantics is pointless at any rate. We'll get clarification once someone is able to test the trinket in practice.

True. But in fact, this is not what my "funny example" suggests. It suggests that Frog as id = 1, prince id = 2.
Frog becomes a prince but keep id = 1 (with no copy of itself behind, it just another form... in fact what the word "transform" means).

The fact is you take the word "into" as a "move", not a transformation. But you're right about the fact that IF BLIZZARD MADE A SEMANTIC mistake in the writing there is a chance this will be other way in live while testing.
What is unarguable is that saying "converts into" while thinking "moving" is incorrect.

[Kisho]

From what I can tell, we have 3 possibilities for this trinket:

1. It puts 2 of your 3 stats to 0, and adds the values of those 2 stats to the third. So you have 3k crit, 4k haste, 2k mastery, it would give you 0 crit, 0 mastery, and 3k + 4k + 2k = 9k haste during the proc.

2. It adds all 3 values together, but doesn't touch the 2 lower stats. So as in the example above, you get the 9k haste from adding the 3 values together, but also keep the 3k crit and 2k mastery.

3. It bumps the 2 lower stats up to the value of the third. So during the proc, you'd have 4k crit, 4k, haste, 4k mastery.

If it's the first option, it's problematic. If it's the second, it's BiS. If it's the third, it's a bit 'meh' compared to other trinkets based on the proc alone. We're getting several thousands of secondary stats, or even primary stats from other trinkets... depending on how you gear, the third option could only give you 1-2k stats. Or, if you stack a single stat to the heavens and back, it could give you a lot of benefit. The higher the differences between your highest stat and the other two stats, the more benefit you get. Which is why I don't think it'll be that third option, since it could be pretty gamebreaking if used correctly.

The interesting thing with this trinket is that it scales with the rest of your gear and has the potential to change gearing strategies fairly significantly. It'll also scale into the next tier of raiding and even the next expansion (though I bet the trinket will get nerfed in 6.0, probably so it can only convert a maximum number of stats).

So yeah. We'll see!

[Deix-EU]

I'm sorry dude, you seem to persist and I apologize for continuing the debate but I don't see any other explanation but your 3.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/convert+into

You don't have to look the word "convert" but "convert into" as a whole which clearly means "change something in another form".

- If it's 1, you agree to say that 2 of your lowest stats "change in the form of 0" ? (which is incompatible with convert into THE HIGHEST ...)
- If it's 2, the 2 lowest stats don't "change in another form", you say they stay the same (while adding their value etc.)
- If it's 3, which is, I'm 100% sure about it the only way to understand logically the thing : your 2 lowest stats "change in the third" (and obvisouly the third in the third in the algorithm but yeah, pointless)

But well, with respect, if after that you are not convinced logically I won't argue more ^^.

[Deleted]

From what I can tell, we have 3 possibilities for this trinket:

1. It puts 2 of your 3 stats to 0, and adds the values of those 2 stats to the third. So you have 3k crit, 4k haste, 2k mastery, it would give you 0 crit, 0 mastery, and 3k + 4k + 2k = 9k haste during the proc.

2. It adds all 3 values together, but doesn't touch the 2 lower stats. So as in the example above, you get the 9k haste from adding the 3 values together, but also keep the 3k crit and 2k mastery.

3. It bumps the 2 lower stats up to the value of the third. So during the proc, you'd have 4k crit, 4k, haste, 4k mastery.

I'm not sure where you try to find any semantic ambiguity but there is none.

1. This. Definitely! It converts your 3k crit to 3k haste and your 2k mastery to 2k haste, leaving you with 9k haste and 0 mastery and crit.

2. If the frog becomes a prince he's a frog no longer. He's a prince! There's no frog left. Haven't you read the story? ;-)
I'm serious though. If you convert your 3000 USD to Euro you don't get to keep your Dollars. You have Euros, nothing else.

3. I can not at all see how one could derive this meaning from the wording on the trinket.

[sleepness]

Does anyone here have experience solo tanking H Protectors (10man?) I feel like my utility in throwing out raid guards is pretty much unmatched vs what our warrior tank could provide, but I feel that I'm insanely spiky on that fight to the point where if corrupted waters is up too long I will die or just random tank death where I don't have a cooldown up. We are two healing with a resto sham / disc priest.

[gynshon]

Does anyone here have experience solo tanking H Protectors (10man?) I feel like my utility in throwing out raid guards is pretty much unmatched vs what our warrior tank could provide, but I feel that I'm insanely spiky on that fight to the point where if corrupted waters is up too long I will die or just random tank death where I don't have a cooldown up. We are two healing with a resto sham / disc priest.

Most all of us that has downed H Protectors solo tanked it. We are the best class for it IMHO due to 2 abilities, Glyphed Guard and Diffuse Magic. Since you kill Kaolan first, your spikeyness is only at the beginning of the fight.

- Guard on CD
- Interrupt rotation on Asani
- Always stand in the waters for the buff
- Burn Kaolan, and use EB freely until he is dead.
- Alternate Guard, Diffuse, Fort as needed when the Corrupted Water spawns.
- Have some random person interrupt Regail when Corrupted water spawns.
- Loot boss.

It is very easy if you can work out the stat rotation. Tanks getting stacks early on makes this fight a joke due to the amount of vengeance we have, and shortend the kill time down alot.

[SurrealNight]

3. It bumps the 2 lower stats up to the value of the third. So during the proc, you'd have 4k crit, 4k, haste, 4k mastery.

I'm still putting my money on this scenario. I don't have any factual proof but that is my interpretation and first impression of the tool tip language.