[Megathread] Elder Scrolls Online

[papajohn4]

You will be able to earn enough skill points to unlock every ability in the game. Some skills will offer morph options so they split into two trees. You can only play one morph tree at a time but you can respec to change your morph tree. They said however far along you are in the morph tree (let's say you completed it) if you later respec to go in to the other morph tree, you will then have the same progress in that - so all of it would be unlocked in this example.

So you can end up when you are finally done progressing your character with skills for every armor type and every weapon type, all your class skills, all of the skills available through guilds and pvp. Also there are world skills you can find which are hidden (such as the trees for vampirism and lycanthropy).

Deck building is selecting which skills you have amassed in your arsenal to go on your hot bar which is limited to 5 skills plus an ultimate. These skills will then be the ones you use in combat until you swap them out when out of combat. At level 15 you unlock weapon swapping. Your second weapon will have a different set of abilities on its hotbar. So in essence, you can swap between these two sets of skills on your hot bar as you swap weapons. So you would have 10 skills plus 2 ultimates to play with during battles.

Also, there's no global cooldown or cooldown of any sort on your skills. You have to manage your resources. You could spam your skills but once you use up your stamina or magicka you are screwed. So you have to be careful about how spammy you are.

You get rewarded by how well you perform in combat. This charges your finesse (which fuels the ultimate), grants extra loot and sometimes the kill cam. At low levels it is harder to get the finesse bonus if you are grouped but grouping will grant you extra xp and easier time progressing through content. At higher levels, it will be easier to earn finesse in groups doing dungeons because those mobs are harder to kill.

Thanks a lot for the very informative post. I hope it will take very very long time until you complete your skill trees...maybe months so it will feel like a worthy and long goal among all others

[Tabbycat]

Here's another great video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNTwTYi90pc

Keep in mind the game is in early beta so all the stuff we know is subject to change upon release.

[Worgoblin]

Kinda like AA's in EQ?

Im actually starting to think this game may be pretty good by hearing the kind of depth it seems to have. After all the games over the last 3 or 4 years, this is going to be a refreshing change to mmo that just seem to not have that UMMPH after a few days of game play. (swotor, gw2, tera etc.)

I don't understand why more MMO's don't have an AA or RR(realm rank) progression system like EQ or DAOC. I love that type of endless progression. It really keeps me invested in my character knowing I can continually improve.

[Loaf Lord]

Don't know if this was linked already, but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ed2VZXMJo8Y Paul Sage talks about crafting.

[Valeron]

I don't understand why more MMO's don't have an AA or RR(realm rank) progression system like EQ or DAOC. I love that type of endless progression. It really keeps me invested in my character knowing I can continually improve.

AA's are a tricky beast

I remember in Age of Conan when they were introduced. Soon after it was mandatory to have certain AA traits in order to participate in the end game stuff. So while I like the additional progression, it will be used by the player base as another gear/skill check in order to participate.

[Fencers]

AA's are a tricky beast

I remember in Age of Conan when they were introduced. Soon after it was mandatory to have certain AA traits in order to participate in the end game stuff. So while I like the additional progression, it will be used by the player base as another gear/skill check in order to participate.

That's exactly what happened in EQ with AA. The only game I know of with AA that eschewed that problem was Rift. And Trion did it by making the bonuses relative small and not too game impacting. Swim 3% faster? That doesn't break progression usually.

[papajohn4]

That's exactly what happened in EQ with AA. The only game I know of with AA that eschewed that problem was Rift. And Trion did it by making the bonuses relative small and not too game impacting. Swim 3% faster? That doesn't break progression usually.

but if the bonus are small then there will be not enough intensive to do?and what is wrong with the AA needed to participate in something?obviously there will be people more advanced and people less advanced, it is not like that everyone will be advanced and only few will be behind...people will always set rules for entering into content with them, either gear or specific talent build, or ilvl(something similar)..you can't avoid that

[Fencers]

but if the bonus are small then there will be not enough intensive to do?

Giving players a +1 bonus to strength is usually enough. That is exactly what Rift does with it's PA and people grind the living hell out of it for... +1 strength or whatever.

What Trion smartly did was toss in a lot of "sideways" fluff along the road to getting that +1 bonus to this or that stat. So it provides a quantifiable sense of progression on two fronts; "I am stronger now." and "I can do something better now."

It also let's Trion control the impact and pacing of AA across all tiers of content. Which EQ and the older MMOs were historically unable to do.

what is wrong with the AA needed to participate in something?

It creates a barrier. One that becomes larger over the lifetime of the game. Putting new players and alts progressively greater disadvantage. We have EQ1, EQ2, AOC and AC as evidence of this before those games were forced to overhaul their systems,

people will always set rules for entering into content with them, either gear or specific talent build, or ilvl(something similar)..you can't avoid that

"LF2M: Warrior and Mesmer only, FOTM 40" <-- player created rule
"LF2M: 74/90 AA Strike-through War only" <-- developer created rule

There is a difference. Gameplay is an absolute.

[zaxlor]

but if the bonus are small then there will be not enough intensive to do?and what is wrong with the AA needed to participate in something?obviously there will be people more advanced and people less advanced, it is not like that everyone will be advanced and only few will be behind...people will always set rules for entering into content with them, either gear or specific talent build, or ilvl(something similar)..you can't avoid that

Because then you get gearscore all over again. "LFG End Game Raid. Must have over 9000 AA points!" will happen, constantly. Lets say hitting max level you have a total of say 1000 stat points. The games first raid can of course be completed with that stat level, but now you introduce AA levels that allow you to gain 1100 stat points. Now, the first raid won't be balanced around it, but you can bet people will require/expect you to have hit that platue in order to make the game easier. Why wouldn't they? Now the next raid comes out, but what level does that get scaled to? 1000? 1100? How much do you make people grind in order to see more content?

You don't reward people for time spent, unless it's cosmetic or not game play related, else you've imidiately cut the amount of people that can use that reward down and you're wasting time on the 1%, not the 99% playing the game.

[sharam]

I been waiting for an Elder Scrolls online MMO, if this turns out to be really amazing bye bye WoW. I love WoW but Elder Scrolls that series was amazing even for the original arena game.

[Woakerio]

Because then you get gearscore all over again. "LFG End Game Raid. Must have over 9000 AA points!" will happen, constantly. Lets say hitting max level you have a total of say 1000 stat points. The games first raid can of course be completed with that stat level, but now you introduce AA levels that allow you to gain 1100 stat points. Now, the first raid won't be balanced around it, but you can bet people will require/expect you to have hit that platue in order to make the game easier. Why wouldn't they? Now the next raid comes out, but what level does that get scaled to? 1000? 1100? How much do you make people grind in order to see more content?

You don't reward people for time spent, unless it's cosmetic or not game play related, else you've imidiately cut the amount of people that can use that reward down and you're wasting time on the 1%, not the 99% playing the game.

I would prefer WoW's take on gear as opposed to GW2's any day. It makes your gametime and effort feel meaningful and rewarding; however, I feel that a good compromise is making it so that people that can't play as often take a bit longer to get the best gear, whereas someone who can play a lot more can just get it faster.

I think people that spend a ton of time on the game putting in effort should get access to things at a faster rate, as long as it doesn't become exclusive to them or nigh-impossible to get for the rest. It's the nature of the sub payment model beast; you get good gear progression but it takes time to get the best items.

[LockyShaman]

Have we got new gameplay videos those last weeks?

[Woakerio]

Have we got new gameplay videos those last weeks?

I don't think people were allowed to film their demos

Only recent new video I've seen with game footage was: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dt3i-GLh_h0

[Valstorm Warsong]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvEBPhaW4bk

new video

[blackyfrost]

Because then you get gearscore all over again. "LFG End Game Raid. Must have over 9000 AA points!" will happen, constantly. Lets say hitting max level you have a total of say 1000 stat points. The games first raid can of course be completed with that stat level, but now you introduce AA levels that allow you to gain 1100 stat points. Now, the first raid won't be balanced around it, but you can bet people will require/expect you to have hit that platue in order to make the game easier. Why wouldn't they? Now the next raid comes out, but what level does that get scaled to? 1000? 1100? How much do you make people grind in order to see more content?

You don't reward people for time spent, unless it's cosmetic or not game play related, else you've imidiately cut the amount of people that can use that reward down and you're wasting time on the 1%, not the 99% playing the game.

everything in life rewards you for time spent lol
i hate this argument. it's what people who don't want to play the game regularly say. they want to pop in and out as they please and not fall behind
that's bullshit. you should fall behind, the path to catch up just needs to be there but it shouldn't be easy
if you don't punish those who log in 3 days a week, then you can't possibly reward those who log in 7 days a week

MMORPGs are a 7 day a week affair. it's a persistent world. that was the point before wow screwed it all up and started rewarding part time players and losers. "hey, do you have no clue what is going on? you'll still get honor and jp!!!"

[Loaf Lord]

I Wonder what they'll be doing for quick transportation. I'm thinking they'll just do a quick travel option where you can instantly teleport to an area if you've already explored it. No taxi service plox. Hell, I can't think of any winged creatures that would work as a taxi service lore-wise.

[Fencers]

everything in life rewards you for time spent lol
i hate this argument. it's what people who don't want to play the game regularly say. they want to pop in and out as they please and not fall behind
that's bullshit. you should fall behind, the path to catch up just needs to be there but it shouldn't be easy
if you don't punish those who log in 3 days a week, then you can't possibly reward those who log in 7 days a week

MMORPGs are a 7 day a week affair. it's a persistent world. that was the point before wow screwed it all up and started rewarding part time players and losers. "hey, do you have no clue what is going on? you'll still get honor and jp!!!"

I don't agree with your choice of words. However, I do share the viewpoint that an MMO is ideally a persistent struggle.

That being said, that type of MMO is at best niche in the current market. At worst, obsolete.

For good or ill, Warcraft did change the direction of the market and genre. And make no mistake, Elder Scrolls aims to appeal to the broadest, most mass market audience possible just as World of Warcraft.

Zeni/Beth are not going to make an MMO in the style of EQ/UO/M59. Pretty sure the games they are looking at as developers are Star Wars The Old Republic, World of Warcraft, Guild Wars 2, Planetside 2, etc.

They are making a Hollywood blockbuster. Not an arthouse indie film.

[Tabbycat]

There are some videos coming out now of people who were sneaky and got game play footage of ESO at PAX. I'm not posting any links to anything. Since ZOS has said they aren't allowing it, I would assume this forum wouldn't allow it either. There's also a lot of misleading ones out there so just be careful if you do happen to stumble across one.

[papajohn4]

Giving players a +1 bonus to strength is usually enough. That is exactly what Rift does with it's PA and people grind the living hell out of it for... +1 strength or whatever.

well I don't know how is working on Rift, but my experience in swtor datacorns(which in a similar way provides small bonuses of + stat) was not the same as you describe in Rift.

It creates a barrier. One that becomes larger over the lifetime of the game. Putting new players and alts progressively greater disadvantage.

I understand why is probably bad, I just say that if they are going to implement such a system they need to make it right and be meaningful. Puting a meaningless feature just to advertise it, is not going to work very well. Thats the problem, you cannot please them all. You need to chose your target of players. By releasing a semi feature, it will end up no one like it enough. "I will give hardcores a progression system so they will continue building their character while I will make it as decorative as possible so the new players will not feel bad or behind". I will not argue that lot of people will like it even in that way as there are people in other MMOs just completing achievements with no +power. But at least don't pretend that you will put a system from the old MMOs.

"LF2M: Warrior and Mesmer only, FOTM 40" <-- player created rule
"LF2M: 74/90 AA Strike-through War only" <-- developer created rule

There is a difference. Gameplay is an absolute.

What is the difference for the new player?in both scenarios he will not get invited. In one case he will blame players, in the other case he will blame the company. But the truth is that unless he becomes better he will not get invited to the good stuff unless he play with friends

[blackyfrost]

I don't agree with your choice of words. However, I do share the viewpoint that an MMO is ideally a persistent struggle.

That being said, that type of MMO is at best niche in the current market. At worst, obsolete.

For good or ill, Warcraft did change the direction of the market and genre. And make no mistake, Elder Scrolls aims to appeal to the broadest, most mass market audience possible just as World of Warcraft.

Zeni/Beth are not going to make an MMO in the style of EQ/UO/M59. Pretty sure the games they are looking at as developers are Star Wars The Old Republic, World of Warcraft, Guild Wars 2, Planetside 2, etc.

They are making a Hollywood blockbuster. Not an arthouse indie film.

you keep quoting me, agreeing then posting your PC disclaimer. relax

i personally have gotten too fat and lazy in my years playing wow to like an EQ/UO/M59 game anymore. i want a happy medium. wow is NOT a happy medium, it is a super casual MMO with a few things for hardcores to do, with TONS of artificial gating

and worst of all, they change shit just to change shit since cata. that's just grasping at straws.

having a specific target and giving that target all your attention is what they seem to be doing. they are not doing what wow does these days, which is put a little attention into everything under the sun.

a game needs focus and from what i've seen and read, ZOS is focused

wow has no target audience anymore, they just want your $15 a month. they're in "milk that motherfucker" mode. it feels like it when you play it, it seems like it every time they do something like give us ANOTHER talent system, and it seems like it when they talk about it.