Tanking heroic madness as a prot pala

[Deja Thoris]

Hi,

We finally killed spine and did a couple of pulls on madness. Long story made short is I die on impales and I can't quite seem to reconcile the maths with the logs.
Impales come at a duration of less than 3 min for me so my guardian isn't always up. We can slow down dps to make sure my guardian is up but that does not seem like an ideal solution. Also, we have no externals whatsoever for me such as sac or pain supression.

The impale tooltip says it deals 840k physical damage, it does not mention that the damage can't be mitigated so armor should reduce it?
My maths for impale with 2 minor CD's (2 20% cd's) looks like this.

840000x .3753 (armor)
315252 x.8 (1st CD)
252201 x.8 (2nd CD)
201761 is the damage I should take.

With raid buffs and 2x stam trinks I have approx 257k health. This drops to ~244k if I use SOE - which I didn't include in calcs above.


This is what the logs say http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=7900&e=8328
22:44:13.989] Dejadeux afflicted by Impale from Mutated Corruption
22:44:18.223] Mutated Corruption Impale Dejadeux 282146 (O: 177124)

First question, where is my maths wonky?
Second question, do we need to hold off dps to get my 50% CD up or is it doable with 2x20% CD's and SOE?

Any insights will be appreciated.

[Deleted]

Tell your holy priest to pick up disc, it's better on madness by a mile.

Math looks like this btw:

=840,000 impale
*0.90 10% Physical damage taken buff (shaman/priest buff)
*0.90 10% Sanctuary Talent
*0.85 15% Ardent defender
*0.80 20% Divine Protection
*0.75 25% Power of the Aspects (bliz monthly nerf)
=347004 dmg

Now with you can add stuff like SoE, PWS, WoG shield. Which will drop it another 100-110k.
And you can add STL aswell for another 10% if you want.

Not sure if hunter's Roar of Sacrifice works aswell.

Edit: Seems I forgot the nerf buff.

[Bibler]

Armor doesn't affect the impale damage.
We did it with the following rotation :
1.prot pala
2.bear
3.prot pala
4.bear
5.shadow priest
6.prot pala
7.shadow priest.
8.bear

Also you should notice to use every cooldown on all impales (goak, ad and dp), and dream instead of goak if your dps is good enough so your goak won't get back up for next impale. Having a holy/retdin sacrifice you is also good, if you have any.

[Deleted]

Heres the rotation you should be using

1st : Dream+ DP
2nd : DP + Guardian of ancient kings
3rd : DP+AD+External (barrier or Pain suppression or a sacrifice)
4th : DP + GoAK

as you dont have an external I'd suggest you use the FL trinket or if you have a feral druid in raid taunt off you on 3rd platform.

dont remember, but does Divine guardian with 4p reduce damage for yourself as well? if so, use it, also remember that you can use rallying cries if you have a warrior

[Ibis]

Based on those logs you haven't used any cooldown for that impale. (If you search with the Expression Editor for

sourceName = "Dejadeux"
AND Spell = "Ardent Defender"

it doesn't give any results.) Nor is there a Divine Protection logged for that impale. So you probably just missed your cooldowns by a fraction of a second or something.

22:44:18.223] Mutated Corruption Impale Dejadeux 282146 (O: 177124)

That's 459 270 damage combined.

840 000 * 0.90 (inspiration) * 0.90 (sanctuary) * 0.9 (vindication) * 0.75 (power of the aspects) = 459 270. (Though with AD+DP you still woud've gotten hit for 293 933).

[Vereesa]

Tell your holy priest to pick up disc, it's better on madness by a mile.

Math looks like this btw:

=840,000 impale
*0.90 10% Physical damage taken buff (shaman/priest buff)
*0.90 10% Sanctuary Talent
*0.85 15% Ardent defender
*0.80 20% Divine Protection
*0.75 25% Power of the Aspects (bliz monthly nerf)
=347004 dmg

Now with you can add stuff like SoE, PWS, WoG shield. Which will drop it another 100-110k.
And you can add STL aswell for another 10% if you want.

Not sure if hunter's Roar of Sacrifice works aswell.

Edit: Seems I forgot the nerf buff.

You didn't factor in the tank debuff either.

OT: Overall you're pretty ****ed as a Prot Pally on Madness. (even more so without any external cooldowns) Remember to use DP for every Impale as well. Oh and the Stay of Execution is a lifesaver as well, get it.

[Deleted]

You didn't factor in the tank debuff either.

OT: Overall you're pretty ****ed as a Prot Pally on Madness. (even more so without any external cooldowns)

Oh yeah.

That means you can go with
1: DP-Dream

2: DP-GoAK

3: DP-AD-STL-PWS-SoE-WoG shield and you will survive as long as priest/shaman keeps up buff.
=840,000 impale
*0.90 10% Physical damage taken buff (shaman/priest buff)
*0.90 10% Physical damage taken debuff (Vindication)
*0.90 10% Sanctuary Talent
*0.85 15% Ardent defender
*0.80 20% Divine Protection
*0.75 25% Power of the Aspects (bliz monthly nerf)
*0.90 10% Spirit Link Totem (optional)
=281073 dmg
Add PWS+WoG+SoE and it drops to 180k and you'll survive as long as you have full health.

4:
DP+GoAK

[frosthead]

for maximum comfort:
1 impale: dream + DP + AD + stay of execution(firelands rep trinket) + sit on 3 holy power and use wog right before it hits, you wont even take any damage most probably
2 impale: DP + GOAK + stay of execution + wog trick
3 impale: this one can be hardest since here you will need external cd - AD + DP + stay of execution + wog trick + painsup(best option)/rallying cry+priest barrier
4 impale: DP + GOAK + stay of execution + wog, this one actually is best done with spri or rogues so you will have your cds for last phase

dont hold off dps on corruptions, never. there are few moments in that fights when you might need to stop dps and that is on wing or arm tentacles to avoid having blistering stuff eariler and in last phase you may need to hold dps untill add are dealt with

[Deja Thoris]

Thanks for the great replies folks, they were really useful.

[Deleted]

I suggest your priest goes Discipline spec and you glyph for "Word of Glory" to overheal and give you a better WoG shield
Ofc don't drop any very important glyphs for it, and i would only recommend it for these kind of encounters rather than all the time.
Hope this helped.
Korthax - Doomhammer EU.

[UnderworldSoup]

So you're doing Restoration Shaman, Restoration Druid, Holy Priest? That doesn't make any sense from a raid utility perspective -- the Priest would be better suited as Discipline. You need some sort of external cooldown brought to the table to ease the transition between impales.

Korthax is correct. Utilize the Word of Glory glyph combined with the talent Guarded by the Light, and add Stay of Execution to it as well. The raw stamina trinkets from DS will not outmatch the Stay of Execution on this fight for a Protection Paladin.

[silvertitan]

I go with 1 stam trink 1 dps trink and the 3rd platform is the only one where i am at risk of dieing. Here's what i do
Plat 1. Dream
Plat 2. GotAK
Plat 3. AD+DP+PS
Plat 4. GotAK

This is for my 25 man run, in 10 we just have our hunter or rogue take the impale's

[AutomaticBadger]

I know this is going to be strange but... Can't yo bubble taunt it? If it deals only Physical then both bubble and physical bubble should work. Other than that I can't help. We have a Dk and he just HP+healer damage CD soak it.

[Chimaera]

I know this is going to be strange but... Can't yo bubble taunt it? If it deals only Physical then both bubble and physical bubble should work. Other than that I can't help. We have a Dk and he just HP+healer damage CD soak it.

The impale on heroic laughs at immunities.

[Deleted]

Can't tell you the math, but by looking on your line up:
use your shadow and hunter.

shadow can soak every 2nd or 3rd impale with dispersion,
while hunter should be able to take even each impale hit (tentacle casts impale, hunter feigns death - dunno about deterrence, but this shouldnt work).

in order to impale those two without getting melee hitted all melees have to clear melee range, while next target is the shadow or hunter.

it really softens the healing and cooldown requirement for this fight if you utilize your classes to this point.

rogues (vanish) would help too, but there isn't one in your line up (although rogues 70% slow in p2 is really useful). you have only one useful slow for the bloods (hunter with trap), so it might be difficult slowing all bloods. but that's another problem.

[jeenyus992]

What about using bubbles, then a /cancelaura? Just a thought...

[Téuntjûh]

bubble doesnt work on the impale.
What does work is the trinket from Hyjal (can't remember the name now, if you cant find it, gimme a pm)
Don't forget you have warriors shouts to help too, + shammy healers to increase your health

O, and use your wing + a big WoG on yourself just before the impale hits.

[Malthanis]

What about using bubbles, then a /cancelaura? Just a thought...

Expanding a bit on what Téuntjûh said: on heroic, Impale pierces immunity effects (i.e. Divine Shield, Hand of Protection).

bubble doesnt work on the impale.
What does work is the trinket from Hyjal (can't remember the name now, if you cant find it, gimme a pm)

You're talking about the Stay of Execution I believe.

[MerinPally]

I did some maths on this and put pictures on the prot guide, with the 30% nerf coming out next week I'll recalculate them over lunch (should only take 2 mins) and post them in big caps and numbers so that people can't miss it. I'll do both 10 and 25man numbers and list what cooldowns work and what don't Will put on both here and edit my post on the prot guide, that way you can't miss it.

[Keiyra]

So you're doing Restoration Shaman, Restoration Druid, Holy Priest? That doesn't make any sense from a raid utility perspective -- the Priest would be better suited as Discipline.

Maybe that's all they got and the priest sucks when he plays discipline. Not everyone is good at all specs and not every guild has a large back up roster or well geared alts

(most of heroic t11 and t12 we did with 2 resto druid and 1 resto shaman cause thats all we had. horray for no tank cd's till SLT was added...)

But i agree in general, if the priest can play disc, they should prolly swap to it as the added CD makes the fight a lot easier. Course now its 30% nerf so who knows, may not even be needed.