10% haste added to Seal of Insight

[meroko]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...7?page=79#1562

Great news but I still will miss keeping JoTP up

[Kerfax]

This is such good news! I can't wait to try this out on Beta, and personally I'm glad that it's not tied to having to judge.

[Deleted]

This is such good news! I can't wait to try this out on Beta, and personally I'm glad that it's not tied to having to judge.

Looks like alot of talents are going to be based around judging alot anyways, right?

EDIT: Sorry, I only PVP with my holy paladin and forgot that you guys might PvE and then I can see that youm ight not Judge all that much. :P

[Kelesti]

This is such good news! I can't wait to try this out on Beta, and personally I'm glad that it's not tied to having to judge.

Not having to Judge is good news!

This, not so much, personally. Why do Paladins need baseline haste when every other caster had haste/crit stripped from their abilities? We're all stuck with long-as-heck casts, and need to gear haste to make them actually usable. Why are Paladins so different?

[Chimaera]

Not having to Judge is good news!

This, not so much, personally. Why do Paladins need baseline haste when every other caster had haste/crit stripped from their abilities? We're all stuck with long-as-heck casts, and need to gear haste to make them actually usable. Why are Paladins so different?

Playing all 4 healing classes I have never really felt the need for paladins to have extra free haste, but when they were only single target healers it was nice for changing targets more quickly, or better reactive tank healing. I think this is a matter of people just not wanting to lose their toys.

[Deleted]

Not having to Judge is good news!

This, not so much, personally. Why do Paladins need baseline haste when every other caster had haste/crit stripped from their abilities? We're all stuck with long-as-heck casts, and need to gear haste to make them actually usable. Why are Paladins so different?

I might be totally wrong bit it feels like paladins suffer the most because firstly all other classes got hots so it's slightly less of a "if this heal don't hit in time the person going to die" because the hot will do some albeit small healing while you're casting, and also priests got shield which is incredible in the way that it both absorbs damage and is instant, shamans got tidal waves which is 30% haste on gheal and healing wave, Druids got tons of hots. I got no idea how monks work.


So it kinda feels like paladins suffers the most, especially with the loss of divine favor
If I'm of on anything please tell me.

---------- Post added 2012-07-10 at 11:57 AM ----------

Playing all 4 healing classes I have never really felt the need for paladins to have extra free haste, but when they were only single target healers it was nice for changing targets more quickly, or better reactive tank healing. I think this is a matter of people just not wanting to lose their toys.

This is what I've heard we're going to be doing in mop on the bosses that's released so far so we will hardly use holy radiance.

[Keiyra]

Why are Paladins so different?

Well...they are pink dots. Maybe just a case of squeaky wheel gets the grease
http://www.cad-comic.com/cad/20090916

So it kinda feels like paladins suffers the most, especially with the loss of divine favor

Pretty sure GC posted that they were giving them Divine Favor back (though that was before the seal change, so dunno if they scrapped the return of DF for the seal of if they are getting both

[Deleted]

Pretty sure GC posted that they were giving them Divine Favor back (though that was before the seal change, so dunno if they scrapped the return of DF for the seal of if they are getting both

Did not know that.

[swineflu]

everything appears to revolve around reducing holy paladin instant casts for pvp.

[Kyuuseishu]

everything appears to revolve around reducing holy paladin instant casts for pvp.

Well the change to Infusion of light was indeed for this reason, people complaining we had too many instants. Considering it wasn't always guaranteed since it was a proc, other classes still get similar amounts of instants, ones that are more reliable too.

[Sequence]

Good news, but still won't use Judgement.

[Seyka]

Happy day! With holy power stretched between LOD, WOG, EF, and HS, being able to land a faster big heal is in no way a negative.

[Deleted]

Personally I think it's boring and lazy.

Judging once/minute was hardly taxing (I actually liked it at the start of Cata when you Judged for mana) and it adds a nice bit of flavour to a bland class. With the gutting of Judgement, Flash of Light being almost pointless when you almost always have a hasted DL available and Radiance sucking hard, I pretty much only use shock, hasted HL/DL and Light of Dawn. Yawn.

Monk, Druid and Shaman healing are all far more interesting, and if Holy wasn't just my offspec I'd 100% be rerolling. Can't comment on Priests because I've never played one.

[Kerfax]

Not having to Judge is good news!

This, not so much, personally. Why do Paladins need baseline haste when every other caster had haste/crit stripped from their abilities? We're all stuck with long-as-heck casts, and need to gear haste to make them actually usable. Why are Paladins so different?

I understand why the base Haste and Crit were stripped before, but there were some issues on Beta with our casts being too slow during high damage periods and only having two potent instant casts (HS on a six second and WoG on an 18 second cooldown assuming HP gains). I think they are taking the classes in a good direction in MoP where they are trying to get rid of baseline stats that they then have to balance around, but Im going to say that since this change was made after raid testing started that it must have been necessary to put us even. I'm also really hoping that this isn't a first step into adding back multiple baseline stat gains though.

[Dubalicious]

Without a change/nerf/rework of Selfless Healer, we will likely be back to judging on/near cooldown. It's simply too good to ignore or just decide to not run with because you don't like the playstyle.

Also, I assume this 10% passive haste means we won't be getting Divine Favor back as GC had previously alluded to (can't seem to find the class balance blue post atm)

[Tangra]

I wonder if this will be a class-wide effect or for Holy only. 10% spell haste is actually a decent dps gain for Ret, especially now that haste effects lower the cooldown and global cooldown of pretty much every ability other than TV. I hope it ends up that wey so that Ret can actually use Insight once in a while without taking a gigantic dps loss.

[Kerfax]

I wonder if this will be a class-wide effect or for Holy only. 10% spell haste is actually a decent dps gain for Ret, especially now that haste effects lower the cooldown and global cooldown of pretty much every ability other than TV. I hope it ends up that wey so that Ret can actually use Insight once in a while without taking a gigantic dps loss.

It's tied into Seal of Insight, so even if the Haste is amazing for Ret you'd have to give up your dps seal to use it.

[UnderworldSoup]

I wonder if this will be a class-wide effect or for Holy only. 10% spell haste is actually a decent dps gain for Ret, especially now that haste effects lower the cooldown and global cooldown of pretty much every ability other than TV. I hope it ends up that wey so that Ret can actually use Insight once in a while without taking a gigantic dps loss.

Am I missing something here? How does Retribution benefit from spell haste? I thought it's GCDs were only reduced with actual haste and not melee/spell variations.

[Tangra]

It's tied into Seal of Insight, so even if the Haste is amazing for Ret you'd have to give up your dps seal to use it.

Well that's what I was talking about. 10% spell haste is a very significant reduction in the cooldown and global cooldown of crusader strike, judgement, hammer of the righteous, hammer of wrath, also possibly exorcism (I think I saw a post about exorcism being affected by sanctity of battle). I'm not saying Insight will become better than Truth, but it would be interesting to see the final numbers, it might actually lead to a very small dps loss for using Insight.

---------- Post added 2012-07-10 at 11:02 PM ----------

Am I missing something here? How does Retribution benefit from spell haste? I thought it's GCDs were only reduced with actual haste and not melee/spell variations.

5% spell haste from a shadow priest/boomkin/shaman DOES work with sanctity of battle because it is an actual haste buff not just a casting speed buff. 10% melee attack speed is not a haste buff so it does not work. On live 5% spell haste is actually a decent buff to the cooldown of crusader strike.

[swineflu]

Well the change to Infusion of light was indeed for this reason, people complaining we had too many instants. Considering it wasn't always guaranteed since it was a proc, other classes still get similar amounts of instants, ones that are more reliable too.

All the ways they have reduced instant casts so far:


Infusion of Light no longer grants instant Flash of Light

Daybreak no longer grants a free Holy Shock.

Fewer Flash of Lights for Beacon and fewer Holy Shocks means less Holy Power generation.

Glyph of Blessed Life returns 1 Holy Power every 20 seconds (%50 chance on hit or cc) vs every 8 seconds (%100 chance on hit or cc) fully specced.


Corollary: nerfing Holy Radiance (generates 1 HP) and buffing Light of Dawn (uses up to 3 HP) will tend to bleed Holy Power in REAL aoe heal situations.