and so, Vogel leaves

[Leonard McCoy]

Taken from http://www.swtor.com/info/faq


What makes Star Wars: The Old Republic unique?

Traditionally, MMOs are built on three pillars: exploration, combat, and progression. At BioWare and LucasArts, we believe most MMOs ignore an important fourth pillar: story. Our mission is to create the best story-driven games in the world, and we believe that the compelling, interactive storylines in The Old Republic are a significant innovation in the MMO genre.
The Old Republic intends to offer the best the MMO genre can produce. We have taken care to ensure that we improve on all the familiar hallmarks of the MMO genre while adding innovative new systems and gameplay. In The Old Republic, every character class has its own story, unique companion characters that join and assist the player, and even thrilling space combat and player starships! The Old Republic combines meaningful choice, story, and compelling design to deliver a groundbreaking MMO experience.


Can you honestly say that they have lived up to this? I don't have anything against SWTOR this is just an example. Every one of the companies responsible for the games you listed came up short on their own goals even if you ignore the hype generated by fans. I don't think people should bash a quality game or quality company no matter what the name on it is. However I also don't feel that quality companies should be given a free pass when they fail to deliver on their own stated goals.

When you read the whole paragraph and not just the bolded parts you take out of context, yes I can. You should apply for a job at Fox news, it's a rare skill to take something so out of context and throw it in peoples face.

As for vogel leaving it could mean a number of things. They could be taking the game in a new direction and thus want to hire NEW people. It could also mean their trimming the staff from this game. IIRC at one point the development staff was up to 200 people so yea some fat could be trimmed clearly.

[woodydave44]

You mean the hype built up by others and not anyone within the company itself? Yeah, games built up on that kind of hype are definitely going to wind up failing to live up to those expectations. Just look at D3. Or GW2 when it comes out. Or Rift. Or any CoD that came after the first MW. I could continue, but I won't.

If you actually followed development, you'd of seen the dozens of articles from EA and Bioware hyping the game...

These 2 are always my favorite

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/w...ublic-says-ea/

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/w...-list-says-ea/

[Clymene]

Rich Vogel leaves bioware...
http://www.theverge.com/gaming/2012/...ayoffs-rumored
soo, thoughts?

Can you tell me what exactly he did and how it will affect the game now he is gone?

I know you're just passing the info along, but no one (this includes the gaming press, if they can even be called press) ever explains how it could affect anything. I know what Georg did and its arguably if him leaving will have any detrimental effect.

I'm guessing Vogel was senior management. No point in having too many chiefs and not many indians.

[notorious98]

If you actually followed development, you'd of seen the dozens of articles from EA and Bioware hyping the game...

These 2 are always my favorite

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/w...ublic-says-ea/

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/w...-list-says-ea/

First, Riccitiello is a retard. I'm pretty sure his completely inept handling of the "overhaul" at EA has shown that. Second, I think you need to read the second article a little more thoroughly. Gibeau is hyping the EXACT thing that the game is stellar at, the story telling. At no point does he hype anything else BUT the story telling. And at no point in time does he say that the game is going to be the biggest, most earth shattering thing to happen to the world since the wheel. In fact, the first paragraph of the second article completely blows everything Gibeau says out of proportion.

Now EA Games boss Frank Gibeau explained to IndustryGamers why Old Republic can successfully challenge WoW's dominance.

The rest of the article lacks any mention of Gibeau saying they can, or will, successfully challenge WoW's dominance. In fact, all he does is ball wash Blizzard throughout the article.

[Rooflesstoofless]

EA probably had him on a list of overpaid F-ups and gave him his walking papers. He spent seven years as the producer of TOR...seven years for a game that lost nearly half of its paying audience within six months of launch. That can't make him look like a good investment.

I worked for a corporation where people were paid more in a year than I would make in eight only to be found out that they really didn't do anything for years (or taking credit for their subordinates work...love that one). Sometimes it takes a while for a person's ineptitude to catch up with them if they are good at faking the funk.

I honestly doubt it will have any negative effect on the game tho. Cut his sorry ass out and get someone worth their salt in his place and SWTOR will be the better for it.

[Deleted]

We know romney was working on the salt lake Olympics thing. We have no doubt of that. So it took 3 years to finalize his departure from Bain because he was busy and he wanted a lot of money. I think that its reasonable to want as much as you can get when you were a company founder... so it took a while to hammer out the details of his departure form the company.. /shakesfist THERE'S REAL ISSUES TO TALK ABOUT PEOPLE. REAL ONES!

Wanting to make more money isn't the issue. Making false statements and committing a fellony for more money however is an issue.

Seriously, no matter who you are. Republican or Democrat, don't make excuses for people like him. It wasn't a mistake, it was intentional.

[Clymene]

Wanting to make more money isn't the issue. Making false statements and committing a fellony for more money however is an issue.

Seriously, no matter who you are. Republican or Democrat, don't make excuses for people like him. It wasn't a mistake, it was intentional.

I think you are in the wrong thread

[Hostagecat]

I hate threads like this because they all devolve into I hate TOR threads, and why its a failure, by the way nobody stays on topic. The Racktrolls come out spinning the same old lines on how fail ToR is and no meaningful discussion happens.

I also dont have a clue on who this guy is, im sorry if they truly are having another round of layoffs, being laid off sucks. Personally I still think the game will get along fine without him, since i dont have a clue on how he impacts my playing the game.

[Xcitement]

Don't care.

I'm still having fun and looking forward to playing the game every night. After quitting the game twice already, patch 1.3 has me wanting to play endgame for the first time. Before patch 1.3, I would simply reroll a toon after hitting level 50. No more!

If the content is still worth running and the gear grind is still fun, I could care less about drops in subscribers, layoffs, or the exits of "visionaries". If I no longer find the game fun, I'll just quit again. No big deal.

I don't base my subscriptions on the perceived "health" of a game. If the ship sinks, why do I care if most of my time on that ship was fun? It's not my retirement or anything.

BREAKING NEWS: This guy gets it!

[Hostagecat]

BREAKING NEWS: This guy gets it!

Yes he does, but lets see how badly he gets flamed for having fun!!!!! I mean god forbid we have fun playing a game, dont you know the TORtanic is sinking?

At least thats what the Racktrolls would like you to think.

[woodydave44]

Even though you have proof, it doesnt count

Sorry, thats all I read.

If you are going to quote someone, quote don't change the words they said.

[Profyrion]

Rich Vogel leaves bioware...
http://www.theverge.com/gaming/2012/...ayoffs-rumored
soo, thoughts?

Thoughts:

• Meh.

[Deleted]

Thoughts:

• Meh.

Similar reponse here, as long as the team isnt cut down too much, i wont be worried, i will be eagerly watching 1.4 and 1.5's delivery dates and quality, if we dont get both before the end of the year i'll know they're slipping, and will consider going elsewhere with my cash.

But at the moment im happy with the pace of the patches and how they respond to bugs and wants of the community, lets see if they can keep it up after the restructures.

As for the timing, i think its horrible, TOR has been starting to generate a little bit of feel good, Server transfers, 1.3, the free to 15 and the HK trailer all have been positively received, we seemed to be getting some momentum, i think a good 1.4 reveal would have really kept the upward trend vibe-wise now this just kills it dead, unless we get a 1.4 reveal this week and its AWESOME, and theyre trying to bury this bad news between good news and then if they let it fester and no good reveals coming i'll be seriously questioning EAs Pr approach to the game

[Whitepepper]

When you read the whole paragraph and not just the bolded parts you take out of context, yes I can. You should apply for a job at Fox news, it's a rare skill to take something so out of context and throw it in peoples face.

Your over the top rhetoric doesn't change anything. I didn't take anything out of context, it's all there where everyone can read for themselves. I cited a source and copy/pasted the paragraph to make it easy to read. The bolded parts are bold claims that stood out to me. Opinions will vary but I don't believe they delivered on what they said in that paragraph. That isn't to say SWTOR is a bad game, it has some very enjoyable leveling. I'm not throwing anything in anyone's face.

As an aside; you might not like my opinion and that's fine. However, claiming I took something out of context when I provided the context and a link to the original work is uncalled for; in addition to be being an outright lie.

[SirRobin]

Rich Vogel leaves bioware...
http://www.theverge.com/gaming/2012/...ayoffs-rumored
soo, thoughts?

Meh... Called that back in March, or was it February? Gordon had the sense to bail before TOR was even on the shelves. His replacement, Hickman, survived every round of layoffs at Mythic so he's already got experience in keeping his head. Rich, with his ties to SWG, was pretty much a given as the "senior" sacrificial lamb. Just like Mark was at Mythic. The saddest part will be the next round of layoffs. Those are what will effectively put TOR in maintainance mode.

Its not like we have not seen this before guys. We went through the same process with WAR. First round you let the extras go, second round say good bye to one of the big guys, round three takes out bunches of the core group and pretty much puts the game in maintenance mode. Again, nothing new here.

---------- Post added 2012-07-18 at 01:55 PM ----------

Can you tell me what exactly he did and how it will affect the game now he is gone?

I know you're just passing the info along, but no one (this includes the gaming press, if they can even be called press) ever explains how it could affect anything. I know what Georg did and its arguably if him leaving will have any detrimental effect.

I'm guessing Vogel was senior management. No point in having too many chiefs and not many indians.

Rich Vogel and Gordon Walton were who BioWare hired to run BioWare Austin and make TOR.

http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/69468

Gordon "decided" to leave BioWare Austin a month or so before TOR was launched. Going off to make facebook games or something like that. So BioWare brought in Jeff Hickman, one of the senior people at Mythic who made WAR, to replace him. Both Gordon and Rich were part of the team that made SWG and JTL.

[Deleted]

Both Gordon and Rich were part of the team that made SWG and JTL.

If this is true im glad they've gone, how they get jobs again after that horrible mess they launched.

[Leonard McCoy]

Your over the top rhetoric doesn't change anything. I didn't take anything out of context, it's all there where everyone can read for themselves. I cited a source and copy/pasted the paragraph to make it easy to read. The bolded parts are bold claims that stood out to me. Opinions will vary but I don't believe they delivered on what they said in that paragraph. That isn't to say SWTOR is a bad game, it has some very enjoyable leveling. I'm not throwing anything in anyone's face.

As an aside; you might not like my opinion and that's fine. However, claiming I took something out of context when I provided the context and a link to the original work is uncalled for; in addition to be being an outright lie.

When you bold the text for emphasis, it tends to draw attention away from the entire article. I know why you did it even if you don't want to admit it. However reading the whole article yes I think they did deliver.

[Canderous1]

i never heard of the guy. i dont imagine his skillset is unique and that there is no one on the planet who can take over his roll and perhaps do it better.

[notorious98]

Sorry, thats all I read.

Yeah, it's obvious. You read into things however you want. I know that ignorance is bliss. You must be euphoric.

---------- Post added 2012-07-18 at 05:05 PM ----------

When you bold the text for emphasis, it tends to draw attention away from the entire article. I know why you did it even if you don't want to admit it. However reading the whole article yes I think they did deliver.

You may as well stop. Arguing with people who completely lack basic reading comprehension skills is pointless.

Insulting people will not win you any arguments. Next time you post please have something constructive to say instead of just degrading others. ~Rag

[Profyrion]

Its not like we have not seen this before guys. We went through the same process with WAR. First round you let the extras go, second round say good bye to one of the big guys, round three takes out bunches of the core group and pretty much puts the game in maintenance mode. Again, nothing new here.

While that's certainly possible... let's not get ahead of ourselves.