Offensive WoG

[Tokas]

Hi. I do not have Beta, only trying new things on PTR.
For me WoG with Glyph does more damage than Templar's Verdict with 3 HP.
Why? I thought this glyph is supposed to give us some up time on our targets that we can't reach (onyxia 2nd phase etc.).
(Ret gear, no gems, enchants, level 85)

[Mitak]

I was actually arguing that this may be possible as WoG is not mitigated by armor as opposed to TV. If WoG does at least equal damage to TV on 3 HP on higher tiers gear, this will make for some interesting PVP and PVE choices.

[Tokas]

I just noticed that WoG has set damage, I'm guessing O.o
When TV is based on weapons' damage, in last tier WoG might not be any good I guess.

[Kelesti]

I was actually arguing that this may be possible as WoG is not mitigated by armor as opposed to TV. If WoG does at least equal damage to TV on 3 HP on higher tiers gear, this will make for some interesting PVP and PVE choices.

Word of Glory doesn't scale with weapon damage, which always outpaces AP/SP scaling.

At level 90, it's pretty much a "Here Holy, have a solo/PvP finisher you can actually use", with a tiny bit of Ret's ranged utility (but not much).

[Tokas]

Word of Glory doesn't scale with weapon damage, which always outpaces AP/SP scaling.

At level 90, it's pretty much a "Here Holy, have a solo/PvP finisher you can actually use", with a tiny bit of Ret's ranged utility (but not much).

Just as I thought, too bad.

[Tangra]

Templar's Verdict also procs mastery, making it the clear winner even in crappy gear. But Harsh Word of Glory is still very nice, getting a few lucky Divine Purpose procs is very satisfying when trying to finish off a good kiter.

[Gamdwelf]

Its for shockadins more than for rets.

[Pasture]

Its for shockadins more than for rets.

Indeed, though ret will probably enjoy the versatility it brings for getting into position and out of melee range targets etc. The question is how it competes with the other major ret glyphs.

[ipoststuff]

Even before the latest 10% buff TV outdamaged wog. Wog doesnt proc mastery or seal of truth and relies more on having inq up.

Its nice to have a ranged option but i dont think it should be used too often.

[TheSpotter]

In PvP, it's great on the PTR. With warriors/DKs/pallies having 50%+ armor, it ends up being higher damage than TV. Plus it's great when you're being kited by a hunter or a mage, it has 40 yard-range! Couple it with Holy Prism (also 40 yd range) at 90, and we'll be looking at some decent ranged damage for rets to fall back on when we can't catch our target. Not to mention our beloved Exorcism and Judgment (30 yd range, but still).

[Reith]

In PvP, it's great on the PTR. With warriors/DKs/pallies having 50%+ armor, it ends up being higher damage than TV. Plus it's great when you're being kited by a hunter or a mage, it has 40 yard-range! Couple it with Holy Prism (also 40 yd range) at 90, and we'll be looking at some decent ranged damage for rets to fall back on when we can't catch our target. Not to mention our beloved Exorcism and Judgment (30 yd range, but still).

Judgment's a 40 yard range with the glove bonus. They put 10 yards on Judgment to replace the 5% CS bonus.

[Deleted]

Judgment's a 40 yard range with the glove bonus. They put 10 yards on Judgment to replace the 5% CS bonus.

And thank the fricking lord for this. Outrunning hunters is such a pain...

[Tangra]

Its for shockadins more than for rets.

It's pretty mandatory for Ret really, why would anyone not take a ranged finisher that does decent damage, considering none of the other glyphs are anything all that spectacular.

[solvexx]

dont really have a problem staying on a target at all anymore..
not all that good tbh

[Deleted]

It's pretty mandatory for Ret really, why would anyone not take a ranged finisher that does decent damage, considering none of the other glyphs are anything all that spectacular.

Becouse there is so many other viable glyphs aswell. Such as TV, DP, Protector of the Innocent, Binding Light, WoG, Double Jeopardy, etc.

Only pretty mandatory glyph for Ret is TV since 10% reduced damage for almost 100% up time is pro.

[Tangra]

dont really have a problem staying on a target at all anymore..
not all that good tbh

Interesting, have we become relatively harder to kite since defensive dispells have a 8 sec cooldown now, leaving us as one of the only melee who can spam a snare removing ability? It makes sense that specs like frost mages can't kite as well anymore since their snares can't be dispelled as quickly, so their snares have hopefully been nerfed a bit.

---------- Post added 2012-08-19 at 12:41 AM ----------

Becouse there is so many other viable glyphs aswell. Such as TV, DP, Protector of the Innocent, Binding Light, WoG, Double Jeopardy, etc.

Only pretty mandatory glyph for Ret is TV since 10% reduced damage for almost 100% up time is pro.

Most of those aren't really that exciting in PvP...but yeah TV is gonna be near mandatory I agree. To be honest, Glyph of Harsh words is just plain addictive, once you have used it for a while you just wanna punch a baby every time you can't smack someone pretty hard in PvP from 40 yards away.

[Deleted]

Most of those aren't really that exciting in PvP...but yeah TV is gonna be near mandatory I agree. To be honest, Glyph of Harsh words is just plain addictive, once you have used it for a while you just wanna punch a baby every time you can't smack someone pretty hard in PvP from 40 yards away.

That really depends on what kind of a role you play in your arena team, if you gonna be the glass cannon Rets have been in Cata the Glyph of Harsh Words is near mandatory. But if you gonna be the supportive 3rd DPS/offhealer, then there is much more attractive glyphs than the Harsh Words.

[IceStationZebra]

Currently, my level 85 WoG rotation out dps's the TVx5 rotation. I'm focused on level 85 so I can get through the content to 90. I'm using the default 85 you get.

What seemed to put the WoG over the top was to first use Hammer of the Righteous to apply and then maintain the Weakened Blows on the target. The rotation, yes rotation, is simply

Inquisition, Judgment, Word of Glory, crusader strike, Word of Glory, Judgment, Word of Glory, crusader strike <rinse and repeat>

On the target dummy I'm seeing around 17.5K for WoG vs 16.2K for the TV5 rotation.

Also during the Burst phase with Avenging Wrath/Hammer of Wrath I'm peaking at 21K with WoG vs 19K with TV5.

Why? I don't know. Just what I'm seeing in my workups.

I like the fact with the WoG rotation the character is always doing something. The TV5 you are always standing around waiting for stuff to come off cool down making it fell clunky.

[tuesday the paladin]

Currently, my level 85 WoG rotation out dps's the TVx5 rotation. I'm focused on level 85 so I can get through the content to 90. I'm using the default 85 you get.

What seemed to put the WoG over the top was to first use Hammer of the Righteous to apply and then maintain the Weakened Blows on the target. The rotation, yes rotation, is simply

Inquisition, Judgment, Word of Glory, crusader strike, Word of Glory, Judgment, Word of Glory, crusader strike <rinse and repeat>

On the target dummy I'm seeing around 17.5K for WoG vs 16.2K for the TV5 rotation.

Also during the Burst phase with Avenging Wrath/Hammer of Wrath I'm peaking at 21K with WoG vs 19K with TV5.

Why? I don't know. Just what I'm seeing in my workups.

I like the fact with the WoG rotation the character is always doing something. The TV5 you are always standing around waiting for stuff to come off cool down making it fell clunky.

In my crappy ret gear (378/384 with 378 weapon) wog was hitting for about 26k and TV+mastery was hitting for about 27k. With a good weapon TV and a high mastery level(I only had ~1.5k mastery) TV will be considerably stronger than wog. Pretty much all the theorycraft has shown TV to always be the right action to maximize damage.

[Krekko]

Currently, my level 85 WoG rotation out dps's the TVx5 rotation. I'm focused on level 85 so I can get through the content to 90. I'm using the default 85 you get.

What seemed to put the WoG over the top was to first use Hammer of the Righteous to apply and then maintain the Weakened Blows on the target. The rotation, yes rotation, is simply

Inquisition, Judgment, Word of Glory, crusader strike, Word of Glory, Judgment, Word of Glory, crusader strike <rinse and repeat>

On the target dummy I'm seeing around 17.5K for WoG vs 16.2K for the TV5 rotation.

Also during the Burst phase with Avenging Wrath/Hammer of Wrath I'm peaking at 21K with WoG vs 19K with TV5.

Why? I don't know. Just what I'm seeing in my workups.

I like the fact with the WoG rotation the character is always doing something. The TV5 you are always standing around waiting for stuff to come off cool down making it fell clunky.

Simply put, TV will do more damage than WoG both fully charged. You'll not want to use WoG over TV EXCEPT in situations where you're in range, or staying in range puts you in danger (i.e you should run out rather than stay the extra second or two in).

The WoG rotation should be no different than the TV 5 rotation, how do you find them different? Both should be treated identically, just replacing WoG for ToV in situations where you can not be in range of the target.

Additionally, it's a simple "You're doing it wrong" TV5 rotation because you're missing the main point of doing TV at 5 points, so it would seem.

The point is to keep your HP Generators off CD and never delay using them UNLESS you're at 5HP. When at 5HP you ONLY want to use TV, NOT A HP Generator, or else you just blew that CD and lost that point. HOWEVER IF you have FULLY powered TV (3 HP+) and a empty GCD don't waste it and stand around, use TV then. The point is to never delay the use of your HP Generators when you can get a point out of them, and never delay TV when you have no HP Generators available and or 5HP.

It should be the exact same (Within reason, TV has no CD, WoG has 1.5 second CD) rotation, and should flow the exact same and if you're doing it right, you won't be doing much standing around, as opposed to how you might be on live quite often.