Arcane Mage PvE Guide

[Deleted]

Ah true looked wrong logs or something, there is blast, barrages, scorches and missile casts for that wol log:
http://pastebin.com/J2njTYjC

[Deleted]

Hi !
I have a simple question but can't find the answer in the first few pages of this thread.

Should we use Arcane power glyph ( considering a "6 stack scroch weaving no destack rotation" ) ?
I guess answer is no but I'm not sure why...

[Deleted]

Hi !
I have a simple question but can't find the answer in the first few pages of this thread.

Should we use Arcane power glyph ( considering a "6 stack scroch weaving no destack rotation" ) ?
I guess answer is no but I'm not sure why...

Glyph is to be used where you'll obtain better uptime on the buff throughout the course of the fight. In most cases it's better to not use the glyph during progression as most boss enrages are 6 minutes or 9 minutes, in which case unglyphed pulls ahead.

[DeathDefier]

Ah true looked wrong logs or something, there is blast, barrages, scorches and missile casts for that wol log:
http://pastebin.com/J2njTYjC

Yup, that right there is pretty much a perfect rotation. During heroism he's able to get 2 AB's off before he uses missles/scorch because of the extra mana regen from all that haste, and then after that it's AB, AM/scorch repeat outside of Alter Time.

[Tobedeleted123]

I guess it will be changed soon, since it's not "natural" and designed way of dpsing as arcane. :/ Any confirmation on whether full mastery or full haste build is better?

[Deleted]

I guess it will be changed soon, since it's not "natural" and designed way of dpsing as arcane. :/ Any confirmation on whether full mastery or full haste build is better?

Possibly, but even if it is changed dropping stacks with Barrage pulls decent DPS so it won't be the end of the world, and as far as I see it the main way they'd change the rotation is potentially make Scorch affected by stacks which would probably only buff Arcane, so we'll see what they do.

At the moment it's completely preferential as no one knows for sure ^^

[Sloth11]

Possibly, but even if it is changed dropping stacks with Barrage pulls decent DPS so it won't be the end of the world, and as far as I see it the main way they'd change the rotation is potentially make Scorch affected by stacks which would probably only buff Arcane, so we'll see what they do.

At the moment it's completely preferential as no one knows for sure ^^

Are you still supposed to scorch if you go with a haste build?

[Deleted]

Are you still supposed to scorch if you go with a haste build?

Yes. As you benefit less from Mastery you don't have to hover at ~90% mana, but I wouldn't recommend going below 80%. I usually try and hover at around 85%, and during BL if you're using RoP you shouldn't have to worry about regen at all, but it depends on haste levels. At the moment I usually am able to line up when our raid uses BL with my Zerking (troll) so during this time I pretty much spam Blast as it's mana-neutral, ofc using Missiles as they proc so you don't waste them.

As you get more and more Haste (I believe DreamSpyre is at ~10K) you'll be able to use more and more Blasts before having to Scorch as the regen gets insane, but I think that Mastery might outweigh Haste as our gear gets better, but will have to see. There might be a point where Haste gets behind Mastery to the point where we can hit a threshold then stack Mastery, but time will tell

[DreamSpyre]

Yes. As you benefit less from Mastery you don't have to hover at ~90% mana, but I wouldn't recommend going below 80%. I usually try and hover at around 85%, and during BL if you're using RoP you shouldn't have to worry about regen at all, but it depends on haste levels. At the moment I usually am able to line up when our raid uses BL with my Zerking (troll) so during this time I pretty much spam Blast as it's mana-neutral, ofc using Missiles as they proc so you don't waste them.

As you get more and more Haste (I believe DreamSpyre is at ~10K) you'll be able to use more and more Blasts before having to Scorch as the regen gets insane, but I think that Mastery might outweigh Haste as our gear gets better, but will have to see. There might be a point where Haste gets behind Mastery to the point where we can hit a threshold then stack Mastery, but time will tell

The more I've been playing the Haste-centric build, the more I like it, but I already think I'm starting to hit that point or am already past a point where haste is being devalued. I've had some interesting results from switching to Mage Armor instead of Frost and not dropping below 85% mana, but it's just dummy and lfr testing, No more real raid content left for the week.

On the plus side, the haste focused Arcane rotation is easy to learn, easy to get down pat (If you're good at watching mana %'s) and is almost like an introductory way into learning how to manage the mastery version of Arcane, which I believe is a bit more difficult to pick up and perfect right away. The mastery build is less forgiving, but I'd guarantee it's going to be the higher dps version if played well.

[voltaa]

The more I've been playing the Haste-centric build, the more I like it, but I already think I'm starting to hit that point or am already past a point where haste is being devalued. I've had some interesting results from switching to Mage Armor instead of Frost and not dropping below 85% mana, but it's just dummy and lfr testing, No more real raid content left for the week.

On the plus side, the haste focused Arcane rotation is easy to learn, easy to get down pat (If you're good at watching mana %'s) and is almost like an introductory way into learning how to manage the mastery version of Arcane, which I believe is a bit more difficult to pick up and perfect right away. The mastery build is less forgiving, but I'd guarantee it's going to be the higher dps version if played well.

I definitely agree that the mastery build will pull ahead of the haste build in later tiers (or even late this tier) but the unforgiving part I think that will change, maybe even within the next tier. The more secondary stats we have to play around with, the more haste we will just naturally end up with when we have no more room to stack mastery, increasing our regen by large amounts essentially dumbing down lowering the skill cap on the spec making mistakes much more forgiving.

[Deleted]

I definitely agree that the mastery build will pull ahead of the haste build in later tiers (or even late this tier) but the unforgiving part I think that will change, maybe even within the next tier. The more secondary stats we have to play around with, the more haste we will just naturally end up with when we have no more room to stack mastery, increasing our regen by large amounts essentially dumbing down lowering the skill cap on the spec making mistakes much more forgiving.

This, essentially. I don't think it'll happen at the end of this tier - Blatty is pretty much full BiS already, yet he's only (I do say only compared to his Mastery) at 10% Haste unbuffed, but his Mastery is at 42% unbuffed as well which is pretty insane.

By the way, I managed to GCD cap my Blasts finally under Lust and Zerking - 0.98s casts at 29% Haste raid-buffed. The thing is, though, with my latency despite casts being 0.98s there's enough delay from latency not to actually delay casting so I might push for the next tick of NT (I think it comes at 29.14%) then just go all-out Mastery.
Alternative is to go Orc (I believe racial still affects Mirror Images? Not 100% sure) but we'll see.

[Jimm3]

Any rough idea about the ilvl breakpoint where haste build should be replaced with mastery build?

I m currently sitting at 491 and dont know how should i reforge for the best performance...

[Deleted]

Any rough idea about the ilvl breakpoint where haste build should be replaced with mastery build?

I m currently sitting at 491 and dont know how should i reforge for the best performance...

Won't be able to put an actual iLvl breakpoint to it, but I think if you're able to get the 15th tick of NT (20.84% Haste) raidbuffed it might be the time to start thinking about Mastery. SimC doesn't put Mastery ahead of haste until ~6400 which is 16th tick of NT though, so it's variable.

[voltaa]

Won't be able to put an actual iLvl breakpoint to it, but I think if you're able to get the 15th tick of NT (20.84% Haste) raidbuffed it might be the time to start thinking about Mastery. SimC doesn't put Mastery ahead of haste until ~6400 which is 16th tick of NT though, so it's variable.

Alternatively, you could go much lower on your haste and use frost armor to hit the breakpoint (as I do) I personally feel that because of how haste scaling works that this the better oprtion for reaching that breakpoint as it requires less actual stats

[Deleted]

Alternatively, you could go much lower on your haste and use frost armor to hit the breakpoint (as I do) I personally feel that because of how haste scaling works that this the better oprtion for reaching that breakpoint as it requires less actual stats

Mhm, that works too. Personally I'm sticking to Haste build for now (even if it's become suboptimal with GCD capping already) just because I prefer the playstyle. Will see how things go as gear gets better.

[Deleted]

Regarding rotation, what about cleaving fights?

Would it be better to stick to the no destack rotation (if you are using this one) to keep bombs at their highest damages

Or would it be better to destack using barrage to benefit from its cleaving mechanic?

[Deleted]

So, I have Imperial Silk Gloves and the LFR version of the Tier gloves, should I use the Tier Gloves?

[voltaa]

So, I have Imperial Silk Gloves and the LFR version of the Tier gloves, should I use the Tier Gloves?

If the lfr gloves will make a 2 or 4 set then use them for sure, otherwise use whichever have the better stats on them, gear questions like this are hard to answer with little to no background, since gear choices often depend on what gear or stats you already have

[Deleted]

Regarding rotation, what about cleaving fights?

Would it be better to stick to the no destack rotation (if you are using this one) to keep bombs at their highest damages

Or would it be better to destack using barrage to benefit from its cleaving mechanic?

Stacks don't affect Mage Bombs; only Blast/Missiles/Barrage/Explosion.

If it's two-three targets atm I'm cleaving using Barrage after all Missiles procs are used at 6 stacks.

[Deleted]

We're starting to come to a realization that you shouldn't use Arcane Barrage unless you're coming to a part of the fight where your stacks will fall off. Instead:

Arcane Blast-->Arcane Missiles/Scorch if no Missiles up-->Arcane Blast-->Arcane Missiles/Scorch-->etc. You won't drop under 80% mana.

I cant understand how i repeat this rotacion perfect, have 490 item level gear, and cant get 100k of dps in LFR, when whit fire i get 120k whiout problem